David Stevenson

How about this scenario.... Beattie got confused when filling in the balllot slips and put NO to question 1 and YES to question 2, realised too late and felt like a diddy. Didn't want to admit it, but didn't want to lie either.... Hence the ambiguous club statement, the quote in the Record and the fact that the club that cast the single NO vote for question 1 hasn't been identified.....

You're missing the point: having been in Administration twice in under a decade and having to rent Dens Park, they clearly fit the SPL profile: a record of appallingly bad management and utterly compromised. Dunfermline could almost give them a run for their money, also having to rent their stadium and being many millions in debt, but Dundee just pip them I reckon. Football doesn't really matter, does it?

Well perhaps that will help balance my cancellation because if they are not up-front and have not done the right thing, I will not be back and will cancel my monthly £10 donation as well as no longer exchanging my £17 for "goods and services" or hoping it's my number pulled out of the cardboard box at HT. No new away strip either..... I really liked this one too! The relationship between many football fans and their club seems to parallel that of women in abusive relationships. No matter how much sh1t they get thrown at them, they never leave. Well unless the club exhibit some transparency, clarity and integrity, I'll be breaking the cycle, leaving it behind and encouraging my wee boy to do something else with the thousands of Saturdays and Tuesday evenings he has ahead of him. I might still go to Ayr on Monday: at least they did the right thing.

I e-mailed them too Sandy. Didn't receive any response to either of the messages I sent before today but wasn't bothered. Don't care if they don't respond directly to my latest either, and requested clarification through the website where it is there for all to see...

Well it is impossible if you voted YES.....

So that's what he thought he was doing..... This bullshit is even worse than the statement on the Jags website.....

Well if we e-mail the club indicating that we are not opening up the wallets until they give an absolute and honest indication of how they voted, I expect they will make it clear... Unless it's the answer they know will alienate many fans, in which case they may try to hide and hope some spend. I won't be one of them.....

Norwegian commentator.... You can find it on youtube.

And within the law relating to their contractual and legal obligations to the SFL. I hope Ballantyne and Longmuir have taken the sensible step of getting legal advice on Donkey's threat to refuse to pay the monies due under the settlement agreement of 1998. They were both in on a lot of the shenanigans surrounding the SFA role in events that have led up to this point (for evidence see this): http://blogs.channel4.com/alex-thomsons-view/football-chairmen-living-fairytale-world/2265 Were they acting as moles? I hope so...... David

Clearly not.... SFL, especially Division 1 clubs need to maintain a united front. What then for Donkey and Regan? SFA SGM/EGM to shift one and hope the SPL cut their losses by bagging the other.

I hope that is correct and I can now order the new away strip to wear at Ayr on Monday.......

Don't know if anyone saw this "debate". Godawful. Alex Thomson of C4 (good guy), Archie McPherson (****), wee journalist from the Daily Mail who's name escapes me (bit of a ****) and Gordon Smith (total ****)..... Basically "Three muppets and Alex Thomson"….. Thomson: laying it out about the alienation of SFL clubs and fans by Regan/Doncaster; standing up for integrity and the need to move forward rather than try to turn the clock back to the "good old days" when Rangers were calling the shots. Gordon Smith: (he can’t see the irony in his own idiot comments): bragging about Oldco Rangers four European final appearances when they had their last moment of disgrace in Manchester while spending money they never had with a squad pumped up on EBTs… Going on about what Rangers (and Celtic) "bring to the economy". A £100M hole in the tax income in the case of Rangers… You couldn't make it up.... Moaning about the pishy wee teams having a say on the future of the MIGHTY GLASGOW RANGERS. He must have been reading Billy Dodds and Burley at the weekend… Archie McPherson: calling for a cull of SFL clubs, as he did on Off the Ball at the weekend. (I bet Regan and Donkey love the concept)…. What would happen if he had his way: take the £500K the bottom ten clubs get, divide it between the remaining 32, and they get less than £16K apiece. That wouldn’t even employ Daniel Cousin for 3 weeks (assuming you meet the NI payments of course…). That should sort everything out…. His other line: the fans of the rest of the SPL teams are only moaning because they’re jealous and can shuffle up a place while Rangers are in the lower leagues. Nothing to do with industrial scale corruption at all…… That wee journalist: fans don’t matter,”Uncle Rupert” will call the shots (cheered on by the other deidheids….). Bring on the empty stadiums if the Regan/Doncaster axis try to force SPL2… I do, however, think they are right that if the SFL clubs do the right thing tomorrow then Regan and Doncaster will make a swift attack. I've seen various people muse over Doncaster's apparent conversion to (at least being open to) sensible change. Having as recently as last year said the SPL should be truncated rather than expanded, he is now appending his name to the notion that the SPL should have up to 16 clubs and signing up for a committee that will consider just about any change, unified administration and a different economic model. Why? Here's my theory, for what it's worth.... The public NO votes with regard to a 1st Division entry for Sevco have been piling up and it has become more rather than less likely that the verdict of the SFL clubs will be Div3 for Sevco. The proposals for the reconstruction of the league and administrative set-up are dependant on the 1st div solution, so if that fails to come to pass, Donkey, Regan and the compliant media hacks will rant and rave about the SFL not caring about Scottish fitba and that the pishy wee teams were given the opportunity to engage and improve things but have shown themselves unfit for the purpose, blah blah blah.... Regan will then be unleashed in his Rottweiler mode to fulfil his threat of SFA intervention, introducing SPL2 (membership by invitation only; first invitation addressed to Sevco) and cutting the rest of the SFL adrift.... Job done.... Alternatively, if the SFL cave in and accept Sevco into the 1st Div, they go through the motions of the committee, ensure either a conclusion that they are happy with or alternatively no solution whereupon they call in Regan to set wheels in motion on 1st December. Meanwhile, Sevco are in the 1st Division with a top 4 finish enough to guarantee them a shot at promotion should they do a Dundee and outspend the rest of the Division but fail to win the title race...... I think rejection of the SFL1 option is looking more likely. In that case, it is crucial that SFL clubs stick together and reject SPL2. We’ll see where the SPL clubs really stand if it comes to that of course. An EGM of the SFA will probably be needed to yank Regan’s chain too if not see him off altogether.

I'm sure what's happening in Scotland contravenes Article 2(f) of the objectives of UEFA (under General Provisions): (f) ensure that sporting values always prevail over commercial interests; Probably Article 2(j) as well (speaking as a supporter): (j) ensure that the needs of the different stakeholders in European football (leagues, clubs, players, supporters) are properly taken into account; http://www.uefa.com/MultimediaFiles/Download/EuroExperience/uefaorg/WhatUEFAis/01/80/54/03/1805403_DOWNLOAD.pdf It is an obligation of membership of UEFA for the SFA to comply with the statutes and regulations. But I doubt that ignoring either or both of these would count as serious enough to merit UEFA caring at all...

Something here that is worth a read I think: http://wingsland.podgamer.com/an-open-letter-to-sfl-chairmen/#more-20298 I had a txt read out on Sportsound yesterday which Traynor of course hated then went off on his guff about "would you put Rangers into Div3 if it meant your club going bust?". Fact is that Newco in Div3 means there will be no loss of revenue in the lower leagues. The increased gates and the SFL having a TV asset would make up the loss from a fall in the SPL settlement. The threat of withdrawal is surely nonsense, though it does show that any agreement made with these shysters would be utterly meaningless and could be dumped whenever they fancy. You also have to wonder at Doncaster: one day it's Armageddon, the next it's unlikely that any SPL club will go bust having dumped Sevco..... Total idiot. Yet he and Regan hold power over our game. Ridiculous.

Do you know the people that constitute the SFL Board? I can't find the list anywhere?

Woken up to the sounds of the Cambuslang Britannia this morning. At least it's raining...

Correct. If SFL clubs stick together, SPL2 is a non-starter. It only takes 10 full members of the SFA to call on the SFA to instigate an EGM which must be "questioning an act or omission of the (SFA) Board". In my view they are omitting to yank Regan's leash and tell him to stop bringing the game into disrepute. Donald Findlay sounded pissed off in his press quotes. I'm sure he could be persuaded to draft a letter...... Of course, if there is a significant level of back-sliding, as hinted by the Stenny statement, the game's a bogey. For all time.

I would guess that THIS is where the rioting in the streets of Govan warning comes in rather than the SFA licensing... Would chime with John Broon's comments about Green on the steps outside Ibrox....

I was hoping to be guaranteed at least one last game before they made a decision I couldn't live with.....

I think Regan's comments are having the unifying effect I had hoped for: http://www.firmmagazine.com/news/2961/Donald_Findlay_QC_joins_chorus_of_disapproval_at_SFA_chief_executive_%22social_unrest%22_claims.html

It has occured to me that his "riots in the streets" BS may be related to licensing by teh SFA. Otherwise, I can't think of a context where he would even talk such gibberish as no-one really expects Rangers to fold up. But if Green's licence application wasn't up to scratch, the SFA should refuse a licence. Unless they are too scared to as a result of "civil unrest". Equally, I think C4News' Alex Thomson's blog and possibly other sources have stated that Rangers should not have been given a licence last season. It would all fit with regan's philosophy of "rules are there to be broken by me".... Anyone think of an alternative stimulus for his guff?

Any reasonable person would see no problem in suggesting that the supreme organisation overseeing Scottish football should take it's responsibilities seriously with regard to the current situation and also the wider picture. Problem is of course, that the organisation in question has one Stewart Regan at the helm. Regan was one of those who drafted the poorly written, errorenous and scare-mongering document sent to SFL clubs last week and is obviously the source of the SPL2 threat, a threat made more stark and nauseating in the Scotsman interview at the head of this thread. Calling on the SFA to intervene is either a very bad mistake in the circumstances or a master-stroke that has helped expose the fact that the SFA under Regan is part of the problem. Regardless, no-one can now be under any illusions about the role that Regan sees for the SFA in the current situation: to bulldoze the SFL to ensure Newco gets into SFL1. I would like to think his bullying intervention and crass statements about civil unrest are enough to marginalise him and expose him to the ridicule that he deserves. It should also serve to act as a unifying force across the SFL. If that happens, as it should, I believe Thistle should be to the forefront of such a "movement" rather than being evasive as they have been recently. Has anyone noticed that Doncaster is now saying that he doesn't believe there will be anyone going bust in the SPL despite denying Newco's application. That was his position On Wednesday. On Tuesday, Armageddon was on the cards. None of us on the outside know what the true fiscal position is, but we all know that we can't trust a word that Regan and Doncaster say. Longmuir had either been turned or beaten into submission. Either way, he's as much use as a chocolate teapot in the current situation.

The threats from Regan in that Scotsman interview indicate that there is actually a serious need for a meeting of Jags fans. All SFL clubs need to stick together and shoot this nonsense down. A unified statement indicating refusal to engage with SPL2 is required. I think the Club need to see that we will support them in pursuing that and joining with fellow SFL member clubs in taking Regan on. The SFL clubs must comprise a very significant portion of the membership of the SFA. Regan is a functionary and a piss-poor one at that. Time to yank his chain.

Just read on another thread that Cowdenbeath also say "No to Newco in SFL1". I withdraw my above suggestion that inferred that they would most likely be up for SPL2!

I haven't "posted" on this site before, but was previously a frequent poster on ptfc.net. I've been reading people's contributions for about a week and finally worked out what I was doing wrong when trying to log into the forum! Anyway, here goes for my first comment.... If you ever needed evidence as to why the SFA with this bullying, ignorant cretin at it's head should NOT "take ownership" of the task of providing a solution to the problems of Scottish football, this interview provides it. Along with Doncaster he is a HUGE part of the current problem. He is a crude scare-mongering bully and you can see his imprint in the distorted document sent to SFL clubs last week. The majority of SFL Division 1 clubs are already opposed to having Newco enter at the 1st Division. If they show the same unity of purpose in the face of Regan's threats, SPL2 is a non-starter. Who will they invite to play Newco? Cowdenbeath presumably, and then start dredging the 2nd Division for Uncle Toms? I was a bit dubious about the line the club took today. I felt they were trying to appease the fans while seeking to absolve themselves from making a decision by calling on the SFA to intervene. Well we can see what kind of intervention we can anticipate and see what a serious mistake it would be to invite it. Looks like it's back to e-mailing the club and calling for a hardline response to this. Regan and Doncaster are surplus to requirements. Doncaster went into today's SPL meeting hinting at a deferred vote which didn't happen. Aberdeen, Motherwell and St. Mirren have all denied seeing the document prior to its' dispersal to the clubs and at least the first two have dissociated themselves from the coercive elements of it. It could well be that Doncaster is toast at the earliest opportunity. Regan gets paid a vast amount of cash yet swans off on holiday in the midst of the biggest crisis in Scottish football in my lifetime and most likely beyond. I believe that if the SFL clubs stand up to this, he can be seen off too.