Norgethistle

Currently I will be voting NO, the reason I have still to see any real information that has been substantiated to say that Scotland will be better on its own, so better the devil you know for me. Its quite sad the fact there has been more level debate on here than in the media from both camps

The beauty with a national service defence force is that A) The cost is cheaper than a full time soldier B ) You remove 1 or 2 years of the male population from the job market, effectively reducing unemployment The down falls A) You have guys being forced into something they have no interest in and will show it the same level of disdain as being forced to wash the toilet floor in McDonald for minimum wage B ) If the unthinkable happen and per say Russia decides it wants the Scottish oil fields we have no way of defending it. (Not so far fetched as the Russian fleet has already been through the Norwegian oil field shutting production and helicopter flights as a show of strength, and are currently over flying Norway regularly with nuclear bombers, escorted away by the RAF and USAF and the Norwegian airforce) When I was on the STUC my union AEEU with Danny Carrigan at the time were actually pushing for National service (But as a land army, fixing roads etc) to be looked at to lower unemployment and encourage kids to get up in the morning and learn how to work, the Labour government wouldn't entertain the idea. Just to add the countries mentioned Denmark ; National service Sweden: NO National service Finland: National service Norway: National Service

Seeing a lot of complaints regarding badges falling off after 1 wash on the FB page, poor show if true

And no mentions of the Nomads probably the biggest (and best) supporters branch

Just noticed this on the news article about the TAG "To help build that relationship we are currently in the process of forming the Partick Thistle Supporters Federation." Now was not the Jags Trust name???

Thanks for the reply, couple of points The alcohol price, was brought in due to the amount of drunks during the dark winters, but a fact for you, Stavanger has the highest rate of binge drinking of females between the ages of 18 and 30 of any city in Europe (Including Glasgow) Trade Unions, control everything here (Last Communist Country in Europe!!!), I was asked or told to go on strike to support another company in the region that was on strike as the 8% rise they were offered they rejected, the company I worked for could do nothing about it, and were told to pay our wages for the hours we were out. The unions are a hark back to the start of Thatchers reign they are that powerful, strikes are common and they force the government to push through ridiculous pay rises for workers, so much so that financial analysts are predicting super inflation and a massive crash in the not to distant future. Defense, Norway doesn't have an army as such but a defense force, every male has to do 1 years national service (This also lowers the unemployment rate as you remove 1 year from the available workforce), the guys are paid a minimum (Not what they are earning at the time) and many I know that owned their own flats have had to take mortgage deferrals to cope, with the charges incurred, which will make the banks (Which are owned by the government and Trade unions) richer, pushing the level of personnel debt up. I totally agree with you on the market value of Whisky unfortunately it doesn't employ that many people in terms of its net worth, so doesn't fix any job crisis (and Scotland and UK still have a job crisis) On the currency a lot of talk from down south that if independence comes through they will push to have sterling removed from Scotland, and with Scotland not able to join the Euro for a few years that will cause problems as new currency historically crashes in the first year, which would be fantastic for tourists and folk buying from the country but poor for Scotland. I personally think it is at the wrong time, hasn't been thought out or communicated clearly as to what it will benefit and what it will cost, and the "YES" campaign keeps changing the message coming out. Tell everyone the real pro's the real con's and the ones we're not too sure about then let people vote, IMO this is getting branded as a patriotic vote over everything else, if your proud to be Scottish vote "YES", lets remember the act of the union was drawn up by a Scottish King, and being a union stopped the Nazi jack boot from conquering europe

But they are selling a North stand ST, people have had their ST's stamped with a "N" for North Going by Beatties article they won't be in there at all

The payment is done by paypal, plus for us Nomads you need to mail them for a quote

Ok so for people that have bought ST's for the Shed, what now, 1st they were in the whole season, then being moved out twice for Celtic, now it looks like they will be moved to the main stand for many more games if not all (If segregation is an issue with away fans getting stuck between JHS city end and North stand), this is going to (and has) pissed a load of folk off, not to mention falsely selling goods (ST for North Stand). Is it going to be on a game to game basis where the shed goes, will the fans turn up on a Saturday not knowing where they will be? Shambles!!!!!!!! Clarification needed now Thistle!!!!!!!!!!

I'm getting confused by this now, where are away fans being allocated, it appears going by the DR article it won't be the main stand, and going with the "concerns" over away fans being boxed in by the Jags support does that rule out the JHS

Can we house our fans in the Main stand for this one to let Jackie know we still remember him

No

Different list from what I saw http://www.oecdbetterlifeindex.org/#/55555555555

Salmond has been in the press over here on lots of occassions, on the Norway model for economy and drink prices (I posted this once before here, where he basically said Scots were drunk and the price hike would stop it, it doesn't people drink at home on illicit or smuggled booze and turn up in town smashed at 11) Norways Crime record has started to increase dramatically in the last 5 years as has the unemployment (From 0.2% in Stavanger to 3.2% in 5 years). Yes its a nice place to live and safer, cleaner and easier to get a job than Glasgow, but the Norway Model won't work in Scotland our cultures are way too different. Norway had nothing before the oil (80% unemployment in Stavanger), so when the wages started but were getting taxed no one noticed as it was way better than what they had. Norwegians may complain but they will never demo or riot, so when the electricity price doubled 8 years ago (Yes Doubled due to them seeling too much and having to buy it back), people maned over a coffee or made a comment in the paper but nothing happened. The same went with the road tolls (On all roads going to and from the city & tunnels & motorways) 5 years ago you paid 6NOK in peak times, at other times it was free, Now we are paying 30 NOK all the time and there are more tolls than ever, and if you haven't paid up front via a brick, you have 12 hours to pay it at the local esso station or its 2030NOK (Over £200). People moan at work but no one demo's. Its the culture they are very placid they moan but accept things. The spend spend spend culture was worldwide, not just Scotland and is still going on (We have the oil fund, the state will protect etc etc) Norway has effectively been Independent for over 100 years, when it effectively meant putting a new king on the throne and changing your flag, Scotland will have so much more to do with so much more cost. Armed forces and equipment, wheres the money coming from?? Or we going to put the Waverly to sea?? Thats Billions that are needed. Currency we won't get in the Euro to start (although i would advise against ever entering it) so we need to print our own currency Millions of pounds in expenditure Passports 3 million people will need a new passport Stamps Government stationery...... Millions These are costs that are absorbed over time on a country that is running, but this will need to come in towards the first few years. I've said before I'm not anti independence but I have still to see the REAL facts that prove Scotland will be better, and the relying on oil is very narrow thinking, there isn't enough jobs in oil in Scotland to provide for all, we have massive unemployment and believing the oil (Plus the already failed oil tax) will be a magic cure is pie in the sky

Norway may be classed as one of the richest countries around but it has the highest level of personnel debt of anywhere in europe, hey you can even take a mortgage out on your kids name

Who fancies the following 36% income tax on basic 50% income tax on overtime £11 a pint (Due to 80% tax) £5 a pint of milk & loaf of bread £25 a hospital visit £2.50 every toll road (almost all roads) journey (Most people pay 3 or 4 times a day) £1.70 a litre of our own produced fuel £400 a year road tax £700 a year council tax (If you own your own house) to be paid in a single chunk £200 a month for Hydro electricity (No Gas we have to sell it) £20 a prescription item (Even for kids) Thats the "Norway Model" that uncle Alex wants to adopt, yes some of the wages are better here but a Mechanic will earn around £36,000 basic, Overtime is very strictly controlled by the government and unions, night shift apart from off shore is basically illegal for non essential positions (Nurses etc), back shift allowance is 7%

Lets remember that the Population of London is nearly twice that of Scotland, policies will always look to favor the majority. Lets assume we get Independence, Edinburgh will set the policy, maybe to the detriment to the islands, or with the SNP at the helm maybe at the determent to Glasgow, should we then ask for a referendum for Glasgow and Edinburgh to break away from the Gaelic portion of the country, after all we must be subsidizing them with our industry.

The kit looks cheaply made and poor quality to me, away strip is a disaster, home top ok apart from the sponser bit and back patch, but why black socks and shorts

Norway had nothing before the oil, small fishing industry only, but they got in at the start and basically set the standard with a very very low population back in the 60's where they needed massive foreign investment (Infrustructure and labour) to start, and could tax what they wanted as 36% taxed wages was still more in the pocket of what they had previosly. Although Norway is very wealthy it doesnt invest its money in anything merely hordes it, we have the worst level of road maintenance and building of anywhere in Europe (Including Romania and Albania), 95% of all income is through oil, there is very little else, so when it does go, or the price dramatically drops (When the Alaska field opens) Norway is in the poo, We have a weird situation where if you are in debt to the bank, the interest you owe is deducted against your tax, so you pay less tax, but the repayments on that are bigger than the tax bill would be, but people think they are fiddling the tax man and the government, but the government and the unions own ALL the banks. We are being braced for inflation to rise to double figures due to the country hyper inflating itself through the cost of living. Cost of living is high, wages come up, house prices rise due to this, cost of living comes up, wages increase and so on. Norway lost 23% of parts manufactured for the oil industry last year alone due to the price, Statoil (The Government owned Oil Giant) has just moved 7000 jobs abroad, as have AKER and Abel, thats 20000 jobs been moved abroad in 1 year alone for a small country, but hey doesn't matter get laid off the state pays 90% of my wage for 18 months, so no need to find a job. We have a fantastic oil fund that guarantees us a pension based on our 5 best years (Tax Free), and we can go on 80% from 62, oh wait the pension fund is dry were working to 70 from now with an average over the last 15 years of your wage dropping down every 5 years. Its not all that rosy here

Salmond shows how much he knows ""The situation affects fans like myself and players, but Heart of Midlothian is a substantial employer in the city," he told business leaders in Edinburgh." The country must be really on its a**** if a company employing less than 100 full time staff is classed as a substantial employer in our capital city. No mention from him of the Tax man being ripped of for 100's of thousands of pounds or the small companies this affects

Kjempa bra og fint været

NO

Maybe its red and yellow checks

Got a funny feeling, well see at least half the JHS for Celtic and Segregation plus the North stand and us plumped in whats left