Winter of '63 Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 I'm pleased we gave it a real go but we just lacked the quality to create clear chances. Play was at the far end when it was stopped for the VAR check...I had no idea which side the penalty was for and having now seen the clip remain bemused. In a non-VAR game that would gone completely unnoticed. St Mirren grew in confidence for a spell after the goal but disappointing by Redding & Clarke for the second goal. They otherwise looked a physically strong but pretty ordinary side. Good luck on them on getting a bye to the final as the SFA will surely crack down on the Ugly Sisters who once again disgraced themselves and our city and will face a ban from the cup for the next five seasons. Stanway was excellent and his goal was top class. If that is the standard of the lower regions in the Premier League, I will upgrade my hopes for the playoffs 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 3 hours ago, Aliballibee said: I thought deflected hand balls off a body part weren't given? Bounces up off his foot? You're right, but it doesn't matter: VAR was used exactly as I said it would be used: to benefit the Premiership team. Just the same as in the Dingwall play-off match. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 2 hours ago, dl1971 said: The performance gives me home that at the very least we can match the premier team in any play off. If we are in one. Yes, but we cannot hope to match VAR. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exiledjag Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 3 hours ago, sb1876 said: Got to agree with this, VAR and the comedy team that manage it are absolutely terrible, no one apart from the VAR team (and maybe St Mirren fans) thought it was a pen. The St Mirren players didn't think it was a penalty! Not one Saints player appealed for a penalty and especially the two players at that side of the penalty box facing Crawford. In fact the replay shows the referee who had a clear view of the incident, turning away to follow play back up towards the Saints goal. Therefore it was the VAR official who intervened. Who was tonight's VAR official. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exiledjag Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 As a matter of interest can anyone tell me how much prize money the losing quarter- finalist receive. I have googled this and tried the SFA website without success! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 28 minutes ago, exiledjag said: As a matter of interest can anyone tell me how much prize money the losing quarter- finalist receive. I have googled this and tried the SFA website without success! And while we're at it, how much of a bonus did the VAR official get as his part of the deal? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 From the highlights on YT, it looked like we had some very good spells. A very unfortunate slip-up by Reading, and as somebody mentioned, Clarke will be disappointed at his failure to stop the resulting near-post shot. As usual, we can now "Focus on the league!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delurker Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 8 hours ago, exiledjag said: The St Mirren players didn't think it was a penalty! Not one Saints player appealed for a penalty and especially the two players at that side of the penalty box facing Crawford. In fact the replay shows the referee who had a clear view of the incident, turning away to follow play back up towards the Saints goal. Therefore it was the VAR official who intervened. Who was tonight's VAR official. Somebody Aitken, I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fawlty Towers Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 For the taking of the penalty was Gogic inside the box before the taker struck the ball, not the best angle on the highlights but would not shock me if he was and the officials did not bother? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eljaggo Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 It's time to ditch VAR. It's time to make the referees take full responsibility. It's time to accept that mistakes will be made, and that over the piece these mistakes will not favour any one team. It's time to take a long view about the game and let it flow without the tedious, lengthy VAR interruptions. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fawlty Towers Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laukat Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 Game was ruined by that VAR decision. There is no part of it that makes sense. What really worried me was that VAR must have insisted to the ref that he had to stop the game rather than wait for a break in play. By doing that they have already pretty much made the ref's decision for him. If he goes to the monitor and doesn't give a penalty then how does he do that without making his colleagues in the VAR room look like fools? How does he restart when we were in an attacking position without disadvantaging us? Also the images VAR chooses to show the ref are the ones that look to support the award, VAR was very much arguing for an award not asking the ref to review. I was behind the goal and could see in real time that it didn't cross anyone's mind that it was a penalty. Conversely watched this and thought it was a stonewaller. How is this not worse than Crawford's and not worth the referee going to the monitor? There were many other handball incidents during the game and it just appeared as though the ref was guessing every time. If VAR is going to work they need to let the crowd listen to the VAR conversation as per rugby We played well. Ashcroft was superb and generally we didn't have a failure. Only thing that didn't work was Fitzy in the number 10 slot, he just seemed to run into traffic and doesn't really have the eye for the pass that's needed there. We missed Chalmers and in general were a bit light on bodies. Throwing on Turner and Diack was really likely to create much more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 1 hour ago, Fawlty Towers said: For the taking of the penalty was Gogic inside the box before the taker struck the ball, not the best angle on the highlights but would not shock me if he was and the officials did not bother? I noticed that too. Why wasn't VAR used to get the penalty re-taken? I almost wrote: "They don't know what they are doing," but in fact I really believe that the opposite is true; they know exactly what they are doing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 It was telling that when the two St Mirren players interviewed on Sportscene after the match were asked what the differences between Scottish football and English championship, they both laughed and said "VAR"! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 (edited) I'm not defending VAR but surely the two biggest culprits last night were the two officials that thought that was a penalty? VAR is only a machine, it's not responsible for incompetence. It's easy to say that had there been no VAR there would've been no penalty. But had there been competent decision making there's no way there would've been a penalty either. Independent of last night but on the same subject there's no VAR (and no sustained call for it) in the English Championship. I reckon everybody will agree , bar perhaps a Mr Doncaster, that the Scottish top tier in no way compares in stature and certainly finance. We may need VAR for Euro ties but for the day to day stuff it's not necessary. Apart from showing up poor refereeing, but that's a different matter. Besides in my way of thinking if we're going to use a machine then something definitive like goal-line technology should come first. Edited March 9 by lady-isobel-barnett Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 17 minutes ago, lady-isobel-barnett said: I'm not defending VAR but surely the two biggest culprits last night were the two officials that thought that was a penalty? VAR is only a machine, it's not responsible for incompetence. It's easy to say that had there been no VAR there would've been no penalty. But had there been competent decision making there's no way there would've been a penalty either. Independent of last night but on the same subject there's no VAR (and no sustained call for it) in the English Championship. I reckon everybody will agree , bar perhaps a Mr Doncaster, that the Scottish top tier in no way compares in stature and certainly finance. We may need VAR for Euro ties but for the day to day stuff it's not necessary. Apart from showing up poor refereeing, but that's a different matter. Besides in my way of thinking if we're going to use a machine then something definitive like goal-line technology should come first. Not according to Wikipedia. The video assistant referee (VAR) is a match official in association football who assists the referee by reviewing decisions using video footage and providing advice to the referee based on those reviews. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thistle_1876 Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 10 hours ago, exiledjag said: As a matter of interest can anyone tell me how much prize money the losing quarter- finalist receive. I have googled this and tried the SFA website without success! £110k and £24k for it being on TV so £134k in total. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 To be fair, M'Lady, I think that everybody on here who criticises VAR are in fact criticising the officials and their--let's be circumspect and say "idiosyncratic" --interpretation of what the machine objectively shows. The way it is being used clearly exposes occurrences of selective attention, inattention, inconsistent decisions, and biased interpretation. The system is not fit for purpose, and it should be dropped. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeanieD Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 (edited) The VAR farce should also be seen in the context of the fiasco that was the Aston Villa Newcastle English Cup tie from a few weeks back. Referee and other officials there lost the place seemingly because there was no VAR being used - it was almost funny to watch them meltdown in front of the cameras. As regards yesterday it was surprising that St Mirren players and fans didn’t make a song and dance about it when it happened, usually any shot blocked in the area results in some honest or more likely cheating appeal for hand ball. Edited March 9 by JeanieD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Dastardly Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 VAR should be used like other sports for a dispute between the teams. The captain should have a number of appeals they can make if they think the ref made an obvious error. Using it to make a decision on something nobody on the pitch considered was wrong. If the Saints captain had asked for it then fine, but intervention when no player,ref,or assistant saw anything is not right. That said, I still think Saints would have won. They looked fairly comfortable and I’m sure could have upped their game if needed 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laukat Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 1 hour ago, lady-isobel-barnett said: I'm not defending VAR but surely the two biggest culprits last night were the two officials that thought that was a penalty? VAR is only a machine, it's not responsible for incompetence. It's easy to say that had there been no VAR there would've been no penalty. But had there been competent decision making there's no way there would've been a penalty either. Independent of last night but on the same subject there's no VAR (and no sustained call for it) in the English Championship. I reckon everybody will agree , bar perhaps a Mr Doncaster, that the Scottish top tier in no way compares in stature and certainly finance. We may need VAR for Euro ties but for the day to day stuff it's not necessary. Apart from showing up poor refereeing, but that's a different matter. Besides in my way of thinking if we're going to use a machine then something definitive like goal-line technology should come first. Absolutely agree. Would love to hear the conversation between the VAR official advising the ref to go to the monitor. I suspect in our case the ref must have been told "stop the game, there is a clear case for a penalty" which puts the ref in an entirely different frame of mind from "when there is a stop in play it might be worth you checking the monitor just to confirm your on-field decision" Also the VAR official chooses what images to show the ref. They are clearly showing the ref the images that best support their case. Compare that to rugby whereby the ref will ask to see the replay and stop and start it as he see's fit and then go to their VAR to confirm what he's seeing. Last night the ref took a very short time at the monitor so he was only ever viewing what the VAR official had presented Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weebaw1 Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 13 hours ago, Jaggernaut said: And while we're at it, how much of a bonus did the VAR official get as his part of the deal? Same as the bluenosed linesman who chalked off Bobby Houston’s winner in 1979. I’ve experienced pain but it’s worth it! If they’re not corrupt they’re just plain incompetent. Which might be worse. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert's Ghost Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 1 minute ago, Weebaw1 said: If they’re not corrupt they’re just plain incompetent. Which might be worse. Corrupt is worse. Incompetent errors are unbiased. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a f kincaid Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 Watching on TV, did anyone notice as the players trooped off down the tunnel at half-time, St Mirren's big striker Nlundulu appeared to gesture with his head towards Alex Rae. Rae looked surprised to say the least. He turned round to see him continue down the tunnel by which time it looked as if a team-mate put his arm round Nlundulu as if to say "leave it". What was that all about? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaggy Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 8 hours ago, delurker said: Somebody Aitken, I think. If it was Greg Aitken I’m sure he was the VAR man at Dingwall. Just saying 🙄 Another very dodgy penalty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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