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19 minutes ago, Lenziejag said:

I have my doubts whether any of this will make any difference to the outcome. Just because it’s a bad deal doesn’t mean it won’t happen. 
(Just look at Brexit;Trump; Boris and soon to be Liz Truss.) Anyway, For TJF sake, I hope they have a game plan and not just throwing out these statements and hoping to get some sympathy from their supporters. That’s going to achieve nothing. 
I have said it before and I will say it again, I don’t think the majority of fans are interested in the politics.Just want to go and watch a winning team.

Why didn’t you join TJF? Strength in numbers 

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1 hour ago, sandy said:

Why didn’t you join TJF? Strength in numbers 

I am not interested in being involved in fan ownership. I am one of those fans that just wants to go to the games and watch a winning team. 

 

2 hours ago, Lambies Lost Doo said:

I was one of those supporters not interested but it's now obvious there is a good number of people out there who want to get involved and I signed up.  We currently have board members  unelected and not even paying to be there.  They got their position through associated of a Euromillions winner.  That's it.

That’s life.

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3 hours ago, Lenziejag said:

I have my doubts whether any of this will make any difference to the outcome. Just because it’s a bad deal doesn’t mean it won’t happen. 
(Just look at Brexit;Trump; Boris and soon to be Liz Truss.) Anyway, For TJF sake, I hope they have a game plan and not just throwing out these statements and hoping to get some sympathy from their supporters. That’s going to achieve nothing. 
I have said it before and I will say it again, I don’t think the majority of fans are interested in the politics.Just want to go and watch a winning team.

All of the above most probably happened as too many people were passive. That's fair enough but when it goes t**s up don't be surprised.  Also if you read the responses from TJF it's pretty clear ( unless your not reading the output ) that they are working very hard to provide viable options. 

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10 hours ago, denismcquadeno.eleven said:

Well, we might not have long to wait to find out if you’re right in your last two sentences. Tomorrow night’s match has to be paid for and if most Thistle fans pay up to attend this match as normal, it perhaps indicates you’re right.

If people are not prepared to stand up for something they think is right or against something they know is wrong, no-one can be surprised when the bad thing happens or those people doing it prevail.

It’s clear the ‘other’ side have been watching this situation very carefully and weighing up any dissent. That’s why the comment was made recently that the naysayers “only amounted to around twenty people.” The TJF survey results released today revealed it’s a lot more than that. But, writing a reply on a survey is the easy bit-actually doing something like sacrificing going to a match you would normally attend  or protesting openly is harder.

If dissent is neither visible nor audible, and it is not obvious to the people you’re opposing, the strength of opposition feeling, how can that be expected to have any effect at all? I know what the PTFC board will be hoping for, tomorrow night, but will they get it?

I asked the question a couple of weeks ago what that would look like for this game, bearing in mind that the 2 group games had attendances that barely reached 1,500. And if there was a lower turnout than that how would you determine how much was due to ridiculous entry price, cost of living etc.

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1 hour ago, denismcquadeno.eleven said:

Well, you’ve said you’re not bothered about the matter of fan ownership so it can only be a question of curiosity for you and others who share your view-to which you’re entitled, by the way.

But, to me and others the issue is of crucial importance.

Then, there’s also the OTHER issue of HOW the management of our football club has treated its fans. We all know the details which I won’t repeat, but they’ve  hardly covered themselves in glory with the WAY THEY’VE BEHAVED over recent times. 

Perhaps you can separate that off and just concentrate on the team. and feel exactly the same about PTFC. I can’t, and I won’t. If people are treated badly, it doesn’t matter how good the product or services they’re selling or promoting, you tend to want nothing to do with them-if only to avoid getting ‘stung’ again. THAT’S how I’ll feel, until and unless this present management is replaced.

But, the bottom line IMO is, until we supporters stand up to this management in ‘some tangible way’, they will be unmoved and carry on with what their doing, Why should they change course? They might even be emboldened, if we do nothing. Just hoping they’ll be nice and play fair because we’re the supporters, we’ve formed an 800-strong group, we’ve spent shedloads of money on the club  and we deserve it etc clearly won’t cut it. It didn’t previously. And, if we’ve learned anything, the last few months testifies to this, loud and clear.

We either stand up, or we just take it. One way or the other-speaking personally-I won’t be doing THE LATTER!

I’m extremely conflicted about this, as I agre in theory with any protest, but don’t want to damage the club that we all love. However,  for this one particular game I his fixture will with a heavy heart boycott this particular fixture, but unless more provocation from the board takes place I’m not prepared at this moment to totally do the same to all fixtures: I’ll happily boy cot the Diddy Cup or the SPFL Trust Cup basically because I think it a waste of time anyway. Particularly, as we are entering a period when finances are going to be tight for everyone.

I do however, believe that there is something fundamentally wrong in the State of Denmark, which if not resolved will do considerable reputational and actual harm to the state of our club! 

Edited by stillresigned
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My wife's birthday clashes with the EGM.  After a lengthy conversation, and despite a careful explanation of the importance of the EGM, my wife inexplicably would rather celebrate her birthday at home rather than in Maryhill.  Please send my apologies to the meeting.

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6 hours ago, denismcquadeno.eleven said:

Well, you’ve said you’re not bothered about the matter of fan ownership so it can only be a question of curiosity for you and others who share your view-to which you’re entitled, by the way.

But, to me and others the issue is of crucial importance.

Then, there’s also the OTHER issue of HOW the management of our football club has treated its fans. We all know the details which I won’t repeat, but they’ve  hardly covered themselves in glory with the WAY THEY’VE BEHAVED over recent times. 

Perhaps you can separate that off and just concentrate on the team. and feel exactly the same about PTFC. I can’t, and I won’t. If people are treated badly, it doesn’t matter how good the product or services they’re selling or promoting, you tend to want nothing to do with them-if only to avoid getting ‘stung’ again. THAT’S how I’ll feel, until and unless this present management is replaced.

But, the bottom line IMO is, until we supporters stand up to this management in ‘some tangible way’, they will be unmoved and carry on with what their doing, Why should they change course? They might even be emboldened, if we do nothing. Just hoping they’ll be nice and play fair because we’re the supporters, we’ve formed an 800-strong group, we’ve spent shedloads of money on the club  and we deserve it etc clearly won’t cut it. It didn’t previously. And, if we’ve learned anything, the last few months testifies to this, loud and clear.

We either stand up, or we just take it. One way or the other-speaking personally-I won’t be doing THE LATTER!

I definitely am curious as to how TJF are going to proceed. 

I agree that the board behaved terribly in their dealings with TJF and I can separate that from the team. 

Let me make something clear. When I turn up to Firhill I am not there supporting the board. I am there supporting the team. 

So from my point of view whatever action TJF decide on this week, it shouldn’t in any way hurt the team. 

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I have faith that TJF will listen to the survey results and the strength of other feedback they will have received. 

I do think we require a different set of tactics now that the PTFC Trust has been outed for what it is.

Perhaps some collaboration with what remains of the Jags Trust membership would be a useful option to consider.

But I feel the ST holders are key to the whole situation as passive beneficiaries; if they were to opt OUT of being associated with the PTFC Trust and the Trust numbers fall below the membership of TJF, that would shift the power dynamics. 

Edited by sandy
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7 minutes ago, sandy said:

But I feel the ST holders are key to the whole situation as passive beneficiaries; if they were to opt OUT of being associated with the PTFC Trust and the Trust numbers fall below the membership of TJF, that would shift the power dynamics. 

But even now it's only an illusion (delusion?) that PTF Trust represent qualifying ST holders. 

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5 minutes ago, lady-isobel-barnett said:

But even now it's only an illusion (delusion?) that PTF Trust represent qualifying ST holders. 

Absolutely agree m’lady. But they’ll claim they do. And that was enough to satisfy 3BC

Edited by sandy
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1 hour ago, sandy said:

I have faith that TJF will listen to the survey results and the strength of other feedback they will have received. 

I do think we require a different set of tactics now that the PTFC Trust has been outed for what it is.

Perhaps some collaboration with what remains of the Jags Trust membership would be a useful option to consider.

But I feel the ST holders are key to the whole situation as passive beneficiaries; if they were to opt OUT of being associated with the PTFC Trust and the Trust numbers fall below the membership of TJF, that would shift the power dynamics. 

I don't believe that it would change the power dynamics at all. It took Beattie & others to use their shareholding to oust Low on her previous term on the club board.

It may be better for season ticket holders who are also TJF members to use their leverage as shareholders to change the PTFC Trust board ( if allowable  -if not why not?), and as majority shareholders then seek to alter the PTFC board.  But the PTFC board have created the ridiculous situation that the majority shareholding body only have one seat on the board!  Not sure of the legal position on the makeup of the PTFC board, but that is where the real battle lies. If season ticket holders opt out of the PTFC Trust, it will not radically alter their position that they still represent the remaining season ticket holders - and the TJF are a dwindling body in the PTFC Trust. Their position relies of the lack of comment from remaining season ticket holders who  haven't expressed any  interest on the issue. 

The PTFC Trust have said they want to recruit non-season ticket holders, and this again is a battlefield TJF can compete in. Clever tactics are needed, and the PTFC Trust and club board will use the lack of comment from the large number of fans who aren't interested in the politics, but just want to support the football team.  The early recruitment of non- season ticket holders  is a big plus for TJF, but I have no doubt that the club board will dig in regardless of fan and media hostility. The  recruitment of non-shareholder fans to the PTFC Trust is now a major litmus test of their "credibility ".

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Interesting ideas. 

I’m not sure changing the PTFC Trust Board members is feasible, as they weren’t elected. Also that would take time. And the model of ‘fan ownership’ they are operating is not recognised as a good example. 

Im also not sure that the fans even have one place on the Club Board secured. 

I think the PTFC Trust need to be challenged on whether their representation of fans is real or imagined. Passive participation by default is not active membership. At present, the famous five only  speak for themselves - and they are making decisions on their own ‘on behalf’ of fans, assuming that they know what the fans actually want. 

Not in my name. 

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13 hours ago, eljaggo said:

My wife's birthday clashes with the EGM.  After a lengthy conversation, and despite a careful explanation of the importance of the EGM, my wife inexplicably would rather celebrate her birthday at home rather than in Maryhill.  Please send my apologies to the meeting.

That. Is. A. Dis-grace.

Best wishes to Mrs eljaggo!

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17 hours ago, eljaggo said:

My wife's birthday clashes with the EGM.  After a lengthy conversation, and despite a careful explanation of the importance of the EGM, my wife inexplicably would rather celebrate her birthday at home rather than in Maryhill.  Please send my apologies to the meeting.

If you buy her a membership for her birthday you can bring her to the EGM 

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The PTFC Trust response is laughable.

 

'on behalf of around 300 of their members who they also believe to be beneficiaries of the PTFC Trust' - are they not believing the season ticket holders are season ticket holders? 

Disappointed that 'one fan organisation should choose to send a lawyers letter to another'. One fan organisation that has been open, transparent, held elections, have fans paying to be members compared to another that has been silent for years, have beneficiaries by default, no democratic way of electing Trustees and no response to the real questions....

Surprised - not really.

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3 hours ago, lady-isobel-barnett said:

Not the last by any means but by far the most serious riot in Glasgow.

 

riot act.jpg

George Square in 1919. The only time that the government sent tanks onto the streets of Britain to intimidate the population.  For those interested I recommend Maggie Craig's book 'When the Clyde Ran Red' a fascinating retelling of Red Clydeside 

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27 minutes ago, Rid Skwerr said:

Chief Constable Gerald King-Espana?     Any relation to Gerald "King of Spain" Britton?

What is it about cops and crazy names?

Anyone remember Glasgow detective Fletcher Catchpole or Scotland Yard's Jack Slipper back in the sixties/seventies?

Or Glasgow Chief Constable Percy Sillitoe. He is credited for breaking Glasgow's infamous razor gangs. He became head of MI5 eventually. 

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