Cowan & Co

[yoda-jag]

Sorry, I'm a season ticket holder so my opinion is largely academic but if I was pay at the gate there is no way I would boycott a game for political (for that's what it would be) purposes. In reality I'd be cherry picking whichever game I'd want to go along to. No outside influence would really sway my opinion. That's a hard fact from someone who wants to see those jokers expunged. Imagine the opinion of those who are now indifferent to the whole sad situation.

 

On your first point, fully understand your reasoning for cherrypicking which games to miss, and that its your perogative.

However, the second point you make is the most worrying and saddest thing about the current situation - sadly, so many of the support has been driven away/turned off by the product on (or off) the park/don't go often nowadays (their boycott wouldn't essentially be noticed), while it seems the majority of those who remain to go to every game or at least 50% of the games a season, are, in my opinion, either too indifferent to the mess we are in or have lost the will to fight and try get at least some of the jokers and clowns on the board out.

 

For some of the support, I feel that as much as some want these useless eejits out, they fear (or even believe it's true?) there really is no one (or collective group of people) who could or would come in to replace them. And so, they are willing to put up with the increasing bull they spout, the diminishing product on the park, and the ruination of our once great stadium.

 

Question is, is there enough collective will amongst the support to organise a number of specific and targetted objectives?

 

These could include:

1. 
    
   
2. getting press coverage on the years of mismanagement
   
3. a substantial boycott of a game (or games), either by
   
   1. 
      
   2. turning up late en-masse, half-way through a first half for instance,
      
   3. or even all standing (& chanting slogans) in the JHS carpark until after halftime (so the board and their guests get to see large, organised protest),
      
   4. or even a specific game where the protesters agree to boycott a match entirely, thus hitting the club bang in the pocket - if a 1000 boycotted a game, that would be a minimum 10k 'hit'
      

[*] a mass organised sign up to the Jags Trust (or an alternative 'vehicle for change' movement is formed) is made by those wishing change in the boardroom, and by their numbers, demand/force the Trust to change from a nodding puppy or its we-disagree-but-will-do-nothing stance, into a cause for change and demanding hard answers of the Directors (and Propcon), and even ammassing a 'warchest' of funds to be held in an account but not given to the club until such a time as its either used to facilitate the removal of certain board members, or in advance of STJ2 when these imbeciles take us down the road to rack and ruin and desert the sinking ship

[*] Through press and media coverage of protests, as well as their own efforts away from firhill, seek and invite investment/pledges to a 'takeover' fund.

 

Got many more ideas but these are just a quick few off the top of my head. I'm sure others can come up with even better ideas, which would firstly make a number of clear and resounding statements if carried out by a solid and unified group (has to be a substantial number, 20-50, or even 100 would be laughed at/ignored - I feel we need 500, or even up to a 1000 to make a real noise and get noticed and taken seriously), and secondly and more importantly, be the means by which we, the fans, can go about in an organised manner to force (if not wholesale) change in the boardroom, and find ways and means to fund (and run) the club in a way that is better than what has happened in the past decade (and lets be honest, it's hard to imagine how anyone could have run the club worse or made a worse job of the state of the 'stadium' and the surroundings in which we will soon find ourselves watching the Jags at Firhill (that's if we survive long enough with these dual-interest boards (of directors and Propcon).

 

If things go on as they are, I fear I won't have a Thistle to go and see, let alone take my kids to, in 5 years time.

 

Do enough people feel the same, the question, that it is.

[Steven H]

Very well put Mr Yoda and I feel exactly the same. What I would also add is that the strength of any protest should also be matched by the level of support given to the players on the park (I know, they are not very good and all that...but its what we've got for the foreseeable).

 

I like the idea of going in late en masse, show the BoD how much the Club relies on the fans and how many people feel the same way. I also like the idea of leaving early en masse too and staying behind the JHS to voice our feelings.

 

This would also show any potential investors how strong the fans feelings are and the level of support this CLub COULD have. Support the boys on the park in loud voices, protest over the running of the Club in equally loud voices and get the Trust (or another group) to have a large number of fans signed up and working towards finding potential investors.

 

Also, people in hospitality tend to be well-off generally (leaving aside the guests and fans who have saved or have a one-time only trip to hospitality), maybe one or more of them would take an interest in what people on the JT (or whatever) have to say re investing in us.

 

I also think The Incredible Adam Sparks idea about engaging with the Jags fan who orchestrated the Stirling Albion take-over is a no-brainer. His experience would be a great asset imo.

[MerryHell]

I might be wrong in this but has the current BOD not pretty much set it up so that the club is so unatractive for an investor that they can pretty much call the shots? I say this because if the main 'attractiveness' of a company is it's assets, and PTFC have sold half of its main asset (Firhill) to another company - then what is there to invest in? A football team that owns half a stadium?

I have to admit that i'm all for a change and would invest time and money(as much as I could afford as someone on £24k)but am at a complete loss as to what can be done. I know the current BOD are apparently fans but I'm not convinced that they wouldn't just let the club go to the wall and then snap up the land for development.

I may be wrong of course ...

[The Terminator]

Steven it seems that we can agree on something

The turning up late idea is a very plausible one, as is the one where the fans stand at the car park. A few banners would be nice too though. IIRC correctly it was you and your band that made the "We Believe" (gee, that feels like donkeys ago) banner? Even something that simple could help the cause for change.

Edited August 8, 2010 by The Terminator

[McKennan]

Fans stand in the car park until after kick-off then attend the game? That'll get folk quaking in their boots, that will.

[The Terminator]

Fans stand in the car park until after kick-off then attend the game? That'll get folk quaking in their boots, that will.

Apart from the attend the game bit, drowsiness kicking in.

[McKennan]

Past your bedtime?

[The Terminator]

Past your bedtime?

Something like that.

[lady-isobel-barnett]

Question is, is there enough collective will amongst the support to organise a number of specific and targetted objectives?

 

 

 

If things go on as they are, I fear I won't have a Thistle to go and see, let alone take my kids to, in 5 years time.

 

Do enough people feel the same, the question, that it is.

yoda, please don't take the selective quoting as if I've not read your entire post. There's so very much in your post I agree with.

 

But you ask two questions (perhaps in practice the same question). In answer to both questions I'd say that the support in general isn't as yet ready to raise protest. This is down to a number of reasons that will include apathy, indifference, ignorance of the severity of the situation and any amalgam of previous. Ignorance I sense is the principal reason.

There's no doubting time and urgency isn't on our side but regardless of that I believe before any protest should be organised the fanbase as a whole has to be fully brought up to speed on just what's happening to our Club. I'm not sure how this would be carried out. Petitioning those who turn up at Firhill is partly preaching to the converted in as much as they are the ones more aware of the situation. It's the periphery, lapsed and occasional support that need informed just as much. I guess that may mean media/press assistance.

All above is a roundabout way of saying let's get as much of the entire fanbase and those sympathetic to the Jags fully informed before any protest.

[McKennan]

Thought so.

[The Big Man]

Bloody hell don't stay away, if you do that and the bank calls the debt in then we are finished and the fans get the blame and the board just go ach well it was them not us - but hey at least we have got what we wanted the land ! If you can make it get to every game and force these jokers out, remember they sit amongst us !

[gordon090]

Guys, Chill

 

I was not at the game due to work commitments but, it's the first game of the season and we got gubed.

 

Let's run a few games before any harsh decisions are made on the team, club structure or other factors.

 

Cup game on Tuesday and then Dundee on Sat..

 

I have 30 quid bet on with my brothers G-Friend for that one, and I don't intend losing.

 

One bad result won't shape our season.

[Dr.D]

Are those sentiments here transmitted to Cowan and Hughes? (Yes I believe these two in particular the ones to whom most of the antagonism is addressed.) If not then perhaps the Trust should be directed to forward same at the earliest oportunity and demand either a complete resignation or an open meeting with the support in general. Would individual supporters be prepared to turn up for such a meeting or just shy away and do a Mr. Micawber?

[jaf]

Bloody hell don't stay away, if you do that and the bank calls the debt in then we are finished and the fans get the blame and the board just go ach well it was them not us - but hey at least we have got what we wanted the land ! If you can make it get to every game and force these jokers out, remember they sit amongst us !

 

Thats been the plan for years now and it never gets us anywhere because they know the nature of fans is they will keep turning up, they can't be any more unpopular than they are so they tough it out making losses til they get the rest of the ground/propco shares at a discount while the club dies.

 

I have come to the conclusion, and its a sad one to reach, that the only way to save the soul of thistle is to kill the cash flow to the clowns. Things have to get worse before they are ever going to get better. Sadly. The disappearance of the soul, the spirit, the pride of the football club is much more worrying than the disappearance of cash and assets.

 

The Trust could step up to the plate, organise themselves as a go-between between the disaffected fans and the Board and make a proactive case for change in the boardroom, setting out all the reasons for it (including throwing the mud of the conflict of interest issue around) and try to win the hearts and minds of all the supporters - once the support is united this would becoime easier. At the moment, the issue seems to be there is not consensus among the support that the clowns are clowns so Trust are in unenviable position - I wonder if there was an agenda for change how many additional members they would get? As yoda points out above, there are lots of things that can be done, but are we all too beaten and broken from the years of abuse of our club to be bothered to do any of them.

[Norgethistle]

Thats been the plan for years now and it never gets us anywhere because they know the nature of fans is they will keep turning up, they can't be any more unpopular than they are so they tough it out making losses til they get the rest of the ground/propco shares at a discount while the club dies.

 

I have come to the conclusion, and its a sad one to reach, that the only way to save the soul of thistle is to kill the cash flow to the clowns. Things have to get worse before they are ever going to get better. Sadly. The disappearance of the soul, the spirit, the pride of the football club is much more worrying than the disappearance of cash and assets.

 

The Trust could step up to the plate, organise themselves as a go-between between the disaffected fans and the Board and make a proactive case for change in the boardroom, setting out all the reasons for it (including throwing the mud of the conflict of interest issue around) and try to win the hearts and minds of all the supporters - once the support is united this would becoime easier. At the moment, the issue seems to be there is not consensus among the support that the clowns are clowns so Trust are in unenviable position - I wonder if there was an agenda for change how many additional members they would get? As yoda points out above, there are lots of things that can be done, but are we all too beaten and broken from the years of abuse of our club to be bothered to do any of them.

 

Spot on post

[Steven H]

Thats been the plan for years now and it never gets us anywhere because they know the nature of fans is they will keep turning up, they can't be any more unpopular than they are so they tough it out making losses til they get the rest of the ground/propco shares at a discount while the club dies.

 

I never thought any Thistle BoD member would do this when Propco was first mooted, but what's happened since has changed my mind. You identify the first reason for the fans having to do something

 

I have come to the conclusion, and its a sad one to reach, that the only way to save the soul of thistle is to kill the cash flow to the clowns. Things have to get worse before they are ever going to get better. Sadly. The disappearance of the soul, the spirit, the pride of the football club is much more worrying than the disappearance of cash and assets.

 

Killing the cash flow kills the Club, thus giving the BoD a mandate to blame the fans (nice and neat for them if they do intend to get ground/propco shares at a discount. Can it get any worse without going bust? Your last sentence here is spot on but imo its up to us to get all that back...I remember a time when Jags fans were influencial, now apathy rules and it plays into the hands of said BoD members who may want to see the Club die afterall.

 

The Trust could step up to the plate, organise themselves as a go-between between the disaffected fans and the Board and make a proactive case for change in the boardroom, setting out all the reasons for it (including throwing the mud of the conflict of interest issue around) and try to win the hearts and minds of all the supporters - once the support is united this would becoime easier. At the moment, the issue seems to be there is not consensus among the support that the clowns are clowns so Trust are in unenviable position - I wonder if there was an agenda for change how many additional members they would get? As yoda points out above, there are lots of things that can be done, but are we all too beaten and broken from the years of abuse of our club to be bothered to do any of them.

 

I think it's clear that we are on the canvas and the referee is counting, he hasn't got to 10 yet but if we do nothing now we are culpable by proxy and will be out for the count imo. I have a feeling the next 6/12 months will make or break the Club AND the Trust. I think the days of trying to work with the Club are gone, they dont want to work with the fans and the Propco 'closed book' proved that to me, so we as fans need to look at alternative action. I hope the JT can be the vehicle to push this on but due to the apathy towrds that too I doubt it will be.

[Steven H]

Steven it seems that we can agree on something

The turning up late idea is a very plausible one, as is the one where the fans stand at the car park. A few banners would be nice too though. IIRC correctly it was you and your band that made the "We Believe" (gee, that feels like donkeys ago) banner? Even something that simple could help the cause for change.

 

Didnt realise we were disagreeing on the other thread, and as proven on here I am not against a protest type scenario...provided it has substance, organisation and an ultimate goal

 

Yes a few of us put that together and we are taking credit for Harkins late goal at St Js . I agree, that sort of thing could/should be done in conjunction with any 'action', its another small thing that could come together with other things mentioned in this thread.

[Norgethistle]

On your first point, fully understand your reasoning for cherrypicking which games to miss, and that its your perogative.

However, the second point you make is the most worrying and saddest thing about the current situation - sadly, so many of the support has been driven away/turned off by the product on (or off) the park/don't go often nowadays (their boycott wouldn't essentially be noticed), while it seems the majority of those who remain to go to every game or at least 50% of the games a season, are, in my opinion, either too indifferent to the mess we are in or have lost the will to fight and try get at least some of the jokers and clowns on the board out.

 

For some of the support, I feel that as much as some want these useless eejits out, they fear (or even believe it's true?) there really is no one (or collective group of people) who could or would come in to replace them. And so, they are willing to put up with the increasing bull they spout, the diminishing product on the park, and the ruination of our once great stadium.

 

Question is, is there enough collective will amongst the support to organise a number of specific and targetted objectives?

 

These could include:

1. 
    
   
2. getting press coverage on the years of mismanagement
   
3. a substantial boycott of a game (or games), either by
   
   1. 
      
   2. turning up late en-masse, half-way through a first half for instance,
   3. or even all standing (& chanting slogans) in the JHS carpark until after halftime (so the board and their guests get to see large, organised protest),
      
   4. or even a specific game where the protesters agree to boycott a match entirely, thus hitting the club bang in the pocket - if a 1000 boycotted a game, that would be a minimum 10k 'hit'
      

[*] a mass organised sign up to the Jags Trust (or an alternative 'vehicle for change' movement is formed) is made by those wishing change in the boardroom, and by their numbers, demand/force the Trust to change from a nodding puppy or its we-disagree-but-will-do-nothing stance, into a cause for change and demanding hard answers of the Directors (and Propcon), and even ammassing a 'warchest' of funds to be held in an account but not given to the club until such a time as its either used to facilitate the removal of certain board members, or in advance of STJ2 when these imbeciles take us down the road to rack and ruin and desert the sinking ship

[*] Through press and media coverage of protests, as well as their own efforts away from firhill, seek and invite investment/pledges to a 'takeover' fund.

 

Got many more ideas but these are just a quick few off the top of my head. I'm sure others can come up with even better ideas, which would firstly make a number of clear and resounding statements if carried out by a solid and unified group (has to be a substantial number, 20-50, or even 100 would be laughed at/ignored - I feel we need 500, or even up to a 1000 to make a real noise and get noticed and taken seriously), and secondly and more importantly, be the means by which we, the fans, can go about in an organised manner to force (if not wholesale) change in the boardroom, and find ways and means to fund (and run) the club in a way that is better than what has happened in the past decade (and lets be honest, it's hard to imagine how anyone could have run the club worse or made a worse job of the state of the 'stadium' and the surroundings in which we will soon find ourselves watching the Jags at Firhill (that's if we survive long enough with these dual-interest boards (of directors and Propcon).

 

If things go on as they are, I fear I won't have a Thistle to go and see, let alone take my kids to, in 5 years time.

 

Do enough people feel the same, the question, that it is.

 

This will make us a nuisance to the police who in turn will put pressure on the club (instead of letting 2000 punters in over an hour they have to cope with same amount at 1 time), will make us visible to the press and sponsers/guests at hospitality and cause an embarresment to the board (and ensure we all enter to cries of sack the board or whatever be vocal, visible but not overly abusive, keep it clean keep the press sponsers team etc on our side), whilst not starving the club (not the board) of cash and still backing our club our team not theres

[Steven H]

This will make us a nuisance to the police who in turn will put pressure on the club (instead of letting 2000 punters in over an hour they have to cope with same amount at 1 time), will make us visible to the press and sponsers/guests at hospitality and cause an embarresment to the board (and ensure we all enter to cries of sack the board or whatever be vocal, visible but not overly abusive, keep it clean keep the press sponsers team etc on our side), whilst not starving the club (not the board) of cash and still backing our club our team not theres

 

Exactly