joejag Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 I'm not trying to be rude, but what exactly is this prediction based on? We managed 3 unconvincing (in general) one-goal wins in this group, and they were against two teams who are considerably worse than any of the teams we have in the 2014 qualifiers. As Uberteeb mentions, Wales have the likes of Bale and Ramsey, and they are the team we got from the 6th pot. Belgium are one of the most improved teams in Europe and are some people's prediction to win the group, we will lose in Macedonia, and all this is before we even get to the top two seeds in the group. We have an atrocious record in Eastern Europe, and will more than likely get nothing from Croatia or Serbia away. Levein says we are improving, but then he has to, as if we weren't he would be staring at the exit door. I don't see it, he's clutching at straws. We don't have any decent centre backs and if Miller isn't playing, we don't have a decent lone striker - which is unfortunate, given the 4-5-1 formation. NO DECENT LONE STRIKER? After his recent performances I think Makhail-Smith has proved himself able for that role, and we still have Goodwillie, with Jordan Rhodes knocking on the door from U-21s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrantB Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 NO DECENT LONE STRIKER? After his recent performances I think Makhail-Smith has proved himself able for that role, and we still have Goodwillie, with Jordan Rhodes knocking on the door from U-21s. We have a couple of decent SCOTTISH strikers in McCormack and Fletcher. However, the idiot that is managing Scotland wont pick either of them. Jordan Rhodes playing for Scotland is a disgrace. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joejag Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 We have a couple of decent SCOTTISH strikers in McCormack and Fletcher. However, the idiot that is managing Scotland wont pick either of them. Jordan Rhodes playing for Scotland is a disgrace. Why??????????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrantB Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 Why??????????? Jordan Rhodes is English, son of English goalie Andy Rhodes. He qualifies for us because he went to school here. Call me old fashioned but I'd like to see some Scottish guys get a chance first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambies Lost Doo Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 Spanish first goal. 41 passes and 1 shot . http://s5.as.com/recorte/20111012dasdasftb_12/XLCO/Ies/20111012dasdasftb_12.jpg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
general george Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 We have a couple of decent SCOTTISH strikers in McCormack and Fletcher. However, the idiot that is managing Scotland wont pick either of them. Jordan Rhodes playing for Scotland is a disgrace. Levein also does not be able to accept criticism, particularly over his tactics in Prague and this is ultimately what has cost us in this qualifying group. He is also acting very childishly over Steven Fletcher. He is never an international manager! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bunny Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 (edited) Jordan Rhodes is English, son of English goalie Andy Rhodes. He qualifies for us because he went to school here. Call me old fashioned but I'd like to see some Scottish guys get a chance first. Which means he must have lived here for quite a few years when he was young. Do immigrants not qualify if they want to be Scottish? I think that's reasonable, even if to get a career he moves down to England. Better I think than someone who's lived in another country all their lfe and qualify by a great-grandparent or something. I see Mackail-Smith qualified by having a Scottish grandmother. As for why the latter's picked ahead of McCormack because, given the manager's tactics, he can play one up front a lot better. McCormack for me isn't really a target man - needs one to play off of I think. But anyway whether you agree with the tactics or not the manager must play the best players for the tactical setup and since the rules allow guys like Mackail-Smith to play then he must select him if you think he's best for the system. The Fletcher thing I think is as much Fletcher's fault as it is Levein's - both too pig-headed to climb down for the sake of the team. Fletcher can play as a lone striker too. Edited October 13, 2011 by Mr Bunny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted October 13, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 Spanish first goal. 41 passes and 1 shot . http://s5.as.com/recorte/20111012dasdasftb_12/XLCO/Ies/20111012dasdasftb_12.jpg Great illustration. Looks like a tube/metro plan! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uberteeb Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 Darren Fletcher? And dont forget we pished all over Wales in the Celtic Cup. We'll be there or thereabouts come then end of the WC qualifiers. Darren Fletcher is a solid dependable midfielder who slots well into a brilliant Man United team allowing their top players to play well. He is no more than that and we all know is not very effective for Scotland because he is not supposed to be the centre of attention, he is the worker. Gareth Bale is one of the most exciting talents in world football, great shot, unbelievable pace and can beat a man all day long. Aaron Ramsey is a better player than Jack Wilshere who only got a look in after Ramset got snapped a couple of season back. He is coming back into form and despite being so young is a key part of the attacking and fluent element of one of the best attacking teams in the world. Oh and lest we forget when he single handidly destroyed Scotland as a 17 year old. Bellamy is miles better than Miller as well. The rest of the players are much of a muchness in terms of how good they are and the level they play at, with the exception of Adam who is the best of the rest. The Celtic Cup, oh yeah that top tournament when everyone was playing thier best team and tryng their hardest? Right now Wales are a far better team than Scotland both on paper and on recent form. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackpool Jags Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 (edited) In addition to the Prague debacle, I don't at any time recall any semblance of an explanation or justification as to why Charlie Adam made his first appearance of the campaign at half time during the Spain game at Hampden. Adam, who at the time, had been setting the EPL alight with his much lauded performances for Blackpool, warmed the bench throughout the Lithuania game when we weren't exactly hammering them, then did likewise in Prague, not even making it into the 6 that master tactician, Levein, chose to impede the Czechs. Adam followed these two benchings with another half of the same before being honoured with 45 second half minutes against the world champions. All reports these days. of course, refer to Charlie Adam as 'an established member of the Scotland team', and rightly so, but what on earth was Levein thinking about when benching Adam for the first three qualifiers? The point's been well made, I think, that our hopes of qualification were effectively dashed by the third, or even second game. Levein must surely shoulder the bulk of the blame for this. I think the very kindest words I could offer in his favour would be that he's a very slow learner and that at least half the time he doesn't get it at all. I really don't see any merit in keeping him on for the next failure. It's the right time now to begin the laborious process of seeking out his successor. Edited October 13, 2011 by Blackpool Jags Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joejag Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 Darren Fletcher is a solid dependable midfielder who slots well into a brilliant Man United team allowing their top players to play well. He is no more than that and we all know is not very effective for Scotland because he is not supposed to be the centre of attention, he is the worker. Gareth Bale is one of the most exciting talents in world football, great shot, unbelievable pace and can beat a man all day long. Aaron Ramsey is a better player than Jack Wilshere who only got a look in after Ramset got snapped a couple of season back. He is coming back into form and despite being so young is a key part of the attacking and fluent element of one of the best attacking teams in the world. Oh and lest we forget when he single handidly destroyed Scotland as a 17 year old. Bellamy is miles better than Miller as well. The rest of the players are much of a muchness in terms of how good they are and the level they play at, with the exception of Adam who is the best of the rest. The Celtic Cup, oh yeah that top tournament when everyone was playing thier best team and tryng their hardest? Right now Wales are a far better team than Scotland both on paper and on recent form. WELL!!!!!! Thank **** we dont play on paper?????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joejag Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 In addition to the Prague debacle, I don't at any time recall any semblance of an explanation or justification as to why Charlie Adam made his first appearance of the campaign at half time during the Spain game at Hampden. Adam, who at the time, had been setting the EPL alight with his much lauded performances for Blackpool, warmed the bench throughout the Lithuania game when we weren't exactly hammering them, then did likewise in Prague, not even making it into the 6 that master tactician, Levein, chose to impede the Czechs. Adam followed these two benchings with another half of the same before being honoured with 45 second half minutes against the world champions. All reports these days. of course, refer to Charlie Adam as 'an established member of the Scotland team', and rightly so, but what on earth was Levein thinking about when benching Adam for the first three qualifiers? The point's been well made, I think, that our hopes of qualification were effectively dashed by the third, or even second game. Levein must surely shoulder the bulk of the blame for this. I think the very kindest words I could offer in his favour would be that he's a very slow learner and that at least half the time he doesn't get it at all. I really don't see any merit in keeping him on for the next failure. It's the right time now to begin the laborious process of seeking out his successor. This is NOT the time for a new manager. God;s sake we CANNOT keep sacking managers because WE think we are better than we are. He is rebuilding feom a poor base and its obvious the players WANT to play for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hebridean jag Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 The team is now better than the one he inherited. It`s better going forward and has a better and recognised shape throughout. Continued improvement is the only criteria on which the man`s performance can be judged. I honestly find the personal vitriol directed against levein on this site more than a little strange. It`s as if some kind of campaign is ongoing that has no basis in reality and is based almost entirely on personal dislikes of an individual. Don`t know what he`s done to GrantB but read back to his offerings on this and similar threads and then ask where reasoned argument is involved. Prague was a mistake, it`s in the past and was at the start of the man`s stewardship. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrantB Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 The team is now better than the one he inherited. It`s better going forward and has a better and recognised shape throughout. Continued improvement is the only criteria on which the man`s performance can be judged. I honestly find the personal vitriol directed against levein on this site more than a little strange. It`s as if some kind of campaign is ongoing that has no basis in reality and is based almost entirely on personal dislikes of an individual. Don`t know what he`s done to GrantB but read back to his offerings on this and similar threads and then ask where reasoned argument is involved. Prague was a mistake, it`s in the past and was at the start of the man`s stewardship. I dont like the guy purely on what he has done and how he has conducted himself in the job. I dislike him in the same way I disliked Dick Campbell when he managed us. In fact I see similarities between the 2 as I think Levein is incapable of admitting to his own mistakes and is content to hide behind the refereeing decisions in the Czech game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hebridean jag Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 (edited) I dont like the guy purely on what he has done and how he has conducted himself in the job. I dislike him in the same way I disliked Dick Campbell when he managed us. In fact I see similarities between the 2 as I think Levein is incapable of admitting to his own mistakes and is content to hide behind the refereeing decisions in the Czech game. So when does the dislike end? Is that it for you or will you like him if we have a good World Cup campaign? What possible bearing does his willingness to admit mistakes have on his ability to shape and select a team? As for the decisions in the Czech game, to me he has`nt made much of it since his understandable frustration at the end of that particular match and his sentiments were shared by the Dutch FA who binned the guy from their A list based mainly on his performance that day. Sorry to tie you down and undermine your personal feelings about the man but do you think that the current team is better than the one he took over? Edited October 13, 2011 by hebridean jag Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrantB Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 So when does the dislike end? Is that it for you or will you like him if we have a good World Cup campaign? What possible bearing does his willingness to admit mistakes have on his ability to shape and select a team? As for the decisions in the Czech game, to me he has`nt made much of it since his understandable frustration at the end of that particular match and his sentiments were shared by the Dutch FA who binned the guy from their A list based mainly on his performance that day. Sorry to tie you down and undermine your personal feelings about the man but do you think that the current team is better than the one he took over? The manager has far better options available to him than Burley did but still doesn't pick the best team available. As Blackpool Jags has already pointed out, it has taken him until very recently to put Charlie Adam in the team despite the fact that he was one of the best players in the Premiership last season. Levein made the country a laughing stock with his near inability to beat Liechtenstein AT HOME and with his tactics in Prague. He's hardly set the heather on fire in any of the qualifying games, hanging grimly on for a 1-0 at home to a very poor Lithuania and scraping a 1-0 in Liechtenstein. Don't let the Dutch ref blind you to the fact that we should have been 2-0 down at half time to again a very average Czech side or his tactical blunder in putting Danny Wilson on at left back with the score at 1-0. Still, if you are happy, that's fine. Personally, I think Scotland deserve better as Thistle deserved better when we had DC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanarkjag Posted October 13, 2011 Report Share Posted October 13, 2011 (edited) Levein wasn't an inspired choice, for me, when he was appointed although my opinion is (very) slowly changing. I think we are beginning to see some improvement in the way Scotland play. Yes he has made mistakes but I believe he is beginning to learn from them. I still don't understand why certain players are not included with the squad. McCormack, Steven Fletcher, Gary O'Conner, Chris Burke (why has he made himself unavailable) to name but a few. These are guys who, while not being world class, are certainly as good as, if not better than what we have got already. Can't Levein sit down with them and sort out his problems with these players? We have the makings of a good side here, I think Levein deserves the next qualification campaign to prove he can do it. If not, that wil be the time to call for his head. Edited October 13, 2011 by Lanarkjag Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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