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Big Dan
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12 minutes ago, Third Lanark said:

Archie regularly went to the English leagues to look at players- most were pretty awful or a waste of money because they were constantly injured such as Seabourbe and Dumbaya.

 The few successes such as Abdul Osman had spent time playing in Scottish leagues.  The only exception to an excellent player from the English leagues was Kakay who was outstanding in terms of both attitude and ability and mmm hadn’t played in Scotland and he wasn’t signed by Archie

Unfortunately we couldn’t keep ahold of Kakay.  I hate to think how much money we squandered on Archie’s signings from down south

He wasn’t using data analysis to find these signings though they came via agents and an extremely limited network of scouts. 

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Archie signed some very good players in his time as Manager - Tomas Cerny, Callum Booth, Freddie Frans, Higgy and Lyle Taylor among others were part of the best Thistle team I have seen since Bertie Auld was manager. Osman, Adam Barton and Dumbuya were excellent too until their final season when they were a real disappointment.

I would have thought Data Analysis and Sports Science should be an essential part of modern football but I seem to recall Ian McColl saying he wasn't that interested. However I always thought that Ryan Edwards and Myles Storey would rate highly under data analysis because they ran about a lot...maybe sometimes it's better to rely on judgement of footballing abilities.

This season we have looked easily the best team in the Division and also quite awful...sometimes in the same game. After just about every game I have watched in the last season and a half, I have posted that we lack a competent defensive midfielder...I'm happy to give the current management team the chance to improve the team but I'm surprised they haven't addressed this long before now. A decent central defender is also essential...it's not a strong League this season and it's a good chance to go up.

Edited by Winter of '63
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My experience with data analytics is that, across any industry, there are many who see it as an attempt to replace the human decision-making process instead of to inform it.

And it comes down to a matter of ego, a lack of understanding the analytical process, or both.

I’d love for the Club to find a cost-conscious way of using analytics going forward.  Then let’s track the players we sign/retain and see whether the management preferred them, the analytics preferred them, or both.

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13 hours ago, Winter of '63 said:

Archie signed some very good players in his time as Manager - Tomas Cerny, Callum Booth, Freddie Frans, Higgy and Lyle Taylor among others were part of the best Thistle team I have seen since Bertie Auld was manager. Osman, Adam Barton and Dumbuya were excellent too until their final season when they were a real disappointment.

I would have thought Data Analysis and Sports Science should be an essential part of modern football but I seem to recall Ian McColl saying he wasn't that interested. However I always thought that Ryan Edwards and Myles Storey would rate highly under data analysis because they ran about a lot...maybe sometimes it's better to rely on judgement of footballing abilities.

This season we have looked easily the best team in the Division and also quite awful...sometimes in the same game. After just about every game I have watched in the last season and a half, I have posted that we lack a competent defensive midfielder...I'm happy to give the current management team the chance to improve the team but I'm surprised they haven't addressed this long before now. A decent central defender is also essential...it's not a strong League this season and it's a good chance to go up.

Dumbaya played most of his games for the jags in his first 6 months where he was very good and barely played the following 2 and a half years- so hardly value for money

as excellent as Barton was his first season he was as appalling the second season.

 

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13 hours ago, ChiThistle said:

My experience with data analytics is that, across any industry, there are many who see it as an attempt to replace the human decision-making process instead of to inform it.

And it comes down to a matter of ego, a lack of understanding the analytical process, or both.

I’d love for the Club to find a cost-conscious way of using analytics going forward.  Then let’s track the players we sign/retain and see whether the management preferred them, the analytics preferred them, or both.

We should be using data analysis to identify lists of suitable targets that then can be looked at more closely before any attempts to recruit anyone. Its teh ideal way to spread your net when looking for players, we seem to be relying solely on McCall, archie and scallys knowledge of players which must restrict where we are looking initially

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When Weston was signed it made sense as he could cover act as a backup striker and a backup winger who would have been on relatively low wages. 

As soon as Mullen was signed, and Fitzpatrick got fit enough then it became really difficult to see where he would get game time.

I could see Weston going to another club in the championship or league 1 and doing well. He's clearly quick enough and can finish just needs to bulk up a bit.  

I suspect now he has left Mullen will stay. Don't think Weston going will free up a lot of wages and probably at best means getting someone else on loan. 

I see Killie recalled Jack Sanders from his loan at Cove. He looked decent when we played Cove and would improve our options are centre back.

If we're going to see any permanent new signings, it's probably down to getting Akinola or Smith off the books.

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Regardless of opinions about McCall, whether pro or con, I find it difficult to see how he could be either criticised or praised over the loan signing of Tony Weston. His leaving will not clear the way for anything more than maybe a replacement loan signing from a club who'll underwrite most of the cost.

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30 minutes ago, jaggy said:

Oli Shaw on loan mentioned on Facebook. Can’t see that happening considering we play 1 up front

Not always.  Dowds hasn’t always been prolific.  While Graham is the starter if he plays as badly as he did against Queens Park then he should realise he’s not undroppable, plus he’s getting older and not forgetting the run from January to April 2022 where barely any of our strikers scored.

Mccall should be feeling pressure to ensure we make the playoffs and he may see Shaw as a serious upgrade on our other signings.  I’d be delighted if he joined us

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29 minutes ago, Third Lanark said:

Dowds hasn’t always been prolific.

There's no shortage of differences of opinion on here about a multitude of topics. Many of those topics involve widely varying assessments of our current bunch of players. Nevertheless I'm gonna stick my neck out here and say I don't believe there's a single Jags fan alive today that would disagree with you, TL.

:D

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2 hours ago, jaggy said:

Weston to Edinburgh I heard. Also we might have a centre back coming in. Got this from a usually reliable source. A name was mentioned for the CB which surprised me so I doubt if it’s true

IMC apparently tried to get Shaughnessy at the beginning of the season 

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On 1/6/2023 at 7:53 PM, Third Lanark said:

Not always.  Dowds hasn’t always been prolific.  While Graham is the starter if he plays as badly as he did against Queens Park then he should realise he’s not undroppable, plus he’s getting older and not forgetting the run from January to April 2022 where barely any of our strikers scored.

Mccall should be feeling pressure to ensure we make the playoffs and he may see Shaw as a serious upgrade on our other signings.  I’d be delighted if he joined us

So would I (be delighted)

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McCall generally has a good eye for talent. The English accent gave Archie a stonner, they played a few games then fell into obscurity. The pool of players we have should pump this league, and there is the rub. McCall or any of the other assistant pigeons, can motivate, organise nor inspire what we have to greater heights. as for "the best since Bertie". That in itself is a mouthful and highlights just how low our expectations have become. Out with the old firm and of course Queens, everyone else are also rans, who we should be beating. As a Jag is it beyond comprehension to be consistently competing in Europe. Stand back, and the smelling salts for those who thought the Archie years contributed anything positive. Raise the bar FFS. Mon the jags.   

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On 1/11/2023 at 11:44 PM, sabbath said:

McCall generally has a good eye for talent. The English accent gave Archie a stonner, they played a few games then fell into obscurity. The pool of players we have should pump this league, and there is the rub. McCall or any of the other assistant pigeons, can motivate, organise nor inspire what we have to greater heights. as for "the best since Bertie". That in itself is a mouthful and highlights just how low our expectations have become. Out with the old firm and of course Queens, everyone else are also rans, who we should be beating. As a Jag is it beyond comprehension to be consistently competing in Europe. Stand back, and the smelling salts for those who thought the Archie years contributed anything positive. Raise the bar FFS. Mon the jags.   

I agree with the underpinning sentiment that we should be 'raising the bar'.  Although a supporter of IMC I also agree that he and his two assistants have perhaps not got the best out of the playing squad we have. I am though, unlike others , prepared to give him the benefit of the doubt that progress this season has been hampered by the injury situation losing Graham, Holt, Docherty and Tiffoney who are arguably our four best players.

For reasons already stated I would retain IMC as a Director of Football to take advantage of his abilities to 'spot a player'!  I would  appoint a new younger manager as Head Coach for the first team and release Archibald and Scally.

As far as our aspirations are concerned I am not sure about competing regularly in Europe but do consider that we should aim to be an established SPL team competing for a top 6 place. Once established at that level then yes let's go for Europe.

One important point we need to remember is that all the so called established SPLClubs like Motherwell, St Johnstone and to a lesser degree Dundee, Kilmarnock, Ross County and Hearts, all of whom have been in the Championship in recent times, have or have had a benefactor prepared to put money into recruitment. We have never had that and there is no indication we will have in the near future.

In short we have to match our aspirations to available resources. This means, short of finding a financial benefactor, we are looking at slow organic growth rather than quick 'funded' growth.

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Early days but this window appears very quiet in terms of transfers. As yet no club appears to be doing a "McGregor". Even Ross County!

I'm still of the opinion that we can considerably improve the squad and remain neutral in terms of spend. But that depends on clubs being interested in players we want to move on. But of course we're just as dependent on movement in the transfer market, primarily from clubs in the premiership.

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