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Financial worries


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In addition to yesterday’s horror show on the pitch.

im a bit uneasy to a lot of rumours going about with our financial situation off it.

I personally have no idea what the situation is and hopefully it’s not as bad.

if it is dire then surely chairman, directors etc are as well to let fans know as soon as possible which would at least tell us the truth and let those that could afford too(in this current client I realise might not be many) help some way, or if every penny is a prisoner then every 50-50 ticket bought by fans is an extra 50 pence to the club.

Obviously on the field the higher up the league and making playoffs would help financially (though you wouldn’t think the way performances were last 2 games that manager and players would have realised this)

but certainly fans should be told the picture good or bad financially 

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And her communications were such a joy at the time. I remember watching one with her Caldwell talking about what great things we were going to achieve under him . I thought I wouldn’t let either of them run the local village fete. She left her position on the board and then reappeared I believe. The same tired old faces round the place. A culture of underachievement. What does Archie bring to the party? Everything about the club feels like amateur hour. I wouldn’t be at all surprised if there were financial troubles. And how many season tickets will be renewed watching football on that tatty field? All very depressing 

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To add to the misery I reckon we require a feel good factor around the Club to perhaps just stand still. I'm referring of course to matters outside of our control, effectively inflation and the general financial situation us fans may find ourselves in. Also the Club itself will be feeling a hit from inflation. For instance lower profits from income streams such as hospitality and the cost of fuel may be resulting in fewer visiting supporters.

I believe we have to be cautious and realise that all perceived negativity emanating around the Club won't necessarily have been avoidable. That's a far cry from saying that we should be in anyway satisfied with the way the Club is currently being run. I'd only hope tho' that any criticism of the stewardship is done purely on specifics such as the state of the pitch, player recruitment etc. 

 

Edited by lady-isobel-barnett
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5 hours ago, Kingleo said:

And her communications were such a joy at the time. I remember watching one with her Caldwell talking about what great things we were going to achieve under him . I thought I wouldn’t let either of them run the local village fete. She left her position on the board and then reappeared I believe. The same tired old faces round the place. A culture of underachievement. What does Archie bring to the party? Everything about the club feels like amateur hour. I wouldn’t be at all surprised if there were financial troubles. And how many season tickets will be renewed watching football on that tatty field? All very depressing 

One thing that we should remember is that a lot of the official statements from the club (and I'm sure that this applies to most clubs) are total b*llsh*t.

They think it's a good idea to feed supporters (and maybe others, who don't give a monkey's)  with fantasy-type stories, just to keep the club in the (occasional) headlines. Remember the following?: "PTFC will not be relegated because ICT don't have a compliant stadium?".... And here's just a few more "recent" examples: development of the city end of the ground (terracing demolished...... now a wasteland); north stand will always be only for Thistle fans; they will never be displaced just to accommodate the ersecheeks, (aye right, haha); there will be a dedicated PTFC  (McParland") training facility (see one set of "blueprints for this here: https://mcginlaybell.com/work/partick-thistle-training-ground/)..... There are others, I'm sure. Please feel free to add to the list.

All total b*llsh*t.

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My concern is that with the focus on Club ownership (fan owned or not), the key issues of financial stewardship and investment have been under-reported. 

Do we really want to keep repairing an increasingly decrepit Firhill, or should we step back and consider something more radical?   That might include groundsharing or a new, modern and easily maintained stadium at Firhill or elsewhere. 

These need to be discussed openly and honestly so that the best form of ownership is chosen to address the long term plans for the Club, and to attract the neccessary investment.  That means much more transparency that has been evident in the past few years.

Everything about the Club is third rate, and it needs a complete clear-out.  That will not happen with fan ownership where sentiment is likely to trump business nous.  Perhaps the best option would be a new owner willing to invest and with a strong (but not controlling) fan presence on the Board. 

I had hoped that Colin Weir might have set up a Firhill Trust, retained family ownership, had it professionally managed to retain its value, and the income given to the Club.  Unfortunately Weir chose Low to manage his PTFC affairs.

There has to be a big discussion.  Now.

 

 

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Just as well Chien Lee didn't come in and asset strip us.

We will be playing in Scotstoun at ten years at this rate.  Any word on the bing and the Main Stand getting returned to us? Thought not. There's yer transparency.  Just like the training ground and all the other bullshit before it. It might not even be money troubles sending us out, the place will do will to get a safety cert at this rate. Big problems with the JH roof now I read to add to the mess that is the bing and the Main Stand.

Fans have the club they deserve. Rudderless.  Jobs for the boys on and off the park.  Give it a 2-3 years and we will be the 4th force in the city permanently. Haughey investing heavily in infrastructure whilst Weir gave cash to Archie to waste on duds and then left us with Britton and Low. 

We must also have the most embarrassing looking club shop of any professional club I've seen. Ayr United's is massive compared to ours. Everything about us just screams unprofessional and low standards.  

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2 hours ago, eljaggo said:

Everything about the Club is third rate, and it needs a complete clear-out.  That will not happen with fan ownership where sentiment is likely to trump business nous.  Perhaps the best option would be a new owner willing to invest and with a strong (but not controlling) fan presence on the Board.

 

 

Huge problem at the club. Fear of outsiders, misplaced anxiety that someone would only want to buy Partick Thistle to flatten the place and put us out of business.  The way I see we are heading to a slow death by a thousand cuts anyway.

The club needs more outsiders with a fresh perspective and some ruthlessness. Not a place where a fan or an ex player have a job for life and accommodating passengers just because they're perceived as our own. 

That ship has sailed though and we're ******. Run like a glorified bowling club committee now.

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18 minutes ago, avie-man said:

Just as well Chien Lee didn't come in and asset strip us.

We will be playing in Scotstoun at ten years at this rate.  Any word on the bing and the Main Stand getting returned to us? Thought not. There's yer transparency.  Just like the training ground and all the other bullshit before it. It might not even be money troubles sending us out, the place will do will to get a safety cert at this rate. Big problems with the JH roof now I read to add to the mess that is the bing and the Main Stand.

Fans have the club they deserve. Rudderless.  Jobs for the boys on and off the park.  Give it a 2-3 years and we will be the 4th force in the city permanently. Haughey investing heavily in infrastructure whilst Weir gave cash to Archie to waste on duds and then left us with Britton and Low. 

We must also have the most embarrassing looking club shop of any professional club I've seen. Ayr United's is massive compared to ours. Everything about us just screams unprofessional and low standards.  

Agree with all your points apart from “ fans have the club they deserve “

Can you elaborate?

 

 

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6 minutes ago, jlsarmy said:

Agree with all your points apart from “ fans have the club they deserve “

Can you elaborate?

 

 

When Beattie and the old board returned stating financial concerns  there was an organized effort to discredit them and force them out (This was when a fan ownership model was first muted). 
It now appears he may have been correct looking at the last 2 sets of books and tying them to 3BC books. 
We have lost nearly £800k (less 3BC payment in of £560k) over 2 years, we decided to not relay the park, we’ve neglected the main stand roof, whilst living outside our means when operational costs were minimal during COVID. 
Now this is coming home to roost, I’m wondering if the reluctance to allow due diligence was to gamble on promotion to hide the financial issues.

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Many years ago I had family friends in Wiesbaden, who then played in the 5th or 6th tier in Germany. One of the family was involved in the club and I went to quite a few games and saw things running behind the scenes. I remember being amazed at the professionalism of everything. The dedication of the players, the faculties. Everything was run really well. But there was no room for sentiment. If a decision had to be made it was made with the only thought being whether it was right for the club. We might not be the only club run in an amateur fashion in this country. But the jobs for the boys culture and general air of total apathy at Thistle seems particularly obvious. I live 25  miles from Dunfermline and couldn’t think of anything I’d rather do less than spending time and cash to watch that shower tomorrow night 

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12 minutes ago, jlsarmy said:

Agree with all your points apart from “ fans have the club they deserve “

Can you elaborate?

 

 

Pretty obvious I would have thought. The majority of fans wanted fan ownership, ironically only once the prospect of foreign owners appeared, such that the hunger was so evident beforehand and there was hatchet job stories in the media regarding it all suddenly beginning to appear, seem to remember one on the back of the Herald about the ground being sold, funnily enough.

So we get what we deserve. No leadership, no transparency, skint, no direction, no interest in our facilities and infrastructure. We had a taste of this before and a sign how bad it would be with the Jags Trust, fans like Cowan on the board, the people working in and around the club but fans get caught up in the emotion and get taken in with ridiculous scare stories about asset strippers. For me it was easy to see coming that it would result in us remaining in the shitter, but the majority of fans wanted this and bought the bullshit people of like Low and that charlatan Paul Goodwin so really only have themselves to blame.

By the way we don't have a scouting system either and as far as I know nothing related to analytics or sports science. There's nothing in the club directory on the website that suggests otherwise anyway. 

Praise the Lord we ran off Johnny Foreigner. 

 

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49 minutes ago, avie-man said:

Pretty obvious I would have thought. The majority of fans wanted fan ownership, ironically only once the prospect of foreign owners appeared, such that the hunger was so evident beforehand and there was hatchet job stories in the media regarding it all suddenly beginning to appear, seem to remember one on the back of the Herald about the ground being sold, funnily enough.

So we get what we deserve. No leadership, no transparency, skint, no direction, no interest in our facilities and infrastructure. We had a taste of this before and a sign how bad it would be with the Jags Trust, fans like Cowan on the board, the people working in and around the club but fans get caught up in the emotion and get taken in with ridiculous scare stories about asset strippers. For me it was easy to see coming that it would result in us remaining in the shitter, but the majority of fans wanted this and bought the bullshit people of like Low and that charlatan Paul Goodwin so really only have themselves to blame.

By the way we don't have a scouting system either and as far as I know nothing related to analytics or sports science. There's nothing in the club directory on the website that suggests otherwise anyway. 

Praise the Lord we ran off Johnny Foreigner. 

 

Can't agree about the majority of fans wanting fan ownership, the last figure i remember reading was less than 500 had signed up for the TJF and the meeting poorly attended as well.

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18 minutes ago, Auld Jag said:

Can't agree about the majority of fans wanting fan ownership, the last figure i remember reading was less than 500 had signed up for the TJF and the meeting poorly attended as well.

Got to agree with AJ , I was never in agreement with fan ownership, personally speaking I don’t think our fan base is big enough to make it work.

Like most clubs of our size , we’ve had to rely over the years of business type people to help get us out of Financial Problems for example Miller Reid , Jim Oliver , David Beattie  etc whether that be loans  or unfortunately selling parts of the ground to make ends meet.

Just my opinion, fan ownership would never work at our level  and it’s doubtful if it’s a sustainable business model .

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Been a sinking ship for years. Unfortunately the fans don't seem to care (and who can blame them). Most other clubs would have beaten a path to the Chairman's door and demanded answers. Our fans are so apathetic that the "high-heed-yins" probably don't even know about the level of discontent at the club.

I have said it for years (and been ridiculed for saying it), but we are a cultureless, rudderless club. Our only scrap of culture is "at least we're no eh Old Furm." And people were all too happy to see Gerry Britton and Co. take the reins "cause they care abooot Thistle." What we need are people with fresh ideas, and an objective sense of reality (without nepotism and nostalgia). I want some suit to swagger up to Firhill, knock on the door, and say "my perception of your club is you are a cultureless embarrassment who win nothing and seem proud of it. I'm here to change that." Not likely to happen unfortunately. But I do think it is time that fans wake up a bit and realise something isn't right. 

I mean, c'mon. We are a diddy Championship club, hemorrhaging money, yet we have TWO ASSISTANT-MANGERS! One of them being so emasculated he slinked back to the club in a lower position than he left. I mean wake the f- up people. This isn't a football club. It's a bowling club.

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3 hours ago, avie-man said:

We will be playing in Scotstoun at ten years at this rate.  Any word on the bing and the Main Stand getting returned to us? Thought not.

Yes as it happens …..they will be transferred to the club after the share transfer for tax reasons 

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1 hour ago, jlsarmy said:

Got to agree with AJ , I was never in agreement with fan ownership, personally speaking I don’t think our fan base is big enough to make it work.

Like most clubs of our size , we’ve had to rely over the years of business type people to help get us out of Financial Problems for example Miller Reid , Jim Oliver , David Beattie  etc whether that be loans  or unfortunately selling parts of the ground to make ends meet.

Just my opinion, fan ownership would never work at our level  and it’s doubtful if it’s a sustainable business model .

That’s all dandy , now if you could just provide an actual alternative that would be peachy 

it’s easy to decry fan ownership but the reality is no one else wants to buy the club 

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