Mr Scruff

That's a bit suit-ist there.... I fear that those who may worry about an 'exodus in droves by fans across the country' will not care a jot as long as the club whose average attendance is greater than the 30 SFL clubs combined is preserved in some way. The only ones who can stand against that in reality are those clubs (including ours) who will be most affected by this exodus. The dispiriting thing is that no-one is coming forward with a different proposal. I don't know what requirements are to bring a motion to an SGM but it would have been good to see a positive alternative. I don't believe a 'do nothing' option exists. But this is a once in a lifetime opportunity to detoxify, reinvent and reinvigorate the Scottish game. The fact that we have no leadership being shown, even amongst those chairman commendably condemning the current proposals is for me the biggest failure in this whole affair (leaving aside the club whose own failure has presented this rare opportunity)

It's really up to you who/ what you support, and one of the main reasons is definitely the emotional attachment. I wasn't born a Thistle fan. I became one after attending several games and then buying a season ticket. At some indefinable point 'you' become part of 'we'. And that's emotional attachment. It means I'll be going along to watch Thistle this season Logically, if you want to watch 'great football' it's probably cheaper to consume EPL, La Liga, Serie A etc. A cold Saturday afternoon in February watching a 0-0 draw against Dundee is not going to compete with that. So I can't give you a logical reason. But this is a traditional home grown industry, and I like to support them where I can. We accept in so many areas of life that we can get cheaper & better looking outside Scotland. Surrendering that makes it hard to get back - we've seen this in many other industries. And yes, this is a message I'd like the SFL to consider on Friday too. Think long term. There is an alternative to the plaster which will simply seal in the toxicity. Despite the inferior product and the lack of a compelling cost/ benefit case in supporting my team, there is little to compare with it. I have a group of friends that's grown around support for the club. I've got a couple of, hopefully new converts who are going to more games than they're missing. They haven't yet got to talking about 'we' but it's close - a decent season would make that happen. We're hoping to see that once we get this damaging close season out of the way. the feeling of pulling a surprising win out of the bag, or putting together a run which means we're challenging at the right end of the table is incomparable. As Thistle fans we're not glory hunters by definition. We're fans of a club that will lose as many as we win, but we do it together. And we do have good times. No-one other than you can answer your question. Once you take the emotional attachment away there's little else. And if there's one message that our chairman, and the rest of the game's custodians should have ringing in their ears on Friday, it's that one.

I don't know. I was sure that it'd be Newco ib SFL3. But some of the puzzling stuff over the last few days make me wonder if there will be some last minute ill-thought-out solution to have them in tier two. And that's what I think might actually happen unfortunately.

In my view it'd no more 'fixed' than the SPL is. Last time we were there our crowds were actually OK.

I think it's clear that those walking away aren't doing so because of anti - Rangers feelings, but because the authorities are pushing through reforms they wouldn't for anyone other than a member of the OF. We all have lines we won't cross and I've made mine clear in other threads. Respect for those that do, despite the fact that this isn't (yet) a 'red flag' for me. I actually believe that our game needs to move beyond our 19th century structures to survive and maybe even thrive again. Part of that may well be a malleable view of our league setup in the future, and my earnest hope is that this event could be the start of it. But we'd all need to accept change and the fact that the future might not look like the past.

The funny thing is. The 'Rangers' fans I know would view SFL 1 as a punishment as much as they would have viewed the SPL.

From my point of view the league was 'rigged' much worse for us in 2004. So the characterisation is yours. I believe I understand your view (from previous posts) - that you'll never support Thistle again, no matter what they do, if Newco play in any league other than Div 3. Those of us who carry on supporting our team aren't supporting your characterisation, just our team in their league.

The rules make this a discretionary requirement - ie it's no barrier to Newco.

Of course I completely agree with your overall points. The 'can kicking' has been going on for some time. And there's only been this plan (ie SPL with main cash being predicated on OF) - no contingency has existed. You could give them the benefit of the doubt by suggesting hindsight is a wonderful thing, but that would be a generous interpretation. But it will be "sudden" for those clubs that have planned for next season (or had planned for last season into this seasn) based on the current set up. Football clubs don't have the luxury of being able to change their cost base very quickly or easily without administration. All this implies that the game has been at risk and needed substantial restructuring for a long time, and yes the lack of foresight and leadership is frankly terrible

I think it just fits into the general message of the potential catastrophe if RFC in whatever guise are out of the SPL for too long. The genesis of it was probably the realisation that fans (including RFC fans) are less interested in TV deals and club finances and thus Div 3 is becoming the only show in town. I seriously don't think they'll withhold the licence, though they may still be suspended for a year. I thought his statement was ludicrous. But the point about the unpredictable nature of sudden, unplanned, dramatic change in financial conditions is correct. Where he's most wrong is in trying to avoid proper future planning and instead scaremongering to enable a process of 'kicking the can down the road'. The similarties of the crisis in the Eurozone is particularly apt for me...

There are several people who have indicated that they'll walk away irrespective of what Thistle does if Sevco are in Div 1. There's even been hints of Sevco in Div 3 leading to this (since it implies a 'favourable' application of the rules) but nothing as explicit.

I don't see how DB falling on his sword solves anything, even if you do believe that the club's statements are wrong (I don't - though I do believe his original newspaper interviews were misguided). And surely it's an entirely reasonable stance to suggest that the governing body in our game should show the leadership here rather than the 'problem' being abdicated to member clubs? The fact that the chief executive of that body has come out with highly questionable remarks can hardly be laid at the door of our chairman. To my mind there should be two separate processes. Securing sufficient clubs to fulfil season 2012/13 and I'd be in favour of Sevco's application to join the football league at the appropriate level. As a result of that we're hearing (and I think this will be right) that this will lead to considerable financial restructuring within the game. And given the nature of football clubs costs and overheads this is not an easy goal to achieve this quickly. I'd also like to exploit this for our club's benefit, but that's a side matter. This is exactly where we need leadership from our national governing body. Drive through the structural change our game has needed for years (and highlighted by report after report). There are no more sacred cows to preserve. But while the current structures remain in place we will always tend towards individuals and clubs fighting to preserve their wee bit of them.

That is just chilling. Not for its threats, but for how wrong it is on so many levels. All I can say is Jings!

Well, we expected they might equivocate.... Can't see how they will get any vote for SFL1 to succeed.

I'm with you on that MB. I still can't work out the logic. There's probably some archaic 19th century reason but I don't understand. Maybe does explain why the OF when trying to move to England have done it through approaching the leagues rather than the FA. And maybe the leagues have higher requirements for clubs and meeting them implies that getting an SFA licence will be forthcoming. No real idea.

They're not doing this as a special case - this is apparently how it should be done for anyone according to the rules and regulations. Every body associated with this will be making damned sure just now that they do follow the requirements of their own rules and articles. The incendiary danger of a misinterpretation is huge. I suspect this is also the root of the player's registration issue - there'll be lawyers advising every step. I suspect.

I think it's been clearly established for some time now that the SFA licence would follow after them being admitted to a league.

Beautiful. I love these creative solutions....

I noticed that. It does seem to be a fairly clear 'no'.

Indeed. Since many supporters will walk away irrespective of what Thistle does then I think you're right.

Yup - so that does make no sense...

It should be the Oldco that had the vote since it still exists though 'in liquidation'. I'd be interested in knowing who attended - shouldn't be Newco or their representatives presumably.

That's the best solution I've heard to this whole sorry mess. Beautiful. Who is that genius and what's their solution to the Eurozone debt crisis?

Just reported that they've voted to reject the application.

Presumably if they get voted into the SPL then you'll do likewise? It meets the same criteria of being outwith Thistle's control and not Newco in lowest league possible. Don't get me wrong, I m not challenging your decision - it's entirely your right to follow your own ethical priorities. And I understand the logic. I'm just interested in the impact this might have on us, and the rest of the game.