General Election 2010

[Blackpool Jags]

Would you accept that minority Tory government might survive long enough to drive the final nails into the(ir own) coffin?

 

Surely once they prove that they can't actually deliver the promises that they made to swing the Southern vote their way (i.e. change), that'll be it for another 10 years. Won't it?

 

To be honest, I'd settle for virtually any scenario which resulted in them driving the final nails into their own coffin. Sure, they'd start yelping about how their tenure was unworkable without a majority in the Commons etc. Sooner or later, though, there's going to be another election; more than likely this year. If they've made a proper haw maws of things up to that point then cool Dave has a major decision on whether to gamble away his tenuous hold on power as things are, by going for gold, or sitting tight in an unworkable position. Either way, it would be curtains for that particular Old Etonian.

 

The only scenario where things could go tits up for us, is if the country does something it hasn't done for 18 years - elect a majority Tory administration. Doesn't look any more probable now than it has done since the darkest days of the Maggon.

[arnus68]

The Scottish people (some of) are as thick as shit in the neck of a bottle. Put up a dod of crap for labour and the morons will vote for it. And hey, no dod of labour government. Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr. Morrrrrrrrooooonnnnnsssss.

[crazy davie]

The Scottish people (some of) are as thick as shit in the neck of a bottle. Put up a dod of crap for labour and the morons will vote for it. And hey, no dod of labour government. Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr. Morrrrrrrrooooonnnnnsssss.

What are you sayimg ? If you vote Labour you're a moron ?

[GrantB]

The Scottish people (some of) are as thick as shit in the neck of a bottle. Put up a dod of crap for labour and the morons will vote for it. And hey, no dod of labour government. Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr. Morrrrrrrrooooonnnnnsssss.

 

Sad but true.

 

Look at my constituancy. After the alcoholic, expenses fiddling bully Jim Devine, they return yet another hatstand with a red rosette on it. It beggars belief!

[jaggybunnet]

What are you sayimg ? If you vote Labour you're a moron ?

 

 

in this Election yes without doubt, 13 years of dross and drivel and labour supporters still cant see the wood for the trees

[Phoenix]

Good to see the SNP get skelpt. All this talk of being a big party and they only polled 4% more than the tories in Scotland

[Uncle Psychosis]

 

 

 

Sad but true.

 

Look at my constituancy. After the alcoholic, expenses fiddling bully Jim Devine, they return yet another hatstand with a red rosette on it. It beggars belief!

 

 

I'm confused. SNP supporters say that Scotland should be ruled by Scots, but then complain that Scots are too stupid to adequately decide who should rule them?

[Sandy Gall]

in this Election yes without doubt, 13 years of dross and drivel and labour supporters still cant see the wood for the trees

 

Change while it is attractive, is not always inevitable, nor better than the Status Quo (see separate thread and Dave's policies etc). When all on offer is a change of a rough face to a shiny face, then not everyone in Wessex will be convinced. Bang away - Cameron is just Blair with a blue tie.

 

When we have to endure months (perhaps years) of Tory drivel then we'll see if Aussie media moguls (well one of them) will still have the cojones to compare Dave with Barak...Our one hope my granny!

 

Neo-liberalism is over. Communism is dead. Time for a new paradigm. Get off your butts and vote for what you believe - not what you are told by your morning paper - you are not Danny Dyer!

 

Just as macro power is dead, so is macro politics - get with the micro generation. Two party politics just balances the excesses of the two parties - go for the consensus.

 

 

Disclaimer:

(1am & Furstie x5)

 

All additional and opposing views are welcome - our country needs them. No offence, but much as I love their pluck the SNP are not relevant until they have more realistic policy. Feds are us?

[arnus68]

Good to see the SNP get skelpt. All this talk of being a big party and they only polled 4% more than the tories in Scotland

 

 

 

Move down to England.

Edited May 8, 2010 by mod3
abusive wording

[Uncle Psychosis]

 

Move down to England.

 

 

 

 

 

 

No idea who you were on the previous forum but I'm beginning to understand why you got a red card from it...

Edited May 8, 2010 by mod3
abusive wordng quoted

[arnus68]

Separate issue and they were wrong.

[GrantB]

I'm confused. SNP supporters say that Scotland should be ruled by Scots, but then complain that Scots are too stupid to adequately decide who should rule them?

 

Indeed Scotland should be run by Scots.

 

However, it's a shame that a large proportion of the electorate got spooked by Labour's 'vote for us or you'll get the Tories' negative campaigning.

 

Maybe now, the electorate will realise that the only true way to stop the Tories is by voting SNP.

[Mediocre Pundit]

No fear. I live in Blackpool South which we held with a much reduced majority of under 2,000. Blackpool North was captured by the Tories after the boundary revision which took Fleetwood out of the constituency which in turn created a shoo-in for them.

 

Four elections now since the Tories were last able to muster a majority, under grey John Major. After all the huffing and puffing, all the "the country's f*cked under Labour, time to go Brown", even the Guardian deserting Labour to jump on the 'Clegg fever' bandwagon, etc etc etc and STILL there aren't enough voters willing to take a punt on a Tory Govt. That speaks volumes to me. If they can't form a government when Labour's at its lowest ebb - allegedly, as bad as things were in 1983, under Michael Foot - then maybe, just maybe, they're finally fuc*ed. Let's hope so anyway.

The only thing that this election has confirmed is that over 70% of thevoting population is sick of Labour. They want change. Maybe they can't all agree onwhat that change is, but they don't want more of the same. Labour is done. Finished. Talk of a "progressive majority" smacks of a head in the sand mentality, even as the vast majority of the uk population scream "we don't want any more of this-we deserve better"

 

I posted on the old forum that a Con-Lib coalition, allowing both parties to ignore their more radical base, would be the best outcome. Ib

hope they can come to an agreement after which I'll happily watch on as "New Labour" descends into a bloodbath...

[Blackpool Jags]

The only thing that this election has confirmed is that over 70% of thevoting population is sick of Labour. They want change. Maybe they can't all agree onwhat that change is, but they don't want more of the same. Labour is done. Finished. Talk of a "progressive majority" smacks of a head in the sand mentality, even as the vast majority of the uk population scream "we don't want any more of this-we deserve better"

 

I posted on the old forum that a Con-Lib coalition, allowing both parties to ignore their more radical base, would be the best outcome. Ib

hope they can come to an agreement after which I'll happily watch on as "New Labour" descends into a bloodbath...

 

You keep reading the Torygraph. It's a good source of spin, with sprinklings of wishful cliches. The FACT is that it's now eighteen years since the electorate was prepared to trust the Tories with power. That is a cold fact.

 

I understand it must be bitterly frustrating to come up short yet again, but hey, that's the reality of the situation. You and I both know that a Lib-Con alliance has a very limited shelf life; when they've run out of common steam - in all likelihood, before the end of this year - we're looking at another General Election. You'll then be praying for fifth time lucky. Things might turn out differently for the Tories, but there's no immediate indication that they will.

 

If they are to turn the corner, their party managers will have to do considerably better than put characters like Ron 'Backhander' Bell into otherwise winnable seats like Blackpool South. We couldn't believe our luck when they picked this paragon of virtue to break our thirteen year stranglehold on this constituency. Councillor,Dodgy Ron has only recently emerged - anything but unscathed - from a scandal which showed that he had been slipped brown envelopes, on at least two occasions, by local property developers to overturn the wishes of local residents and allow his paymasters to build flats on green belt land. He was duly exposed, lambasted by everyman and his dog, and, bizarrely, selected to fight a winnable marginal for his shower. Fantastic - you just couldn't make it up. And the thing is this lot wanted to be given power to run the country! Wonderful stuff.

[Mediocre Pundit]

Said it before and will say it again, you'll find bad people and bad selections in all parties.

 

I agree that the Tories came up short. Labours negative campaigning will have helped create a feeling of fear in the electorate, the Lib Dems ate into the main Tory message of change, and the Tory campain was a bit lacklustre. Still, one of the biggest swings on record and the Tories are the largest party. While it's not clear that the voters fully trust the Tories it is perfectly clear (unless you just really don't want to see it) that they've rejected Labour and all that they stand for.

 

I look forward to (hopefully) a Con-Lib government, where both parties can ignore some of the more radical elements of their base. I think it can get things done. And if and when it falls down the voters will have seen what the Tories can do and will return them with an overall majority.

 

As for Labour, the inevitable leadership battle and factionalisation that will follow the Con-Lib agreement will lead to them being unelectable for at least a decade.

 

Finally, unlike the vast majority of Labour voters, I form my own opinion rather than take it from the front page of a newspaper.

[GrantB]

I wonder if the voters in the 11 Lib Dem constituances in Scotland will be happy to see them prop up a Tory government.

 

I cant help thinking that this whole election is playing into the SNP's hands....

[Woodstock Jag]

Or to put it another way, Grant, a LibCon administration would have 12 MPs in Scotland, debunking the claim that would otherwise exist that because they had only 1 MP they had no moral authority to include Scotland in their more general UK mandate.

 

[Blackpool Jags]

Said it before and will say it again, you'll find bad people and bad selections in all parties.

 

I agree that the Tories came up short. Labours negative campaigning will have helped create a feeling of fear in the electorate, the Lib Dems ate into the main Tory message of change, and the Tory campain was a bit lacklustre. Still, one of the biggest swings on record and the Tories are the largest party. While it's not clear that the voters fully trust the Tories it is perfectly clear (unless you just really don't want to see it) that they've rejected Labour and all that they stand for.

 

I look forward to (hopefully) a Con-Lib government, where both parties can ignore some of the more radical elements of their base. I think it can get things done. And if and when it falls down the voters will have seen what the Tories can do and will return them with an overall majority.

 

As for Labour, the inevitable leadership battle and factionalisation that will follow the Con-Lib agreement will lead to them being unelectable for at least a decade.

 

Finally, unlike the vast majority of Labour voters, I form my own opinion rather than take it from the front page of a newspaper.

 

A fair response, MP, and I think we may well be heading for a sustained period of opposition. That's probably necessary for us to give ourselves the time to rediscover our natural orientation, and to divest ourselves of our reeking Blair legacy - one of lies, deceit and Tory values - which, despite being electorally successful (Tory decadence was probably the main factor there) is correctly now seen as degenerate and iniquitous. We will also need time to find a leader who actually does connect with ordinary working people and who isn't scared to stand up to the captains of industry and US imperialism.

 

That time is probably a good bit away now, but I'd rather spend a period in meaningful opposition than simply waste that time on internal squabbling only for another Blair/Brown twat to emerge.

 

Btw, I'm sure you don't include me in that group who get their opinions from "the front page of a newspaper", do you?

[GrantB]

Or to put it another way, Grant, a LibCon administration would have 12 MPs in Scotland, debunking the claim that would otherwise exist that because they had only 1 MP they had no moral authority to include Scotland in their more general UK mandate.

 

 

That's one way to spin it.

 

However, I doubt that the people who voted Lib Dem in good faith will see it that way, which is my point.

[Mediocre Pundit]

Btw, I'm sure you don't include me in that group who get their opinions from "the front page of a newspaper", do you?

Nope, you're far too rabid in your opinion - even the Daily Record wouldn't publish what you post!

[jaggybunnet]

Nope, you're far too rabid in your opinion - even the Daily Record wouldn't publish what you post!

 

 

[yoda-jag]

The FACT is that it's now eighteen years since the electorate was prepared to trust the Tories with power. That is a cold fact.

 

Or, to put another 'spin' on it:

 

The FACT is, in the last 100 years there has NEVER been one period when there was a majority of those who actually voted in UK elections was prepared to trust Labour in power - never once has Labour had 50% or above in the electorate backing them.

 

The FACT is, looking at a graph of voting percentages over the last century (go to Page 8, Share of the Vote graph), the Tories have achieved 50% or more of the electorate backing in a couple of periods.

 

More importantly it would seem that even when Labour do edge ahead of the Tories in elections it's usually only relatively small margins in the main (1997 being the ONLY election where Labour had a 10% or greater winning margin), while over the last century the Tories are more often than not on top and when they are, their lead ranges from small winning margins to quite huge ones (15, 20, and even up to 30% difference in terms of share of vote).

 

For clarity, I am not a Tory (Grand Master of Jedi Order am I), nor a Labour basher.

 

But I do think some form of electoral reform and PR is coming to the UK in the next 1 to 3 elections, and that will forever change the face of British politics and government.

 

May the force be with you all.

[Blackpool Jags]

Nope, you're far too rabid in your opinion - even the Daily Record wouldn't publish what you post!

 

.....

[jaggybunnet]

Can some one please try to explain PR to me, I have goggled it and to be honest there were so many different versions with so many connotations it was confusing.

 

the one irony I got from this is that it would mean that the very same people who foam at the mouth about the BNP would also let the bnp in with this system, baffling

[Tam]

29,653,638 voted this year for 650 seats. PR would allocate a seat per portion of total votes (e.g 45620 votes = 1 seat)

 

As you say, if the BNP got 1 million votes nationally then they could have 20 seats in Parliament :thinking:

 

Im happy to stand corrected if Ive oversimplified it

Edited May 9, 2010 by Tam