lady-isobel-barnett Posted October 25, 2011 Report Share Posted October 25, 2011 Let's look at the facts. Paul Cairney has longest contract at Firhill. He was signed in 2008 (loaned back to the Spiders for a season) and his deal expires in May. Two years is the longest deal that the club is now willing to offer. Aaron Sinclair (signed from Montrose) is on a 2 year contract. Christie Elliot (a free agent) also has a two-year contract. Stephen O'Donnell (released by Celtic) has a one year contract. Let's look at the previous clubs of our modern apprentices Aaron Sekhon - Falkirk James Wightman - Celtic Jordan Moffat - Celtic Dale Keenan - Celtic Bradley Halsman - Motherwell Gavin Halman - Motherwell Quite frankly, your claim does not stand up scrutiny. Most of the players in our squad were signed as free agents. We paid a fee for Sinclair and may have small fees for others, e.g. Paton, Cairney, Kinniburgh and Doolan. The players that we sign from other clubs are offered at least 2 year deals, i.e. we tie them down and then extend their contracts if we want to keep them. What claim? All I'm saying is if we produce a player thru our system it's easier to tie the lad to a contract than if we bring in a player from elsewhere. I'd have thought that was fairly obvious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaggededge Posted October 25, 2011 Report Share Posted October 25, 2011 (edited) It's good to see a majority in favour of the youth system. Hamilton Accies' youth development has been a big part of their success over the past few years and I think Thistle should be capable of being at least as successful as them. I actually believe that it should be mandatory for all senior clubs to have a youth set-up. It helps them be part of the community and forges a bond with potential supporters of the future. Kids are much more likely to feel affinity with a club if they've maybe been in one of a club's youth teams or been involved in their community programmes. Edited October 26, 2011 by jaggededge Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fawlty Towers Posted October 30, 2011 Report Share Posted October 30, 2011 Another good weekend for the youth teams: http://www.ptfc.co.uk/news/2011-2012/october_2011/youth_round_up_-_october_30th Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaggededge Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 Another good weekend for the youth teams: http://www.ptfc.co.uk/news/2011-2012/october_2011/youth_round_up_-_october_30th Yes, great to see that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlgarveJag Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 Interesting stuff about what age you have to be to have the experience to play at this level. Link this with the recent threads about our current goalie choice dilemma and I'd point out that Alan Rough was 19 years old in 1971. Bring on the yoof Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fawlty Towers Posted October 31, 2011 Report Share Posted October 31, 2011 Good to see the club are looking at getting players from further afield than just Glasgow: http://www.youthfootballscotland.co.uk/clubs/west-region-clubs/wast-region-news/1222-st-cadocs-youth-club-news/3573-jags-swoop-on-east-ren Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bunny Posted November 1, 2011 Report Share Posted November 1, 2011 Interesting stuff about what age you have to be to have the experience to play at this level. Link this with the recent threads about our current goalie choice dilemma and I'd point out that Alan Rough was 19 years old in 1971. It all depends on the individual. Some mature mentally long before other youngsters, some are physically more able at a younger age and some learn a lot quicker. Then there are other things like attitude, willingness to play for the team and so on. The coaches and manager have to consider all these factors before deciding whether a youth player should get a run in the full team. Don't forget the other factor which is the tight leagues we have nowadays, with only ten teams in our division. At the moment we're 4 points off 2nd place and 4 points off the relegation spot. That makes it difficult for managers to risk playing youngsters; yes, it happens but usually teams are forced into it rather than it being policy. It's another arguement for bigger leagues - if you're out of the title race and in no danger of relegation you can risk playing youngsters (and it's a good way to keep the fans interested) - generally in our league if you're not challenging at the top you're almost certainly struggling at the bottom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlgarveJag Posted November 1, 2011 Report Share Posted November 1, 2011 I also think that it's helpful when the youth setup allows for younger players to 'grow' playing together. Manchester United's 1992 FA Youth Cup-winning squad included David Beckham, Nicky Butt, Gary Neville and Ryan Giggs with Scholes and Phil Neville part of the team that reached the final again in '93. You need a full youth set-up to be able groom a young team and not just for identifying individuals or you might as well just scout for individuals in other teams youth teams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Passenger Posted November 1, 2011 Report Share Posted November 1, 2011 I also think that it's helpful when the youth setup allows for younger players to 'grow' playing together. Falkirk's current crop being a case in point. I don't know how much difference it makes, but I believe our youngsters continue to play at a lower level to Falkirk's, though, despite the Bairns' current position in the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaggededge Posted November 1, 2011 Report Share Posted November 1, 2011 Falkirk's current crop being a case in point. I don't know how much difference it makes, but I believe our youngsters continue to play at a lower level to Falkirk's, though, despite the Bairns' current position in the game. If you mean that Thistle's teams are in the Initiative Tier rather than the Performance Tier, that's true. But there are still some good teams and players in that tier. The teams are there because of how the club stands in overall criteria for youth development. Thistle are working towards "ticking all the boxes" I believe. Teams like Airdrie and Dundee at U14s, for example, are very good sides despite being in the YI tier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaggededge Posted November 9, 2011 Report Share Posted November 9, 2011 Very interesting to hear Mark Wotte's take on Scottish football and the importance of youth development. Mark Wotte Press Conference Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fawlty Towers Posted November 22, 2011 Report Share Posted November 22, 2011 With 3 games to go the u17s are in with a chance of winning their league: http://www.scottishfootballleague.com/football/youth/under17/under17-table/ The u16s are still unbeatean as well so it is good to see that we have some good youngsters coming through and will hopefully be playing a big part in our first team in the next few years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fawlty Towers Posted November 27, 2011 Report Share Posted November 27, 2011 Victories for all three of the youth teams in action this weekend : http://www.ptfc.co.uk/news/2011-2012/november_2011/youth_round_up_-_november_27th Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kni Posted November 28, 2011 Report Share Posted November 28, 2011 I also think that it's helpful when the youth setup allows for younger players to 'grow' playing together. Manchester United's 1992 FA Youth Cup-winning squad included David Beckham, Nicky Butt, Gary Neville and Ryan Giggs with Scholes and Phil Neville part of the team that reached the final again in '93. You need a full youth set-up to be able groom a young team and not just for identifying individuals or you might as well just scout for individuals in other teams youth teams. But look at Man Utd now. Very few of the first-team squad came through the club's academy - Fletcher, Cleverly, Welbeck and Evans. Fabio, Raphael and Macheda were recruited from the youth teams of Fuminese and Lazio. They paid around £300 million for the rest of the squad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McKennan Posted November 28, 2011 Report Share Posted November 28, 2011 Three hundred million? You could buy one of Billy Allan's companies for that. Clickitty Back to youth - it strikes me that we (Thistle ) are hostages to fortune in that our youth development is driven more by plugging holes in a creaking dike - no jokes please - rather than establishing players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kni Posted November 28, 2011 Report Share Posted November 28, 2011 Three hundred million? You could buy one of Billy Allan's companies for that. Clickitty Back to youth - it strikes me that we (Thistle ) are hostages to fortune in that our youth development is driven more by plugging holes in a creaking dike - no jokes please - rather than establishing players. As we have discussed before, Jackie's strategy has been to recruit young players from SPL teams, e.g. Celtic, Rangers, Motherwell and St Johnstone. Of our "home grown" players, only Scully and Bannigan seem to be getting into the first team squad. Erskine, Doolan and Elliot were recruited from Junior and non-league clubs so it might be better to invest in a bigger scouting network. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McKennan Posted November 28, 2011 Report Share Posted November 28, 2011 Ergo we don't have a youth policy at all? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kni Posted November 28, 2011 Report Share Posted November 28, 2011 Ergo we don't have a youth policy at all? We do have a youth policy - get them from other clubs and put ours out on loan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted November 28, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 28, 2011 We do have a youth policy - get them from other clubs and put ours out on loan. That pretty much sums up the current situation! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrantB Posted November 28, 2011 Report Share Posted November 28, 2011 That pretty much sums up the current situation! Nothing too much wrong with us putting players out on loan to get game time. The problem is when they come back worse players than when we sent them away as seems to have happened with Bannigan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted November 28, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 28, 2011 Nothing too much wrong with us putting players out on loan to get game time. The problem is when they come back worse players than when we sent them away as seems to have happened with Bannigan. Although to be fair he's hardly getting enough game time to show what he can do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fawlty Towers Posted November 28, 2011 Report Share Posted November 28, 2011 Looks like the under 17s will finish second in their league behind Livingston: http://www.scottishfootballleague.com/football/youth/under17/under17-table/ If we stick with it I do believe that we will reap the benefits from having a strong youth set up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lennythistle Posted November 28, 2011 Report Share Posted November 28, 2011 Looks like the under 17s will finish second in their league behind Livingston: http://www.scottishfootballleague.com/football/youth/under17/under17-table/ If we stick with it I do believe that we will reap the benefits from having a strong youth set up. I hope so, as not that long ago the U19's were winning the league cup, and now they are losing 6-0 to Morton, who are a couple of years behind us in their youth set up. Think we wanted to see more progression from some of the younger lads and that has caused some frustration. We can't rush it though and hopefully in next season or so we'll see a few of them as regulars in the first team and being successful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrantB Posted November 28, 2011 Report Share Posted November 28, 2011 I hope so, as not that long ago the U19's were winning the league cup, and now they are losing 6-0 to Morton, who are a couple of years behind us in their youth set up. Think we wanted to see more progression from some of the younger lads and that has caused some frustration. We can't rush it though and hopefully in next season or so we'll see a few of them as regulars in the first team and being successful. Is it not the case that we are using some younger players for the u19 side and that most of the u19 guys from the cup team etc are now playing for the reserves. Our reserve side rarely contains anyone from the first team unless they are coming back to fitness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McKennan Posted November 28, 2011 Report Share Posted November 28, 2011 We do have a youth policy - get them from other clubs and put ours out on loan. So, nothing long term. Just bodge it as we trundle along? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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