potty trained Posted February 9, 2012 Report Share Posted February 9, 2012 Not seen this mentioned anywhere else, and seems quite important... http://www.ptfc.co.uk/news/2011-2012/february_2012/ian_cameron_departs Disappointed to hear this news. All the best in the future, Ian. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaleGreySky Posted February 9, 2012 Report Share Posted February 9, 2012 Probably because we loan in other teams mediocre, soon to be released youth players rather than playing our own. Don't blame him. Also, replacing him with Alan Archibald screams 'jobs for the boys' - since when did he have any knowledge of technique with a football? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted February 9, 2012 Report Share Posted February 9, 2012 (edited) Probably because we loan in other teams mediocre, soon to be released youth players rather than playing our own. Don't blame him. Also, replacing him with Alan Archibald screams 'jobs for the boys' - since when did he have any knowledge of technique with a football? Above post is right but in such a completely wrong way. Ian leaving was surely no surprise? He did a fine job no doubt but you didn't have to read too much between the lines to know Ian wouldn't be staying. As far as I'm aware Archie is already taking the Under 19s and has been involved in the coaching side for a wee while now. I don't know how far on he is with his badge but I'm sure I heard he has been attending the SFA coaching,school. Not sure that Archie's inability to pass a ball would affect his chances of being an effective coach. Plenty of extremely successful coaches never had much in the way of playing ability., . Edited February 9, 2012 by lady-isobel-barnett Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaleGreySky Posted February 9, 2012 Report Share Posted February 9, 2012 Well the post on the Club website is the first I've heard on it, and I don't see which lines I'm meant to be reading between. Am I not correct in thinking we just lost a really good youth coach without seemingly giving any reason at all? He was one of the only good things going on right now. Am I meant to put two and two together and come up with we let him go because we can't afford a youth system? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twinny Posted February 9, 2012 Report Share Posted February 9, 2012 Well the post on the Club website is the first I've heard on it, and I don't see which lines I'm meant to be reading between. Am I not correct in thinking we just lost a really good youth coach without seemingly giving any reason at all? He was one of the only good things going on right now. Am I meant to put two and two together and come up with we let him go because we can't afford a youth system? I think he might be focussing on his full time job, which might be the reading between the lines LIB meant. Either that or we're looking to have the players share even more jobs to cut down on the wage bill, which is a sad but perhaps necessary move. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaleGreySky Posted February 9, 2012 Report Share Posted February 9, 2012 So, with our youth coach leaving and the players coming through not being given game time, we are effectively without a reputation for youth development again? The only constant variable is Gerry Britton. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted February 9, 2012 Report Share Posted February 9, 2012 I didn't really want to go into this as I'm only surmising but I owe PGS an explanation. By my thinking Ian has brought thru a good number of youngsters who have showed potential (namely Burns, Bannigan, Fraser, Campbell & MacBeth). Jackie agrees these players show potential but are not in his opinion 1st team ready (I don't need to repeat his comments yet again). This is backed up with the fact he's put three of those players out on loan and is bringing in other club's players of a similar age in on loan whilst our players get hopefully up to speed. Now I'm not saying Ian hasn't done a great job but I do think there's a strong probability that there's a clash of opinion of a technical nature between Cameron & McNamara most likely concerning approach to basics. I might of course be way off the mark but I would think that getting our home grown youths ready to step into the first team as quickly as possible rather than having to be sent out on loan.would be a priority. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry1876 Posted February 9, 2012 Report Share Posted February 9, 2012 I know Ian a bit, what I can say is- he was interviewed for the manager position last year, obviously didn't get it, Jackie did. He accepted that but asked to go down to under-17s because he felt that was the squad he could have most influence over with the whole squad training with him thorugh the week ahead of games. With the 19s some are in during the day only a handful train at night, there was no consistency and it wasn't the best use of his time. He did push through players like Burns, Bannigan etc but he only got them in quite late in their development, most of them had previously been released from other clubs round about, but he felt if he could coach the kids at 14/15/16 they would have more chance. Also, when he was involved in the first team on matchdays he provided that link for the young players who made the step into the first team, but as he isn't in on matchdays anymore. He has decided to step away and look for another opportunity to coach, and is particularly looking to work towards a first team manager position, in which I personally wish him luck... apparently a big job down South is up for grabs just now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
potty trained Posted February 9, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 9, 2012 I know Ian a bit, what I can say is- he was interviewed for the manager position last year, obviously didn't get it, Jackie did. He accepted that but asked to go down to under-17s because he felt that was the squad he could have most influence over with the whole squad training with him thorugh the week ahead of games. With the 19s some are in during the day only a handful train at night, there was no consistency and it wasn't the best use of his time. He did push through players like Burns, Bannigan etc but he only got them in quite late in their development, most of them had previously been released from other clubs round about, but he felt if he could coach the kids at 14/15/16 they would have more chance. Also, when he was involved in the first team on matchdays he provided that link for the young players who made the step into the first team, but as he isn't in on matchdays anymore. He has decided to step away and look for another opportunity to coach, and is particularly looking to work towards a first team manager position, in which I personally wish him luck... apparently a big job down South is up for grabs just now cheers barry, interesting, and disappointing news. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted February 9, 2012 Report Share Posted February 9, 2012 I know Ian a bit, what I can say is- he was interviewed for the manager position last year, obviously didn't get it, Jackie did. He accepted that but asked to go down to under-17s because he felt that was the squad he could have most influence over with the whole squad training with him thorugh the week ahead of games. With the 19s some are in during the day only a handful train at night, there was no consistency and it wasn't the best use of his time. He did push through players like Burns, Bannigan etc but he only got them in quite late in their development, most of them had previously been released from other clubs round about, but he felt if he could coach the kids at 14/15/16 they would have more chance. Also, when he was involved in the first team on matchdays he provided that link for the young players who made the step into the first team, but as he isn't in on matchdays anymore. He has decided to step away and look for another opportunity to coach, and is particularly looking to work towards a first team manager position, in which I personally wish him luck... apparently a big job down South is up for grabs just now Thanks for that. Certainly appears far more accurate than my guesswork, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fawlty Towers Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 Quote from Jackie in the preview for tomorrow's game: "Ideally we want to be bringing through our own young players rather than loaning players from elsewhere and we are working very hard at making sure that we have the kind of youth structure in place that will allow us to do that." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rodge Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 He maybe left after the under 17s were beaten 12-1 by rangers..See there has been no mention on offical site about result in glasgow cup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mediocre Pundit Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 Reading between the lines, I think it's clear that McNamara doesn't agree with the way Cameron has coached our youth players - there have been plenty of comments along those lines (such as in today's match preview) plus none have been deemed good enough so far. I trust that McNamara sees potential in Archie as a good youth coach hence the role, albeit I'm sure budget constraints have something to do with this too. I was chatting to a guy in work about this today. I would genuinely be content (note Chicofan, not happy) with a few more years in the first division on a plastic pitch where all teams played and trained on it, with rental income and ideally income from a ground share, if I saw us playing attractive football and bringing through one or two players per year who we could potentially sell on for a fee. The SPL is shite anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrantB Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 If we could actually keep a decent grass surface then I wouldn't be in favour of a plastic pitch. However, it seems every year no matter how hard the groundstaff work at it, our pitch ends up like a total quagmire. Having a plastic pitch might mean that we are able to play the passing game we are always told that we are aiming to play. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
northernsoul Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 Reading between the lines, I think it's clear that McNamara doesn't agree with the way Cameron has coached our youth players - there have been plenty of comments along those lines (such as in today's match preview) plus none have been deemed good enough so far. I don't think it's clear at all. Are you suggesting Cameron was punted because he wasn't doing his job properly, even though he played an integral part in our under 19s team winning the Youth Cup finl in 2010? Sad to see him go, as I'm sure (my assumption here) everyone at the Club is too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armand2 Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 I don't think it's clear at all. Are you suggesting Cameron was punted because he wasn't doing his job properly, even though he played an integral part in our under 19s team winning the Youth Cup finl in 2010? Sad to see him go, as I'm sure (my assumption here) everyone at the Club is too. I think it is fair comment to suggest that there appears to have been a conflict of opinion between Jackie and Cameron with regards to the development of our young players. I don't think anyone is suggesting Cameron wasn't doing his job "properly" - just not in the way Jackie feels is the most effective for nurturing our players. Whilst it was certainly a great achievement, the youth cup win cannot be used as any hallmark of Cameron's competence when it comes to developing players. Indeed, of the winning side that day, a number of them have since moved on - and not to a higher level as far as I'm aware. In fact, Cameron's contribution to the development of the players in that squad could be questioned considering he was only promoted to Under 19 manager for the 2009/2010 season. I agree, as you point out, that Cameron did a relatively good job in his position but the calibre of player coming through at the moment is mediocre, to say the least. As it has also been pointed out, this shortfall cannot be placed on Cameron's shoulders, seeing as the players in question didn't arrive at the club until later on in their development. However, Jackie seems to have very set ideas on what is expected of a young player - he seems to mention "good habits" regularly - and I think it is fair to suggest that this is perhaps where a conflict arose with Cameron. Anyway, onwards and upwards. All the best to Cameron, decent servant to the club and I hope, even if there was a conflict of opinion, that his departure was amicable and he won't be a stranger down Firhill way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry1876 Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 The important thing now is how the Youth Development system develops going forward. It's all very well the manager throwing lots of comments out about our current young players not being good enough, but such a important part of his job is to take the players who are good at the youth level and turn them into first team players, that never comes handed on a plate. Also, he has attended next to no youth games this season and hasn't spoke to the any of the youth coaches about what it is he wants. When you look at what Cameron achieved each season he won the u-19 cup, took that team the next season to the final I think of the reserve cup, and finished close second in the u17 league this year. At the beginning of any youth system being able to compete for titles and win cups is so vital in attracting the top talent to our club. It will take years until we are truely developing our own product, but what Cameron was clearly good at was taking any standard of player, creating an environment where the players would run through a brick wall for him and where they probably over achieved. At the end of the day it's Jackie's job that will be on the line so we have to trust he will bring in coaches he trusts, for want of a better word, to do the job, let's just hope we keep moving forward because in the current state of Scottish football this is the only way ahead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mediocre Pundit Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 I think it is fair comment to suggest that there appears to have been a conflict of opinion between Jackie and Cameron with regards to the development of our young players. I don't think anyone is suggesting Cameron wasn't doing his job "properly" - just not in the way Jackie feels is the most effective for nurturing our players. Whilst it was certainly a great achievement, the youth cup win cannot be used as any hallmark of Cameron's competence when it comes to developing players. Indeed, of the winning side that day, a number of them have since moved on - and not to a higher level as far as I'm aware. In fact, Cameron's contribution to the development of the players in that squad could be questioned considering he was only promoted to Under 19 manager for the 2009/2010 season. I agree, as you point out, that Cameron did a relatively good job in his position but the calibre of player coming through at the moment is mediocre, to say the least. As it has also been pointed out, this shortfall cannot be placed on Cameron's shoulders, seeing as the players in question didn't arrive at the club until later on in their development. However, Jackie seems to have very set ideas on what is expected of a young player - he seems to mention "good habits" regularly - and I think it is fair to suggest that this is perhaps where a conflict arose with Cameron. Anyway, onwards and upwards. All the best to Cameron, decent servant to the club and I hope, even if there was a conflict of opinion, that his departure was amicable and he won't be a stranger down Firhill way. Exactly what I was getting at. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicofan Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 Reading between the lines, I think it's clear that McNamara doesn't agree with the way Cameron has coached our youth players - there have been plenty of comments along those lines (such as in today's match preview) plus none have been deemed good enough so far. I trust that McNamara sees potential in Archie as a good youth coach hence the role, albeit I'm sure budget constraints have something to do with this too. I was chatting to a guy in work about this today. I would genuinely be content (note Chicofan, not happy) with a few more years in the first division on a plastic pitch where all teams played and trained on it, with rental income and ideally income from a ground share, if I saw us playing attractive football and bringing through one or two players per year who we could potentially sell on for a fee. The SPL is shite anyway. arrrrrrrrghhhhhhh!!!! clucking bell if the SPL is shite what is the first division??? its beyond shite and we as a club canny get oor erses oot it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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