phoenix1876 Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 Just thinking about all the goings on in scotland atm, well in football especially. Should partick thistle start up a campaign against bigotry or to some effect. Ive thought a name for the scheme "Not In A Jags Shirt". Mean i see thistle coming up with schemes to fill firhill etc but shouldnt we give a little Any thoughts on this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven H Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 Just thinking about all the goings on in scotland atm, well in football especially. Should partick thistle start up a campaign against bigotry or to some effect. Ive thought a name for the scheme "Not In A Jags Shirt". Mean i see thistle coming up with schemes to fill firhill etc but shouldnt we give a little Any thoughts on this It would be akin to pissin into the wind, and is a bit like using bigotry for our own aims...if it was a scheme which involved the whole of Scottish football then Thistle taking a lead role would be a shoe in imo given the geographical closeness of us the thiem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bunny Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 It would be akin to pissin into the wind, and is a bit like using bigotry for our own aims...if it was a scheme which involved the whole of Scottish football then Thistle taking a lead role would be a shoe in imo given the geographical closeness of us the thiem. More or less my own thoughts ... fine if it's part of a country wide (or even Glasgow wide thing) but not somethign we could easily initiate ourselves without seeming to be using it for our own ends. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimeConsumer Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 Just thinking about all the goings on in scotland atm, well in football especially. Should partick thistle start up a campaign against bigotry or to some effect. Ive thought a name for the scheme "Not In A Jags Shirt". Mean i see thistle coming up with schemes to fill firhill etc but shouldnt we give a little Any thoughts on this I'm all for Jags fans continuing to show their opposition to bigotry and racism through songs and possibly flags and banners but not sure that Thistle themselves can really do much. I think unless they felt that marketing themselves as a club that was ardently against discrimination would pull in more fans from the decent sections of Glasgow society, like Sankt Pauli did when far-right hooliganism was the norm over at city rivals HSV, then I don't think the club would feel that they needed to launch a one club campaign against it. Wouldn't actually mind a skull and cross bones themed Thistle shirt... Not in our name, not in red and yella! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Semi Nurainen Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 We could start with some of our own fans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 Slightly off topic but I'm glad the wee incident up at Dens preceded the Lennon thingy last night. A mixture of being topical and lazy journalism would ensure we'd be dragged into all this nonsense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B.C.G. JAG Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 Personally I'd love it if we did, but everytime this subject comes up, there's usually plenty of folk on demanding that Thistle must have no politics at all to retain it's moral stature above the fray. I think that view misses the point a bit. Being A-political is in itself a political position to take. We should have been banging this drum for a while but sadly any move on it now will just smell of opportunism. I've always thought Thistle could lead the way with a campaign uniting supporters of all local teams against bigotry called 'Glasgow Utd'. I doubt the club would ever have the balls to really ride this so maybe one of our unofficial t-shirt makers could come up with something... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoggy Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 I just wish journos such as Hugh Keevins would lay off the "Scotland's Shame" quotes. And quite rightly last night on the radio he was corrected. Yes we have racism and secterianism in Scottish football but most of this revolves around 2 clubs, NOT the whole of scottish football. If they buggered off to engerland would it then be "England's shame"? What is happening to Lennon isnt right and I would never condone it in any way. But it is folly to act the way he has, as well as the lawyer, and the politician turning up in her celtic top. Rangers and Celtic are a breed apart and to them it is more then just a game, and therefore the "wind ups" that we all like to do to the opposing supports, tends to end up spilling over. What happened last night has been coming for a while, and whilst it may play on celtic's "everybody hates us and we dont care" attitude, it just makes the rest of the knuckle draggers that follow certain clubs, more determined to keep doing what they have been doing. Will be glad when this season is over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimeConsumer Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 Personally I'd love it if we did, but everytime this subject comes up, there's usually plenty of folk on demanding that Thistle must have no politics at all to retain it's moral stature above the fray. I think that view misses the point a bit. Being A-political is in itself a political position to take. Bang on. Always found it surreal that folk demand that football fans should be a-political in the face of racism and sectarianism which is pretty engrained in Scottish football. Thistle have always been against the bigotry which comes out of the Green and Blue parts of Glasgow, don't see why it shouldn't be an overt position of our fans. Personally would be happy to see us putting across anti-bigotry and anti-racist messages in as many ways as we can. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H Wragg Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 Best just to leave them to it. As others have said, if our club came out with an anti-sectarian specific initiative at this particular time, we would somehow be seen as becoming involved in the whole mess. Most people know we are a completely different animal from the gruesome twosome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Incognito Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 I'm all for Jags fans continuing to show their opposition to bigotry and racism through songs and possibly flags and banners but not sure that Thistle themselves can really do much. I think unless they felt that marketing themselves as a club that was ardently against discrimination would pull in more fans from the decent sections of Glasgow society, like Sankt Pauli did when far-right hooliganism was the norm over at city rivals HSV, then I don't think the club would feel that they needed to launch a one club campaign against it. Wouldn't actually mind a skull and cross bones themed Thistle shirt... Not in our name, not in red and yella! I like your way of thinking TimeConsumer but St.Pauli had two major advantages over us when they began marketing themselves as their city's alternative club. Firstly, they were kicking against just one club and one form of bigotry, i.e HSV Hamburg and fascism. We have two "opponents" and Celtic and Rangers' knuckledragging elements both have slightly different flavours: Celtic have tried to re-invent themselves, unsuccessfully, as a left-leaning, anti-fascist club, whereas Rangers retain a loyalist/unionist stance, )although we all know that religious prejudice remains at the cores of both clubs). Thus, we have two pricks to kick against (pun intended). Secondly, St.Pauli attracted fans, in part, by keeping their admission prices low - and I can't see us being in a position to do that in this financial climate! I reckon though this season's OF antics will have put a fair few people off following them. Hopefully then Thistle can pick up a few new fans organically, without us doing anything as obvious as starting a campaign. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vom Itorium Posted May 12, 2011 Report Share Posted May 12, 2011 (edited) I don't think a campaign against bigotry is important on our agenda as most folk should know by now where we stand as a club and a fanbase on these issues. It would though certainly do us no harm in the current climate to vigourously push the family friendly aspect of our club in the Kids go Free offer and possibly ressurect the Great Glasgow Alternative tag to go with it. The amount of people I hear of who don't want their kids to have anything to do with the Old Firm and everything it brings is becoming more and more apparent and this is where we should be trying to capitalise. We really need to step up our game next season when it comes to pushing the Kids Go Free thing as we've totally underplayed it as far as I am concerned. Edited May 12, 2011 by Vom Itorium Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoda-jag Posted May 13, 2011 Report Share Posted May 13, 2011 I don't think a campaign against bigotry is important on our agenda as most folk should know by now where we stand as a club and a fanbase on these issues. It would though certainly do us no harm in the current climate to vigourously push the family friendly aspect of our club in the Kids go Free offer and possibly ressurect the Great Glasgow Alternative tag to go with it. The amount of people I hear of who don't want their kids to have anything to do with the Old Firm and everything it brings is becoming more and more apparent and this is where we should be trying to capitalise. We really need to step up our game next season when it comes to pushing the Kids Go Free thing as we've totally underplayed it as far as I am concerned. Agree wholeheartedly with all the above, especially us resurrecting the Great Glasgow Alternative tag. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix1876 Posted May 13, 2011 Author Report Share Posted May 13, 2011 i get what everyones saying. i just thought it would be a good idea that we could use all of it to our advantage to reassure people that this doesnt go on at firhill, and that all are welcome and possibly could capitilise from it and it wouldnt have to be just a thistle campaign but could get other teams onboard apart from the usual suspects and im not talking just the old firm. i agree with the kids go free but I want thistle to be more 'out there' with getting peoples attention and bringing in new supporters. we play in a city that i think people are starting to get sick and fed up of all that is going on. we should show them the light! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoda-jag Posted May 13, 2011 Report Share Posted May 13, 2011 No doubt about it, the Dark Side of Glasgow is getting worse. Like fire across the galaxy, the Ugly Sisters Wars is spreading. Witness Tynecastle, but it's not alone in shame. In league with the wicked Count Dookucaster, more and more planets slip. Upon the Jagi Knights falls the duty to lead the newly formed Red & Yellow Army of the Sectarism, Hate and Bigotry Free. Destroy the Ugly Sithsters, we must. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted May 13, 2011 Report Share Posted May 13, 2011 I don't think a campaign against bigotry is important on our agenda as most folk should know by now where we stand as a club and a fanbase on these issues. It would though certainly do us no harm in the current climate to vigourously push the family friendly aspect of our club in the Kids go Free offer and possibly ressurect the Great Glasgow Alternative tag to go with it. The amount of people I hear of who don't want their kids to have anything to do with the Old Firm and everything it brings is becoming more and more apparent and this is where we should be trying to capitalise. We really need to step up our game next season when it comes to pushing the Kids Go Free thing as we've totally underplayed it as far as I am concerned. Exactly how I feel as well. There's a lot of mileage to the Greater Glasgow Alternative slogan leaving it up to the punter to decide alternative to what? Even if the bigotry died overnight the slogan would still be effective. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bunny Posted May 13, 2011 Report Share Posted May 13, 2011 Exactly how I feel as well. There's a lot of mileage to the Greater Glasgow Alternative slogan leaving it up to the punter to decide alternative to what? Even if the bigotry died overnight the slogan would still be effective. Agreed, very good point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr.D Posted May 13, 2011 Report Share Posted May 13, 2011 FIRHILL FOR HATE! Yes this should be sung from the heavens. The number of people at Firhill and on here spouting their hate for all things Old Firm seems to be overwhelming at times. Perhaps itt might be an idea to jump off the Media led bandwagon of highlighting everything except Football would encourage a more family orientated atmosphere at Firhill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrD Posted May 13, 2011 Report Share Posted May 13, 2011 (edited) this thread is a nonsense thread this question comes up again and again. heres the standard answer i gave to this question elsewhere on this forum ages ago... i think an advertising strategy to respond to this so called crisis of the old firm would backfire and would be seen as a cynical exploitation of deep seated cultural problems in our society. It's business as usual in scottish football, the attachment of our society to the old firm runs too deep. Consequently this will work in their interests as they will be seen to be taking action on a problem that runs deeply in society. A big part of celtics sucessfull rebranding was built on the moral panic following their fan getting murdered that fateful day we beat em at parkhead. as said elsewhere in this thread also, we kinda need to deal with problems within our own support before we try and market ourselves as some kinda alternative. and as said elsewhere we missed the boat regarding positioning ourselves in that market, the space is occupied by celtic, and now the analysis of sectarianism problem in scotland being a problem of anti irish racisim in our society has become far more mainstream - an analysis that fits well with the leftie celtic narrative that plays prominence at parkhead these days... ultimately, if we cannot provide much in a way of an analyisis of what constitutes the sectarian problem in our society then we are just gonnna look like vaccous opportunists trying to exploit a bad situation. so no to this idea. and for people that think we can be a saint pauli, get ******* real, that space is occupied by celtic and further there is no significant organised left wing current in our support, and also when it was promoted as an idea to promote some kinda leftie ultras groups by various people, it was sounded down. concerns for sectarianism should be about concerns about sectarianism - not about turnstyles Edited May 13, 2011 by mrD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beep0608 Posted May 13, 2011 Report Share Posted May 13, 2011 Bang on. Always found it surreal that folk demand that football fans should be a-political in the face of racism and sectarianism which is pretty engrained in Scottish football. Thistle have always been against the bigotry which comes out of the Green and Blue parts of Glasgow, don't see why it shouldn't be an overt position of our fans. Personally would be happy to see us putting across anti-bigotry and anti-racist messages in as many ways as we can. I like the idea. Call it opportunism if you like, I just think it's speaking up for what you think is right, and it IS part of why I follow Thistle. We're valid in our own right, and not just as an prinncess to the ugly sisters, but we are in Glasgow so that is part of it. Speaking personally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrD Posted May 13, 2011 Report Share Posted May 13, 2011 the problem is you make statements like 'we are x' and then follow with 'speaking personally' which doesn't really fit well together. speaking personally, hearing wonderous chants such 'they're are only hoors, poofs, and junkies' sang loudly and proudly at morton fans does not sit well a definition of a fanbase that is in any way shape or form progressive. we should maybe take the plank out of our eye before worrying about the speck in our brothers eye. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimeConsumer Posted May 13, 2011 Report Share Posted May 13, 2011 Exactly how I feel as well. There's a lot of mileage to the Greater Glasgow Alternative slogan leaving it up to the punter to decide alternative to what? Even if the bigotry died overnight the slogan would still be effective. I like that slogan too, think it really should be emphasised more. and for people that think we can be a saint pauli, get ******* real, that space is occupied by celtic and further there is no significant organised left wing current in our support, and also when it was promoted as an idea to promote some kinda leftie ultras groups by various people, it was sounded down. concerns for sectarianism should be about concerns about sectarianism - not about turnstyles Would be happy for this sort of position to be taken up without it having an impact on ticket sales but I do think it's a likely outcome of it as well. It's not impossible for the club's supporters to be anti-bigotry and anti-racist in outlook without being overtly left wing. I mean, let's face it, at Celtic there's only a couple of hundred in the total of thousands following that outlook and even then there's still songs about the IRA being belted out... Hardly the same as Pauli. Plenty of groups of supporters set up along anti-racism or anti-bigotry lines but aren't flag waving socialists/communists/anarchists.. Don't need to be left wing to be anti-discrimination. When was the idea of a leftie ultras group vaunted and sounded down? I like the idea. Call it opportunism if you like, I just think it's speaking up for what you think is right, and it IS part of why I follow Thistle. We're valid in our own right, and not just as an prinncess to the ugly sisters, but we are in Glasgow so that is part of it. Speaking personally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrD Posted May 13, 2011 Report Share Posted May 13, 2011 timeconsumer the idea has been promoted a few times in the forums of various guises, a lot of the times im one of the ones promoting the idea but there was someone else a couple of years back too. i think there are valid reasons, in and of themselves, for undertaking such a procedure, although i dont think we can become unique due to the rise of groups such as the green brigade etc gotta go and pick up my kids from school, but ill return to this thread later. heres an old thread that covers these themes in detail http://www.wearethistle.co.uk/forums/index.php?/topic/1466-marketing-your-team/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackpool Jags Posted May 13, 2011 Report Share Posted May 13, 2011 FTOF! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrD Posted May 13, 2011 Report Share Posted May 13, 2011 (edited) after reading your post again timeconsumer, not got much to add. only to say that whilst it may well be only a few hundered celtic supporters that do the whole leftie ultra thing, it certainly has done a lot to add to the perception of celtic identity being tied to progressive values, if you factor in the ability for the PLC for PR over the years including publicising its community initiatives, initiating nil-by-mouth etc, and not to mention academics like joe bradley and tom devine presenting a history of celtic (as a mode of expresion of the irish community in glasgow) and/or the irish community as being systematically being oppressed throughout scottish history then you can see how that perception can be amplified. in that context, issues like whats going on with neil lennon give further 'weight' to that perception. also, yes one can be apolitical about being against discrimination although its hardly an inspiring stance that will make all sorts of people looking for an alternative stream towards. every club in the country has policies against discrimination in line with the law. btw, really like your avatar, mine would be red and black! Edited May 13, 2011 by mrD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.