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[1 John Lambie]

I agree that Hodge and McStay are very similar, particular with the outcome, but doesn't that say something about the managers judgement?

 

I wouldn't say judgement; but maybe leadership, coaching & motivational ability.

[Guest Argus]

I wouldn't say judgement; but maybe leadership, coaching & motivational ability.

 

So he can spot potential but can't realise it?

Amounts to the same end point, a player who doesn't make it with us.

[1 John Lambie]

So he can spot potential but can't realise it?

Amounts to the same end point, a player who doesn't make it with us.

 

It would appear so, in some cases. Some of the blame has to come down to the player as well. Take McStay as an example, he was always overweight, that's mainly down to him not wanting to get in shape, only so much a manager can do to make a guy take care of himself away from the training field.

[Guest Argus]

It would appear so, in some cases. Some of the blame has to come down to the player as well. Take McStay as an example, he was always overweight, that's mainly down to him not wanting to get in shape, only so much a manager can do to make a guy take care of himself away from the training field.

 

True, but I'm sure you will agree that is only one example.

Plenty of others who have simply failed to make the grade.

[Willjag]

Kevin McKinlay)

I was listening to BBC Scotland's Open-all-mics on Saturday and Chic Young said he seen a very good left back at Cappielow last week playing for Morton who'd unfortunately been injured and couldn't play on Saturday for Morton. How I laughed!

[lady-isobel-barnett]

It would appear so, in some cases. Some of the blame has to come down to the player as well. Take McStay as an example, he was always overweight, that's mainly down to him not wanting to get in shape, only so much a manager can do to make a guy take care of himself away from the training field.

I can fully understand folk comparing the roles of McStay & Hodge. Certainly both have an inabilty to tackle without risking serious injury. But McStay arguably had the quickest feet of any Jags player for many years. Had he shown even half the committment of say Rowson he'd have been a very valuable asset. Hodge on the other hand falls way short of McStay in terms of raw ability but is far more committed.

Sadly the sum of commitment plus ability falls/falled short of what we require/required with both Hodge & McStay.

[Mediocre Pundit]

I can fully understand folk comparing the roles of McStay & Hodge. Certainly both have an inabilty to tackle without risking serious injury. But McStay arguably had the quickest feet of any Jags player for many years. Had he shown even half the committment of say Rowson he'd have been a very valuable asset. Hodge on the other hand falls way short of McStay in terms of raw ability but is far more committed.

Sadly the sum of commitment plus ability falls/falled short of what we require/required with both Hodge & McStay.

Regarding the quick feet comment, I recall a goal McStay set up for Liam against Clyde (4-0 game at home) where he side stepped a couple of challenges with sublime skill. Really thought that day that he'd be our next big player. How wrong...

[kevin energy]

I thought McStay was one skillful players we had in years, just a pity he couldnt apply himself

[lady-isobel-barnett]

I thought McStay was one skillful players we had in years, just a pity he couldnt apply himself

I seem to mind McCall saying he had an even more talented brother who again didn't apply himself.

 

Just a few seasons ago McCall, or it could have been any Jags manager for that matter, had a bit of latitude in his budget to risk on the odd player or two with potential/flair. Even last season Hodge could be considered worth a gamble. Certainly there was little fan criticism of McStay or Hodge early days at Firhill. Criticism is more valid of those sort of players when they don't improve and their potential fails to be realised rather than for the initial signing. When they don't develop management and coaching has to be questioned just as much as the players' application.

[Mr Bunny]

I seem to mind McCall saying he had an even more talented brother who again didn't apply himself.

 

Just a few seasons ago McCall, or it could have been any Jags manager for that matter, had a bit of latitude in his budget to risk on the odd player or two with potential/flair. Even last season Hodge could be considered worth a gamble. Certainly there was little fan criticism of McStay or Hodge early days at Firhill. Criticism is more valid of those sort of players when they don't improve and their potential fails to be realised rather than for the initial signing. When they don't develop management and coaching has to be questioned just as much as the players' application.

 

Your last point is valid but you can only judge by how much our management were at fault rather than the player if they go to another club and become better there. Not that that's an absolute guide - a guy could fail with us and go to another club with poor management or he could fail with us and realise he wasted a chance and needs to screw the nut and succeeds ...

 

... so I guess what I'm saying is you can't really tell. Maybe the only guide is if a number of young players come through and improve over several years - and the number of failures is small.

[lady-isobel-barnett]

Your last point is valid but you can only judge by how much our management were at fault rather than the player if they go to another club and become better there. Not that that's an absolute guide - a guy could fail with us and go to another club with poor management or he could fail with us and realise he wasted a chance and needs to screw the nut and succeeds ...

 

... so I guess what I'm saying is you can't really tell. Maybe the only guide is if a number of young players come through and improve over several years - and the number of failures is small.

Good points but I think there's a crucial age when if a player with potential doesn't improve he's unlikely to do so later on. With little or no reserve football these days those younger players can go months without competitive football. That must be a severe hindrance in their development.

Edited August 31, 2010 by lady-isobel-barnett

[Mr Bunny]

Good points but I think there's a crucial age when if a player with potential doesn't improve he's unlikely to do so later on. With little or no reserve football these days those younger players can go months without competitive football. That must be a severe hindrance in their development.

 

That seems a good point too ... and it's something the footballing bodies could do soemthign about by setting up more (maybe regional) competitons for youth teams - and maybe putting some of the money they make (well the SPL and the SFA anyway) into it to encourage entry.