Paddy Thistle Posted December 8, 2010 Report Share Posted December 8, 2010 At the time I hated Berties negative style of play due to thinking we were capable of winning more but in his time we won Division 1, Played in two Scottish Cup Semi Finals and One League Cup Semi Final and remained in the Premier League.. I have also memories of us being very near the top if not top of the league around about Oct / November in 78. Against Rangers in the first semi final we were robbed, still to the day I'm convinced Bobby Houston's goal should have stood, I remember going mental in the Old North Terracing at Hampden and watching the linesman raise his flag after the ball hit the back of the net. Ironically if we had got through we would have came up against HIbs in the final who we demolished 6-1 at Firhill in a midweek game a few weeks after the semi final I also remember when Bertie stepped back in to save us, his first game back was down at Killie which we won and Bertie hanging out the car window waving to all the supporters buses as they headed back up the A77. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muscat Jag Posted December 8, 2010 Report Share Posted December 8, 2010 The whole defensive thing under Bertie has always been a bit of a myth for me. Off the top of my head I can recall 6-1 Hibs, 5-1 St Mirren and 4-3 Rangers(twice). The two main reasons we were relatively strong throughout the 70s (under both Auld and McParland) was that we consistently produced fantastic defenders and strikers. On occassion we unquestionably had the best defensive unit in Scotland. However, Ronnie Glavin apart, we never managed to get the same quality in midfield. Perhaps a little unfair on the likes of Ian Gibson but generally our midfield was full of very mediocre players. On many occassions we would be simply outplayed, couldn't be broken down and have a Somner/Craig/Melrose/MacAdam etc. to pinch a goal. I wasn't complaining then and I wouldn't be complaining now if the Jags stole the points. Ibrox and Parkhead were the only grounds that we went to and truly set up ultra defensive. My own personal opinion is the Bertie's side from about 77-79 was the best Jags team that I have seen. It all started to unravel after we were cheated out of the 79 cup final against an already relegated Hibs (I think the final was only about a fortnight after the 6-1 game). Amazing how you can remain bitter for over 30 years. The best manager debate is difficult. In many ways John Lambie has to be considered the best, having taken two seperate teams from real low-points in Jags history and putting them in the premier league. Davie McParland did something similar on one occassion and of course gave us the greatest day in our history. Bertie in truth inherited a very good squad from him but I seem to recall he did manage to achieve a 5th place finish during his time. My main problem with Lambie was his neglect of youth development. Our youth policy in the 70s was the cornerstone of our success and I would dearly love to see a return to those days (excepting flared trousers, of course). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazy davie Posted December 8, 2010 Report Share Posted December 8, 2010 Our youth policy in the 70s was the cornerstone of our success and I would dearly love to see a return to those days (excepting flared trousers, of course). True. In those days we used to watch the Reserves a lot, and we always used to (half-)joke that the first-teamers were in the first team cos they couldn't get into the Reserve team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bunny Posted December 8, 2010 Report Share Posted December 8, 2010 (edited) At the time I hated Berties negative style of play due to thinking we were capable of winning more but in his time we won Division 1, Played in two Scottish Cup Semi Finals and One League Cup Semi Final and remained in the Premier League.. I have also memories of us being very near the top if not top of the league around about Oct / November in 78. I seem to remember we were 2nd or 3rd in the league at the turn of 1977 - the year after we got promoted - then there was a freeze and we didn't play for weeks and were rubbish after that but had enough points so we stayed up comfortably. PS I know something like that happened in the 60s but it definitely happened in the 70s too - we'd such a great run at the time, guys I knew who never bothered going to see Thistle turned up to see us. I think the game before we got frozen out was a home win against Ayr. Edited December 8, 2010 by Mr Bunny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muscat Jag Posted December 8, 2010 Report Share Posted December 8, 2010 I seem to remember we were 2nd or 3rd in the league at the turn of 1977 - the year after we got promoted - then there was a freeze and we didn't play for weeks and were rubbish after that but had enough points so we stayed up comfortably. PS I know something like that happened in the 60s but it definitely happened in the 70s too - we'd such a great run at the time, guys I knew who never bothered going to see Thistle turned up to see us. I think the game before we got frozen out was a home win against Ayr. We did have an incredible run one season, could have been 1977, that started with a 1-0 win against Celtic and we had a run when we almost beat everone in the league, excepting a 3-3 draw(presumably not so defensive that day) at Ibrox. Alex MacDonald scored an equalizer at the death; I was heartbroken, would have been my first victory at Ibrox. The run ended with a 1-0 win against Aberdeen. Brilliant day, 12,000 inside Firhill and we went 2nd top in December. The next game at Parkhead, basically after completing a full quarter cycle of fixtures, against the league leaders and I clearly remember that a victory would have have put us top of the premier league at Xmas. Wasn't to be though; humped 3-0 and a pretty dramtic loss of form followed. Heady days though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winter of '63 Posted December 8, 2010 Report Share Posted December 8, 2010 I seem to remember we were 2nd or 3rd in the league at the turn of 1977 - the year after we got promoted - then there was a freeze and we didn't play for weeks and were rubbish after that but had enough points so we stayed up comfortably. PS I know something like that happened in the 60s but it definitely happened in the 70s too - we'd such a great run at the time, guys I knew who never bothered going to see Thistle turned up to see us. I think the game before we got frozen out was a home win against Ayr. We lost 2-1 Rangers at Firhill at New Year '78 in a top of the table clash - their winner was "scored" by Gordon Smith...though the TV replay clearly showed the ball hadn't crossed the line. Unusually, Rangers benefitted from a refereeing decision there. I think the following season, we were again near the top of the League in November, but both years our form shaded in the latter part of the season - similar to '62/63. I was too young to know what a League was in '62/63 - my dad took me to my first game at Firhill that season - so I don't if there was a genuine feeling that we could win the League that year but I don't think that any Thistle fan really believed we were realistic title contenders under Bertie...though we had a very good team. Although John Lambie's record is head and shoulders above any other manager at Firhill over the last 30 years, in my view David McParland was better by a considerable distance. In 1970, the club was relegated for the first time in its history; within eighteen months, playing exciting attacking football we had won the Second Division in style, beaten Rangers & Celtic, won a major trophy with the most sensational result in Scottish Football History and the 5-1 League Cup Quarter Final win against St Johnstone and the 8-3 victory against Motherwell were as good as it will ever get at Firhill. Bertie Auld's side also won the First Division impressively at the first attempt...whereas in 1999/2000, Lambie's side could only finish fifth in the Second Division - that's worse than Dick Campbell As has been said, Lambie's main fault was his failure to bring through young talent - under McParland, no less than nine Thistle youngsters were good enough to go on to play for Scotland...under Lambie, the only youngsters who were good enough to play for Thistle were Tom Smith and Isaac English. I rest my case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muscat Jag Posted December 8, 2010 Report Share Posted December 8, 2010 Generally agree Wo63 but think you are being a little unfair about John Lambie's second spell. 5th in the second was actually marginal progess from the previous season. The sucessive championships and retaining premier league status that followed were a remarkable achievement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
partickthedog Posted December 8, 2010 Report Share Posted December 8, 2010 We did have an incredible run one season, could have been 1977, that started with a 1-0 win against Celtic and we had a run when we almost beat everone in the league, excepting a 3-3 draw(presumably not so defensive that day) at Ibrox. Alex MacDonald scored an equalizer at the death; I was heartbroken, would have been my first victory at Ibrox. The run ended with a 1-0 win against Aberdeen. Brilliant day, 12,000 inside Firhill and we went 2nd top in December. The next game at Parkhead, basically after completing a full quarter cycle of fixtures, against the league leaders and I clearly remember that a victory would have have put us top of the premier league at Xmas. Wasn't to be though; humped 3-0 and a pretty dramtic loss of form followed. Heady days though. I remember the 1-0 win at Firhill against Aberdeen that put us 2nd top of the League. Joe Harper was playing for them. Just after that University study cranked up a notch and I also met my future wife, the result being that I disappeared from Firhill for 18 years. My absence seemed to coincide with a decline in Thistle's fortunes! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bunny Posted December 8, 2010 Report Share Posted December 8, 2010 Although John Lambie's record is head and shoulders above any other manager at Firhill over the last 30 years, in my view David McParland was better by a considerable distance. In 1970, the club was relegated for the first time in its history; within eighteen months, playing exciting attacking football we had won the Second Division in style, beaten Rangers & Celtic, won a major trophy with the most sensational result in Scottish Football History and the 5-1 League Cup Quarter Final win against St Johnstone and the 8-3 victory against Motherwell were as good as it will ever get at Firhill. I rest my case. Like most fans I'm sure, I don't know McParland personally but apparently a very nice guy. From what I've heard though (which being hearsay may be a load of old rubbish) too nice/soft to be a manager. So it's said he could only work with youngsters as he wasn't tough enough to handle a team full of old pros (like for instance, Lambie). Mind you his success was even more incredible if that was true. I'd guess the truth is more likely to be that he was bound to find it impossible to repeat the success he had with a unique bunch of youngsters and couldn't keep the enthusiasm going for more mundane football tasks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted December 9, 2010 Report Share Posted December 9, 2010 Like most fans I'm sure, I don't know McParland personally but apparently a very nice guy. From what I've heard though (which being hearsay may be a load of old rubbish) too nice/soft to be a manager. So it's said he could only work with youngsters as he wasn't tough enough to handle a team full of old pros (like for instance, Lambie). Mind you his success was even more incredible if that was true. I'd guess the truth is more likely to be that he was bound to find it impossible to repeat the success he had with a unique bunch of youngsters and couldn't keep the enthusiasm going for more mundane football tasks. Wrong, I think. The reason for McParland's departure is pretty well known, and it was down to honour. He had been promised by the board that Hugh Strachan would be retained in a coaching role when he retired from playing, but then the board reneged on their agreement (what a surprise!). McParland's moral standards were simply too high, so he did what he thought was best. Of course he went on to have a fairly successful career in management, coaching and scouting afterwards, though it's true that he never replicated the dizzying heights of that 2-year period with Thistle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trigger's Bucky Bottle Posted December 9, 2010 Report Share Posted December 9, 2010 Had a great wee chat with Bertie about his time at Thistle a few months back..... Bertie had his hand in more or less everything in the running of the club, He told me when he was leaving that Thistle were around 500k in the black, at a time when the ugly sisters and many other clubs were in the red... One wish he had when he left to go to Hibs was that they didn't appoint Peter Cormack as manager.....!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted December 9, 2010 Report Share Posted December 9, 2010 Had a great wee chat with Bertie about his time at Thistle a few months back..... Bertie had his hand in more or less everything in the running of the club, He told me when he was leaving that Thistle were around 500k in the black, at a time when the ugly sisters and many other clubs were in the red... One wish he had when he left to go to Hibs was that they didn't appoint Peter Cormack as manager.....!! All these years later I still look upon the appointment of Cormack as the start of a mostly steady decline in our power and status. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bunny Posted December 9, 2010 Report Share Posted December 9, 2010 All these years later I still look upon the appointment of Cormack as the start of a mostly steady decline in our power and status. I've always thought Cormack got a pretty bad deal from a lot of our fans. I don't think Cormack ever got the support from the board that Auld got - good players left the club, particularly good forwards but were never properly replaced and that I think got us relegated. Our problems became worse because at a time when we looked odds on to get promoted back to the top flight (with decent squad but lacking depth) we sold Mo Johnston - I don't care if we wouldn't have got as much for him later on, if we'd got back to the Premier league years of struggle we went through could have been missed. We didn't go up, most of the experienced, good players left us and we struggled for a decade despite the cash we got for Johnston (which must have been the equivalent of about a million in today's money) never put out a decent team until Lambie arrived. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuthejag Posted December 9, 2010 Report Share Posted December 9, 2010 At the time I hated Berties negative style of play due to thinking we were capable of winning more but in his time we won Division 1, Played in two Scottish Cup Semi Finals and One League Cup Semi Final and remained in the Premier League.. I have also memories of us being very near the top if not top of the league around about Oct / November in 78. Against Rangers in the first semi final we were robbed, still to the day I'm convinced Bobby Houston's goal should have stood, I remember going mental in the Old North Terracing at Hampden and watching the linesman raise his flag after the ball hit the back of the net. Ironically if we had got through we would have came up against HIbs in the final who we demolished 6-1 at Firhill in a midweek game a few weeks after the semi final I also remember when Bertie stepped back in to save us, his first game back was down at Killie which we won and Bertie hanging out the car window waving to all the supporters buses as they headed back up the A77. Bertie left for Hibs in Dec 1980 but I wondered if you can ID anybody in these pics? Early 1980 Youth Team or the few unknowns in this one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted December 10, 2010 Report Share Posted December 10, 2010 Bertie left for Hibs in Dec 1980 but I wondered if you can ID anybody in these pics? Early 1980 Youth Team Front row, 2nd from the right: Martin Chivers. Who's the youth with the dashing moustache in the middle row? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beep0608 Posted December 10, 2010 Author Report Share Posted December 10, 2010 Bertie left for Hibs in Dec 1980 but I wondered if you can ID anybody in these pics? Early 1980 Youth Team or the few unknowns in this one Jings. Is that Andy Walker? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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