Lenziejag2 Posted October 24, 2012 Report Share Posted October 24, 2012 Many members of this forum will have noted that, over the weekend of 19/20/21 October 2012, the overall attendance at SPL and SFL matches (exclusive of the match at Ibrox) amounted to 54,444. The attendance at the Rangers v Queens Park match on the Saturday was 49,463. This begs the question of what on earth 40 out of the 42 clubs were up to, such that they attracted barely more spectators than were at the Govan match? A goodly number of the diddy clubs in the SPL need to slash admission prices, cut programme costs, reduce charges for refreshments - and, above all, make major cuts in over-inflated wage bills. But it doesn't stop with the SPL! PTFC is the most successful club outside the SPL, and yet we only pulled in a crowd of 2,545 for a hum-dinger of a match against Airdrie United! Where is everybody? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twinny Posted October 24, 2012 Report Share Posted October 24, 2012 Many members of this forum will have noted that, over the weekend of 19/20/21 October 2012, the overall attendance at SPL and SFL matches (exclusive of the match at Ibrox) amounted to 54,444. The attendance at the Rangers v Queens Park match on the Saturday was 49,463. This begs the question of what on earth 40 out of the 42 clubs were up to, such that they attracted barely more spectators than were at the Govan match? A goodly number of the diddy clubs in the SPL need to slash admission prices, cut programme costs, reduce charges for refreshments - and, above all, make major cuts in over-inflated wage bills. But it doesn't stop with the SPL! PTFC is the most successful club outside the SPL, and yet we only pulled in a crowd of 2,545 for a hum-dinger of a match against Airdrie United! Where is everybody? Half prices and you won't double the crowd. Sadly this is the way the boards of every club in the country look at it, and probably the way they should. I'd say there should be gimmicks (like all tickets a fiver or pay what you want) run throughout the season that encourage fans to come to particular games without pissing off season ticket holders. Was it Mansfield who did the pay what you want thing a couple of years back? I'm sure they made much more from that game than normal, some people paying just a penny to get in and one guy paid £50 and almost sold out their ground. I reckon we should try a "We Are Partick Thistle, We Pay What We Want" day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted October 24, 2012 Report Share Posted October 24, 2012 Many members of this forum will have noted that, over the weekend of 19/20/21 October 2012, the overall attendance at SPL and SFL matches (exclusive of the match at Ibrox) amounted to 54,444. The attendance at the Rangers v Queens Park match on the Saturday was 49,463. This begs the question of what on earth 40 out of the 42 clubs were up to, such that they attracted barely more spectators than were at the Govan match? A goodly number of the diddy clubs in the SPL need to slash admission prices, cut programme costs, reduce charges for refreshments - and, above all, make major cuts in over-inflated wage bills. But it doesn't stop with the SPL! PTFC is the most successful club outside the SPL, and yet we only pulled in a crowd of 2,545 for a hum-dinger of a match against Airdrie United! Where is everybody? the $64K question, and there's many a thread gone by on the subject of our attendances. Myself, I'm far from convinced it's all about pricing. Take off ST holders, under 16s, concessions and away support and I don't think there could be much more than 1000 Jags fans paying £17 on Saturday. If that was reduced say to £12 for a one off game that number would need to rise by over 400. Factor in bus/train fares, something to eat, a couple of pints perhaps and the average adult cost of going to Firhill rises to maybe £30-£35. I don't think reducing the overall cost to £25-£30 would result in huge increases. Too many people, for no doubt the right reasons, just can't afford/justify the cost of attending. That said I'm all in favour of a reduced entry for unemployed tho' I realise finding a system that wouldn't be open to misuse might be difficult. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bunny Posted October 24, 2012 Report Share Posted October 24, 2012 A valid topic for discussion but please don't bring Old Furm crowds into it. Sure they are/were successful and that would always attract big crowds but let's not kid on that (as an example) 50,000 are going to Ibrox purely to support a football team. A lot of them are going for reasons that are nothing to do with football. Everyone knows the reasons why it's hard to build up support: the only thing I can think of (apart from winning things) is if the media here gave more support to the smaller clubs. I know all the stuff about the OF audience size but the other clubs combined make up a decent audience and rarely get a look in ... especially on the telly which is where it would be most effective. Even just wee stories but regularly about different clubs, to let folk know they exist. On its own it wouldn't do much I suppose but every wee bit helps - and for a lot of clubs even a small percentage increase in attendance can be a big help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brodieboy Posted October 24, 2012 Report Share Posted October 24, 2012 (edited) I've often thought long and hard about this. I don't think home supports fluctuate much. I stand to be corrected, but I reckon its more the decline in away supports which has affected attendances and overall atmosphere. How many teams bring a decent away support outwith Aberdeen, Celtic and Rangers now? Not many unless other teams are on a decent run. How about charging away fans £5 from now on? Surely that would boost the number considerably. Put it this way, we are on a top, top run at the moment, playing some excellent football. But we've had a few away games recently and I bet some are still not sure whether to travel to Falkirk because of the cost of entry/travel etc. Now if it was £5, I bet the majority (not minority) of our home support would go... Edited October 24, 2012 by brodieboy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted October 24, 2012 Report Share Posted October 24, 2012 I've often thought long and hard about this. I don't think home supports fluctuate much. I stand to be corrected, but I reckon its more the decline in away supports which has affected attendances and overall atmosphere. How many teams bring a decent away support outwith Aberdeen, Celtic and Rangers now? Not many unless other teams are on a decent run. How about charging away fans £5 from now on? Surely that would boost the number considerably. Put it this way, we are on a top, top run at the moment, playing some excellent football. But we've had a few away games recently and I bet some are still not sure whether to travel to Falkirk because of the cost of entry/travel etc. Now if it was £5, I bet the majority (not minority) of our home support would go... Reciprocal deals with clubs of similar size (Morton, Falkirk, Pars) could be a goer. Then again we bring a fairly large away support so we might be the only winners. As long as it was well advertised I don't think us reducing away fans entry price would be too much of a risk. Whether other clubs would be too keen on reciprocating would be another matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
potty trained Posted October 24, 2012 Report Share Posted October 24, 2012 (edited) PTFC is the most successful club outside the SPL, Dont want to take this off topic... but how in the name of Tolkien's toaster do you come to this conclusion? Edited October 24, 2012 by potty trained Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lenziejag Posted October 24, 2012 Report Share Posted October 24, 2012 I see that the price for Falkirk has been set at £18. It is an odd turn of phrase. What do they normally charge ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muscat Jag Posted October 24, 2012 Report Share Posted October 24, 2012 Think the chaps refering to this precise moment in time, ie we are top of div 1. Don't think he means historically. Could be wrong though! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G SUS Posted October 24, 2012 Report Share Posted October 24, 2012 Away fans don't want to come to Firhill right now, because they know they will 99% get a doing. We've all missed games away to the league leaders cos of apathy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty Posted October 24, 2012 Report Share Posted October 24, 2012 This begs the question of what on earth 40 out of the 42 clubs were up to, such that they attracted barely more spectators than were at the Govan match? NOT spending years promoting a bigoted, paranoid attitude towards a certain rival football club in order to foster the deep held feeling that if your own club gets into trouble then it is a catholic/protestant conspiracy which your fans must rally against at all costs! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted October 24, 2012 Report Share Posted October 24, 2012 Reciprocal deals with clubs of similar size (Morton, Falkirk, Pars) could be a goer. Then again we bring a fairly large away support so we might be the only winners. As long as it was well advertised I don't think us reducing away fans entry price would be too much of a risk. Whether other clubs would be too keen on reciprocating would be another matter. It wasn't such a problem when gates were split between both teams. The change to the home team keeping all the gate money was of course done to widen the gap between the OF and all the rest, and to a lesser extent smaller clubs like the sheep shaggers, the tarts etc also gaining. Maybe if even 50% of the money from away fans went back to the visiting team, then more people who don't go because they don't want to give money to the opposition would go (if that makes sense). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norgethistle Posted October 24, 2012 Report Share Posted October 24, 2012 Lets remember Rangers have the siege mentality just now and are trying to prove a point, they couldn't 1/3 fill their ground for a cup game last year against Dundee Utd, that will fade especially when they start to really struggle away from home in the winter months on hard parks with poor floodlighting etc. they have sold themselves on bigotry and undortunatly in the west coast of Scotland that works. I would rather have 3000 real football fans than 45000 bigots at firhill every week, just wonder whether they paid the VAT on the gate money? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simoncordiner Posted October 24, 2012 Report Share Posted October 24, 2012 You don't follow your football team because it's value for money entertainment. You follow your football team because you love them. Most people would pay anything for love. But you can't make someone fall in love with something they're not interested in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
potty trained Posted October 24, 2012 Report Share Posted October 24, 2012 How many have fallen out of love with going to firhill? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeanieD Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 How many have fallen out of love with going to firhill? Good point - the match day experience for those of us of a certain vintage is certainly inferior to that of old - for a multitude of reasons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 Good point - the match day experience for those of us of a certain vintage is certainly inferior to that of old - for a multitude of reasons. The analogy with being married is getting stronger and stronger...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uberteeb Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 We should not be letting away fans into Firhill for less than home fans pay, this surely can’t be a serious suggestion? There is some merit in maybe giving the away team a percentage of the away gate but looking at the big picture the teams that will benefit most from that are the old firm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 We should not be letting away fans into Firhill for less than home fans pay, this surely can’t be a serious suggestion? There is some merit in maybe giving the away team a percentage of the away gate but looking at the big picture the teams that will benefit most from that are the old firm. You're right, it would actually be ludicrous if away fans got in cheaper than home fans. But in the crazy world of Scottish football, why not! Unfortunately, unless there was a return to a straight 50/50 split for all gates, the OF are always going to benefit most (even with a constant 50/50, they would get half of the greatest sum). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrD Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 (edited) We should not be letting away fans into Firhill for less than home fans pay, this surely can’t be a serious suggestion? Thats what immediately came to mind for me as well. However, if they were to offer that price for away supporters that were season ticket holders of their respective teams, and that kinda deal was accross the board for all div 1 clubs then that would add an incentive for people to buy season tickets AND go to more away games... To the poster that said about unemployed concessions i support that as well, and yes they would be open to being abused but then so can all other modes of concessions too. For instance i could sign up for a college course, get a matric card, withdraw the next day, but hold onto the card to get reduced season ticket cost. Despite the openness to abuse, i dont think its an objection to having a concessions policy, since less money is better than no money at all!! Edited October 25, 2012 by mrD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrD Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 You're right, it would actually be ludicrous if away fans got in cheaper than home fans. But in the crazy world of Scottish football, why not! Unfortunately, unless there was a return to a straight 50/50 split for all gates, the OF are always going to benefit most (even with a constant 50/50, they would get half of the greatest sum). 50/50 gates will never come back, and to be fair why should they? at the end of the day, whatever may be the reasons for it, the OF generate the crowds to fill their own stadiums why should they give 50% of that over to clubs who can't contribute a significant crowd level. Also, the problem with that thinking is it still concieves of a scottish football that is dependant upon the subsidy of the old firm. Thats not a healthy model IMO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackpool Jags Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 What about fixed prices for each division with no exceptions for bigger or smaller clubs: eg SPL £20, SFL 1 £17, SFL 2 £14 and SFL3 £12? Not saying I support that or otherwise, just a moot point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrD Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 What about fixed prices for each division with no exceptions for bigger or smaller clubs: eg SPL £20, SFL 1 £17, SFL 2 £14 and SFL3 £12? Not saying I support that or otherwise, just a moot point. That would give clubs no power at all to alter demand to get bigger crowds, so for clubs where making lower prices an incentive to crowd levels they would not be able to have that lever. Also, bigger clubs instead of raising prices to bring effective demand down to a level to fill their stadiums and thus maximise their revenue would simply make their stadiums bigger to accomodate bigger crowds, thus preserving their gap vis a vis smaller clubs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackpool Jags Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 That would give clubs no power at all to alter demand to get bigger crowds, so for clubs where making lower prices an incentive to crowd levels they would not be able to have that lever. Also, bigger clubs instead of raising prices to bring effective demand down to a level to fill their stadiums and thus maximise their revenue would simply make their stadiums bigger to accomodate bigger crowds, thus preserving their gap vis a vis smaller clubs. Fair points, and like I said, only a moot point. So what about capping prices on the cheapest seats: ie saying that you must make X number of seats available to home and away fans for a maximum £20, £17, £14 and £12, but cheaper is fine. The rationale being that a successful club on, say, a promotion / European chase will get bigger crowds so more £20 / £17s coming in than shite clubs, but fans are guaranteed a maximum amount they'll need to pay to get in at away grounds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottymagoo Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 I quite like the idea of offering away fans a discount. The cost of an away day is the major factor that puts me off of travelling to see Thistle. £15-£18 for a ticket plus £10-£15 travel and then something to eat adds up to an expensive day out to watch First Division football. Home fans may begrudge it but if more teams start doing it then it would work for everyone and if it generates more revenue for the club then we’d only be cutting off our noses to spite our face if we opposed it. At the end of the day we have good reason to give Thisle our money, we want see them succeed and paying at the gate funds this. Away fans don’t have this incentive. Perhaps we could offer them a discount if they attend both of their clubs matches at Firhill, this would be better value for the club as it encourages repeat business and would perhaps be more acceptable to the home fans. Away fans could buy a ticket for both matches at the first fixture for say £25 and keep it for the second fixture at Firhill. This would also generate more revenue in the first half of the season when it can be used to fund the squad. I’m not convinced it would see a massive increase in away support but every little helps and if it proves profitable then it’s probably worth doing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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