Terminal Decline?

[lady-isobel-barnett]

grass roots football

Given the state of the Firhill pitch, will people please stop using this expression.

[Steven H]

Given the state of the Firhill pitch, will people please stop using this expression.

 

lol, undersoil heating is killing the roots

[Mr Bunny]

Red ash was a fine surface indeed - and there were some well tended thick blaes surfaces out there when I was a kid playing so I'd have to disagree with that comment. A well tended blaes surface was simply streets ahead of 3G/4G IMHO.

 

As for the 7s comment the kids these days can't scale up the 7s to 11s in terms of positioning or job. Add into the mix that their fitness levels are a complete disgrace. The kids think all they have to do is turn out once a week for a half hour or hour in 7s and hey presto they are ready for selection for Real Madrid. I think Levein (much as I dislike him) hit the nail on the head when he asked "where are the kids these days out there with a ball putting in 20 hours or more a week" ... the answer is that they are a rare breed these days if they exist at all and one or 2 games of 7s a week won't make home-grown van Bastens I'm afraid.

 

As for the inter-pupil football we do have that but they still all think they're a Rooney or Messi - do you really expect them to throw in the towel in front of their mates when they see (and they do see weekly how out of touch and unfit they are) they are red rotten? Wishful thinking.

 

Points taken, but I can't believe that kids are naturally born with that attitude. Do we need to catch them much younger, and encourage the right attitude as well as the skills? Obviously not easy as it needs the backing of parents and teachers ... something to encourage this from governement or even the SFA as they've cash? Maybe also getting lots of big name players to turn up on occassion or at least recommend it, kids are celebrity mad these days.

 

Re 7s, my point was it can't be bollox 'cause the Dutch do it - as I said they've a system in place and that's only one strand of it. We don't have the other stuff that's needed. One problem seems that even when we try to fix things we do it in a patchy way and often don't follow it through.

[lady-isobel-barnett]

Re 7s, my point was it can't be bollox 'cause the Dutch do it - as I said they've a system in place and that's only one strand of it. We don't have the other stuff that's needed. One problem seems that even when we try to fix things we do it in a patchy way and often don't follow it through.

The benefits of 7s are it gets kids involved at primary school level and the game is not totally dominated by the bigger stronger kids. On the other hand youth coaches are in general ambivalent towards 7s as they often inherit youngsters with no will to win ethic and an over genteel attitude to the game.

[Gordie]

The benefits of 7s are it gets kids involved at primary school level and the game is not totally dominated by the bigger stronger kids. On the other hand youth coaches are in general ambivalent towards 7s as they often inherit youngsters with no will to win ethic and an over genteel attitude to the game.

100%correct. I coach 21 lads for a under 11s team, we are still playing 7's and will be for another season. We then go to 11's at under 13's and straight into competitive games. Pro youth ( the elite lads, pro teams) do not go competitive until under 19's. No wonder we don't do well, the kids don't know how to win.

[uberteeb]

This thread has obviously gone on a bit of a tangent about kids playing football but the terminal decline of Thistle is shown by the surroundings at Firhill.

 

Whether we are beating Falkirk 1-0 or losing to Falkirk 1-0 Firhill is by and large a depressing dull place to watch football unless the right people turn up in the right mood on the right day and start singing. This happens less and less these days at home. Sub 2,000 crowds certainly doesn't help.

[lady-isobel-barnett]

This thread has obviously gone on a bit of a tangent about kids playing football but the terminal decline of Thistle is shown by the surroundings at Firhill.

 

Whether we are beating Falkirk 1-0 or losing to Falkirk 1-0 Firhill is by and large a depressing dull place to watch football unless the right people turn up in the right mood on the right day and start singing. This happens less and less these days at home. Sub 2,000 crowds certainly doesn't help.

I feel you can broaden that to most clubs in our league. Put another way if you were a neutral and went round Div 1 grounds you're not going to single out Firhill as being any more "a depressing dull place" to visit and watch football than some of the tidier stadia (Forthbank, Grangemouth, East End Pk and the two in waiting Livingston & New Douglas Pk). Even if someplaces make for not a bad day out once in a while imagine having to go to them 20 plus times a season.

Doesn't of course make Firhill anything but depressing. Just we're not alone in misery.

[beep0608]

 

I never said I was giving up, but last night I thought about the crowds, and thought back to the early 80s, when I started going back again after missing a couple of seasons, being out of the country and so on. Were the crowds good back then? So, this morning I checked the big 2002 PTFC Official History, which lists attendances and everything else. (If anybody reading doesn't have this book then you really should. You can check back on, say, Jackie Campbell's only goal, and much more) I'm not saying we're suddenly on easy street or anything, but in 1982-83 we got 2,500 for an opening day game against Dunfermline, and most home games were 1,800 or less. The next few seasons were similar, until we edged towards promotion again. Prices were cheaper then too. I don't think there was much difference in the price of a cinema ticket and entry to Firhill then, but look at it now.

 

I'm no expert at analysing patterns but I'd also judge that a few seasons in the Premier inflates our crowds a bit then they drop off again when we go down. All pretty obvious I suppose, but the main point is that crowds have not changed much in the last 20 years. Cause for optimism? Hmm, dunno. Food for thought certainly.

Edited April 17, 2011 by beep0608

[Fawlty Towers]

I had a quick look through the team section on the official site and I think I am right in saying that we have 16 players signed up for next season. Some of those are youngsters with no first team experience but there are also players like Bannigan who has impressed at Ayr as far as I am aware, Doolan (could end season at top scorer in division) and Fox who I think is the best young keeper in the division (Douglas just shades him as best overall keeper in my opinion).

 

The talk from the Board is that although our budget will be small we will stick to it and exercise financial discipline (something we have slated them in the past for not doing) and the fans of other clubs are in for a shock when their clubs get around to drawing up their budgets. QoS are apparently letting all contracts expire at the end of the season, Falkirk's difficulties are well known, etc.

 

I don't think that McCall's departure will impact on the youth set up as although he wanted one put in place he was sensible enough to know that it was not his area of expertise and that is why guys like John Henry, Gerry Britton and Ian Cameron have been involved in it and I think (and hope) that whoever becomes manager will keep it that way.

 

The crowds are a worry but that is true of the vast majority of clubs across the country not just us, there are lots of factors at play regarding this some of which the club can influence and others which they cannot. Hopefully the club will do as much as possible to entice people to come out in bigger numbers next season as I, personally speaking, see a brighter future for PTFC not a decline.