Lenziejag Posted April 10 Report Share Posted April 10 1 hour ago, Jordanhill Jag said: For starters the Board are agreed at a secret Meeting with TJF Board / Trustees without any justification as to why they simply re-elect the same people There is no clear blue water between the Majority Shareholder & the Club Board - a Majority Shareholder holds Boards to Account - that doesn't happen - in fact by involving itself in things like recruitment & interviews of Key Staff Members - it becomes part of the Management of the Club & makes it impossible to act as detached organisation The Board in turn do the bidding of TJF- in order to keep there place on the Board - even allowing a TJF "special Director" despite two directly elected Board Reps - if that cosy arrangement is not a clear sign as to who calls the shots at the CIub - have no idea what is ? Hence no one really knows who is running the Club & No one is accountable on any level I wasn’t asking you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted April 10 Report Share Posted April 10 3 hours ago, Third Lanark said: See the amount of interviews I’ve seen with football coaches/managers etc where you get the word “I” of in particular the word “listen” like your a kid. Brian Graham uses this “listen” phrase but the worst offender I watched was Lee Bullen. The guy used to use it about 5 or 6 times per interview when he was manager of Ayr- unbelievable! For my money Cammy Bell is the most prolific user of the "listen" word. Once even managed to use it twice in the one sentence. Rebel that he is, Michael Stewart himself no past stranger to starting a sentence with a "listen", appears lately to have broken the mould. He now prefers to kick off his sentences with the word "look". 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted April 10 Report Share Posted April 10 Another thread ruined. 4 hours ago, Third Lanark said: Obviously we have no idea how Iain Baraclough will actually do or exactly what the role will entice. But one thing i have noticed and liked - he comes across as nice, polite and maybe most importantly as someone without a huge ego. See the amount of interviews I’ve seen with football coaches/managers etc where you get the word “I” of in particular the word “listen” like your a kid. Brian Graham uses this “listen” phrase but the worst offender I watched was Lee Bullen. The guy used to use it about 5 or 6 times per interview when he was manager of Ayr- unbelievable! Good to see none of that from Ian nor the word “I” but instead the word “we”. Actually refreshing to hear that from a football person and comes across as someone wishing to talk to you rather than talk down to you. I know it’s only a minor point but it is good to see Listen, I first noticed that annoying habit in Archie's interviews. It was so frequent that I stopped actually trying to understand what he was saying, and instead just waited for the next "Listen." It was, like, mental. Like! don't get me started on "like"!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodstock Jag Posted April 10 Report Share Posted April 10 4 hours ago, Jordanhill Jag said: For starters the Board are agreed at a secret Meeting with TJF Board / Trustees without any justification as to why they simply re-elect the same people No they aren't! Two members of the board (Allan McGraw and Alistair Gray) are directly elected by an eligible electorate of over 2,500 beneficiaries. If you don't like them, simply "be a season ticket holder" or "be a TJF member" or "be a Jags Trust member" and vote for someone else ahead of the next AGM. One member of the board (Donald McClymont) has an automatic right to be on the board by virtue of his Class C shareholding. It would be pretty pointless to have a "secret meeting" about him wouldn't it? One member of the board (Stuart Callison) was selected by a democratically elected fans board, currently representing over 1,800 Thistle fans. That board who fans can replace by becoming TJF members from just £1 per month, and voting in TJF elections and/or standing as TJF candidates. And of course, TJF ran a consultation which the entire fanbase was allowed to take part in on whether that arrangement should continue or be superseded by something else. More on that to follow very soon. One member of the Club Board (Elliot Gilmour) was recommended for appointment by the Club Board in late December 2023. He notably was not simply appointed out-of-turn but presented for appointment by the shareholders at an AGM. The Trustees decided to vote in favour of his appointment after the Club Board set out its rationale for appointing him. There was nothing "secretive" about it. Two members of the Club Board (Richard Beastall and Caroline Mackie) were first appointed before TJF was even formally connected with the PTFC Trust. They have been twice re-appointed by the shareholders, including, as I distinctly recall, by you personally at the most recent AGM. The final Club Board member, Grant Stupart, is someone who was appointed shortly after TJF and the Trustees publicly called for a strengthening of the Club Board's commercial expertise and capacity, and following the process set-out in the Club-Trust Agreement for Trustee approval of new Directors. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dl1971 Posted April 11 Report Share Posted April 11 Sometimes being on holiday and having limited access to wifi is a blessing.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lenziejag Posted April 11 Report Share Posted April 11 12 hours ago, Jordanhill Jag said: If we slipped into debt & cant fund it - them we have no option but to sell parts of the Club to whomever ( Fan owned or not ) Fan Ownership guarantees nothing - trading in the Black does - not sure why people don't get that You know what ? I have no idea what you want for PTFC. A club where the ownership revolves every few seasons, never making a profit but sometimes plunging towards financial ruin as under 3BC, which, by the way is where I think all your questions about where did the money go should be directed. Or do you want one that on the face of it is taking a gradual approach to get us back on an even keel with the help of some investment from a well off Thistle fan and some of his network. You did say when the club is stable off the park it is successful on the park. But it seems you wanted immediate success 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derby Jag Posted April 11 Report Share Posted April 11 13 hours ago, Third Lanark said: Obviously we have no idea how Iain Baraclough will actually do or exactly what the role will entice. But one thing i have noticed and liked - he comes across as nice, polite and maybe most importantly as someone without a huge ego. See the amount of interviews I’ve seen with football coaches/managers etc where you get the word “I” of in particular the word “listen” like your a kid. Brian Graham uses this “listen” phrase but the worst offender I watched was Lee Bullen. The guy used to use it about 5 or 6 times per interview when he was manager of Ayr- unbelievable! Good to see none of that from Ian nor the word “I” but instead the word “we”. Actually refreshing to hear that from a football person and comes across as someone wishing to talk to you rather than talk down to you. I know it’s only a minor point but it is good to see Do you know I had the exact same thought. He came across on the jagzone interview as a pleasant, humble guy which I thought was quite refreshing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Third Lanark Posted April 11 Report Share Posted April 11 8 minutes ago, Derby Jag said: Do you know I had the exact same thought. He came across on the jagzone interview as a pleasant, humble guy which I thought was quite refreshing. Very refreshing DJ and very different to so many in the world of football where the interviews turn out to be about them solely Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeanieD Posted April 11 Report Share Posted April 11 15 hours ago, Jordanhill Jag said: As for "the sizeable majority" Please do not misquote either deliberately or through ignorance. 15 hours ago, Jordanhill Jag said: So lets not rewrite History that Fan Ownership was the what Fans wanted Nowhere do I say this - please do not misinterpret either deliberately or through ignorance. Thanking you in advance 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambies Lost Doo Posted April 11 Author Report Share Posted April 11 So now new managers.... Graham/Wilson Naismith McFadden McCann All the above I'd be OK with. No idea if the bottom 3 would be interested. Not Lennon (baggage & spends half his time at Celtic fan events) Yogi Hughes. Good manager but time has been. Kettlewell. Leaving Motherwell seemed a bit odd. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Third Lanark Posted April 11 Report Share Posted April 11 6 minutes ago, Lambies Lost Doo said: So now new managers.... Graham/Wilson Naismith McFadden McCann All the above I'd be OK with. No idea if the bottom 3 would be interested. Not Lennon (baggage & spends half his time at Celtic fan events) Yogi Hughes. Good manager but time has been. Kettlewell. Leaving Motherwell seemed a bit odd. out of your list McCann has a coaching post at Rangers and Neil Lennon is at Dunfermline. Yogi Hughes bit of a dinosaur to say the least. Don’t think he has worked since relegating Dunfermline a couple of years ago and Raith fans blamed him for relegating them. Kettlewell was talking about taking a year off. Seemed to fall out with Motherwell fans and didn’t like being criticised. Unfortunately if your going to be a football manager you are going to be criticised a lot of the time. Although I don’t doubt most will have submitted applications (possibly not McCann and Lennon) and the board and SD will look at the applications. Would be disappointed if we ended up with any on that list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted April 11 Report Share Posted April 11 Mind we're talking Head Coaches and not managers. There's likely to be a plethora of ex managers out there who were good coaches but failed in the managerial aspects of the job. Conversely we all know the characters who were no doubt fine behind the scene but were not the greatest when it came to tactics, coaching etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordanhill Jag Posted April 11 Report Share Posted April 11 3 hours ago, lady-isobel-barnett said: Mind we're talking Head Coaches and not managers. There's likely to be a plethora of ex managers out there who were good coaches but failed in the managerial aspects of the job. Conversely we all know the characters who were no doubt fine behind the scene but were not the greatest when it came to tactics, coaching etc. This is the bit Im not understanding is the Head Coach bit - a Coach doesn't have direct responsibility - a Manager does So who is in charge ? Who makes the Final Call on signings or even decides them A Director of Football ( which in essence is Director of Recruitment) sources potential signings - Manager decides who to Sign Ive Still not figured out how a SD works to be honest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted April 11 Report Share Posted April 11 3 minutes ago, Jordanhill Jag said: This is the bit Im not understanding is the Head Coach bit - a Coach doesn't have direct responsibility - a Manager does So who is in charge ? Who makes the Final Call on signings or even decides them A Director of Football ( which in essence is Director of Recruitment) sources potential signings - Manager decides who to Sign Ive Still not figured out how a SD works to be honest Maybe (or definitely) the only time I've agreed fully with a post by this .... other poster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordanhill Jag Posted April 11 Report Share Posted April 11 16 hours ago, Woodstock Jag said: No they aren't! Two members of the board (Allan McGraw and Alistair Gray) are directly elected by an eligible electorate of over 2,500 beneficiaries. If you don't like them, simply "be a season ticket holder" or "be a TJF member" or "be a Jags Trust member" and vote for someone else ahead of the next AGM. One member of the board (Donald McClymont) has an automatic right to be on the board by virtue of his Class C shareholding. It would be pretty pointless to have a "secret meeting" about him wouldn't it? One member of the board (Stuart Callison) was selected by a democratically elected fans board, currently representing over 1,800 Thistle fans. That board who fans can replace by becoming TJF members from just £1 per month, and voting in TJF elections and/or standing as TJF candidates. And of course, TJF ran a consultation which the entire fanbase was allowed to take part in on whether that arrangement should continue or be superseded by something else. More on that to follow very soon. One member of the Club Board (Elliot Gilmour) was recommended for appointment by the Club Board in late December 2023. He notably was not simply appointed out-of-turn but presented for appointment by the shareholders at an AGM. The Trustees decided to vote in favour of his appointment after the Club Board set out its rationale for appointing him. There was nothing "secretive" about it. Two members of the Club Board (Richard Beastall and Caroline Mackie) were first appointed before TJF was even formally connected with the PTFC Trust. They have been twice re-appointed by the shareholders, including, as I distinctly recall, by you personally at the most recent AGM. The final Club Board member, Grant Stupart, is someone who was appointed shortly after TJF and the Trustees publicly called for a strengthening of the Club Board's commercial expertise and capacity, and following the process set-out in the Club-Trust Agreement for Trustee approval of new Directors. Maybe just Maybe TJF should review its Club Trust Agreement - stop taking anything to do with the running of the Club - decide on Directors each Year on Performance and what they have delivered on individually This joined at the hip stuff isn't working - either run the Club and take responsibility or don't If you don't trust of rate Directors Replace them As for the Join TJF for £1 maybe thats part of the problem - a pound - complete nonsense Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordanhill Jag Posted April 11 Report Share Posted April 11 2 minutes ago, Jaggernaut said: Maybe (or definitely) the only time I've agreed fully with a post by this .... other poster. Even a Broken Clock is Right once a day 😂 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a f kincaid Posted April 11 Report Share Posted April 11 Surely you mean twice a day? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambies Lost Doo Posted April 11 Author Report Share Posted April 11 I assumed Manager/Coach has final say but Sporting Director helps with recruitment process Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeanieD Posted April 11 Report Share Posted April 11 23 hours ago, Lenziejag said: In what way do you think it has been less successful than hoped and in what way do you not think it has been transparent and accountable? LJ The general malaise surrounding the club, its structure and its current position would seem to suggest that there is some unhappiness amongst some fans as regards the club in general far less the team on the park. Similarly, I believe that not everyone feels engaged or feel no more engaged than they were under previous regimes or ownership models. I may be in a minority of 1 and others might feel that things are going swimmingly and they, like me, are perfectly entitled to their view. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thornwoodjag Posted April 11 Report Share Posted April 11 9 hours ago, Lambies Lost Doo said: So now new managers.... Graham/Wilson Naismith McFadden McCann All the above I'd be OK with. No idea if the bottom 3 would be interested. Not Lennon (baggage & spends half his time at Celtic fan events) Yogi Hughes. Good manager but time has been. Kettlewell. Leaving Motherwell seemed a bit odd. Can add Robbie Nielson to the list now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
partickthedog Posted April 11 Report Share Posted April 11 23 minutes ago, thornwoodjag said: Can add Robbie Nielson to the list now Is the Naismith on the list the ex Hearts manager Steven Naismith or the Stenhousemuir manager Gary Naysmith? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordanhill Jag Posted April 11 Report Share Posted April 11 3 hours ago, a f kincaid said: Surely you mean twice a day? Not if its a 24 Hour Clock 😊 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lenziejag Posted April 12 Report Share Posted April 12 12 hours ago, JeanieD said: LJ The general malaise surrounding the club, its structure and its current position would seem to suggest that there is some unhappiness amongst some fans as regards the club in general far less the team on the park. Similarly, I believe that not everyone feels engaged or feel no more engaged than they were under previous regimes or ownership models. I may be in a minority of 1 and others might feel that things are going swimmingly and they, like me, are perfectly entitled to their view. I don’t feel like there is a general malaise around the club and I would suggest that the increase in attendances over the last 2 seasons support that. I think, though, that we are in a period of transition and it still remains to be seen whether fan ownership will work for us. But it is what Colin Weir wanted, Jackie Low hijacked and now the trusts are trying to salvage. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty Posted April 12 Report Share Posted April 12 Wouldn't it be ironic if Ian Baraclough found a 1st team coach he could work with and who is currently out of work. One who had a not too bad record in his previous job, a few seasons experience in the championship including play-offs, nearly got his team promoted and was familiar with the Thistle set-up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted April 12 Report Share Posted April 12 52 minutes ago, scotty said: Wouldn't it be ironic if Ian Baraclough found a 1st team coach he could work with and who is currently out of work. One who had a not too bad record in his previous job, a few seasons experience in the championship including play-offs, nearly got his team promoted and was familiar with the Thistle set-up. If there was somebody like that then we'd need to spend a lot of money to lure him from his present club! And pay him more! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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