Tranche 2 & the Preservation of Power

[javeajag]

5 minutes ago, Albert's Ghost said:

Their connection to PTFC is through Donald McClymont, who is on the board of PTFC.  I thought you might know that. They are friends and business associates who have bought into Donald's vision, and are happy to chip in what is to them pretty much chickenfeed, with no expectation of a return on investment.

And it's "their" FFS.

Can you share Donald’s vision ? 

[Albert's Ghost]

2 minutes ago, javeajag said:

Can you share Donald’s vision ? 

https://ptfc.co.uk/ptfc-news/donald-mcclymont-interview-20th-december-2023/

[javeajag]

6 minutes ago, Albert's Ghost said:

https://ptfc.co.uk/ptfc-news/donald-mcclymont-interview-20th-december-2023/

I saw that …. I wouldn’t describe that as a Vision to be honest 

[Jordanhill Jag]

12 minutes ago, Albert's Ghost said:

Their connection to PTFC is through Donald McClymont, who is on the board of PTFC.  I thought you might know that. They are friends and business associates who have bought into Donald's vision, and are happy to chip in what is to them pretty much chickenfeed, with no expectation of a return on investment.

And it's "their" FFS.

 they are random strangers to PTFC who we are asking for money - no connection to the Club on any level - have never heard of us on any level 

your assumption that there is no assumption on a return is just that - an assumption 

you seem more upset about the use of the word there than you do about the fact we will struggle to pay our debts at the end of the Season 

[Albert's Ghost]

3 minutes ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

 they are random strangers to PTFC who we are asking for money - no connection to the Club on any level - have never heard of us on any level 

More drivel.  See my previous response.

3 minutes ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

your assumption that there is no assumption on a return is just that - an assumption 

How exactly can they expect a return?

3 minutes ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

you seem more upset about the use of the word there than you do about the fact we will struggle to pay our debts at the end of the Season 

You're probably right their.

[Albert's Ghost]

10 minutes ago, javeajag said:

I saw that …. I wouldn’t describe that as a Vision to be honest 

Fine.  What's your vision?

[javeajag]

27 minutes ago, Albert's Ghost said:

Fine.  What's your vision?

Im just a fan I’m not in the vision business 

[Albert's Ghost]

7 minutes ago, javeajag said:

Im just a fan I’m not in the vision business 

You've been mouthing off, as if you have something to say.  Some would call that a vision.

[javeajag]

2 minutes ago, Albert's Ghost said:

You've been mouthing off, as if you have something to say.  Some would call that a vision.

I’ve said it. And imagine mouthing off in a forum whatever next 

[Albert's Ghost]

5 minutes ago, javeajag said:

I’ve said it. And imagine mouthing off in a forum whatever next 

You haven't really said very much.

[javeajag]

8 minutes ago, Albert's Ghost said:

You haven't really said very much.

Mouthing off and not saying very much … the dialectic of defeat 

[Albert's Ghost]

15 minutes ago, javeajag said:

Mouthing off and not saying very much … the dialectic of defeat 

You said it after all!

[javeajag]

8 minutes ago, Albert's Ghost said:

You said it after all!

I’ll leave you to your forum 

[lady-isobel-barnett]

Hey, we've gone all James Brown! 👍

[Albert's Ghost]

I thought we'd gone all Marxist!

[Lenziejag]

3 hours ago, Jag said:

I don't get your point, sorry.

There seems to be some concern that the 2nd tranche has money coming from people other than Donald McClymont. The 1st tranche did as well.

[Lenziejag]

2 hours ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

There additional cash came from there owners 

we are literally begging random Strangers to give us money 

and when it runs out -there is zero plan on how we finance the Club 

thats not a sustainable strategy 

That’s ok then. You realise you are effectively saying that it isn’t possible to run a championship club without needing support. 
 

[Jordanhill Jag]

3 minutes ago, Lenziejag said:

There seems to be some concern that the 2nd tranche has money coming from people other than Donald McClymont. The 1st tranche did as well.

Thats correct - however the Second Tranche seems to have been pulled together via a far larger number of Donald Mclymonts associates - all in smaller sums 

Now this isnt an issue in itself - but what it does suggest is that there is unlikely to be a Tranche 3 - which with the present Strategy we will need in the not too distant future 

There is NO PLAN to reduce our Cash Burn 

Therefore unless we change Direction and various Directors we will run out of Cash and not have willing Investors to bail us out 

We have run out of "Thistle Fans" to keep bailing us out 

Alastair Creevy had good local Contacts ( Cash)  - but the Board & Trusts decided he had to go - maybe on reflection not one of there wiser moves  

[Jordanhill Jag]

1 minute ago, Lenziejag said:

That’s ok then. You realise you are effectively saying that it isn’t possible to run a championship club without needing support. 
 

No I didn't - I was describing the Financing arrangements of the Two Club Mentioned 

We have run the Club in the Championship in the past - at a Profit & gained promotion - so what you are saying is not correct  

Also Tranche 2 is likely to be end game on "Support" so if the Boards  Plan is dependant on getting someone to underwrite the losses each Year - I suggest there needs to be another Plan ( and another Board )   

[Lenziejag]

2 hours ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

So there in your opinion there are no other overheads that we can cut beyond staff wages ? 

there are no alternatives beyond the current strategy of burning through cash to the extent we cannot pay our debts ? 
 

What I have said is without knowing what the details are it is hard to know what could be cut or by how much. What’s your guess ?

[Jordanhill Jag]

1 minute ago, Lenziejag said:

What I have said is without knowing what the details are it is hard to know what could be cut or by how much. What’s your guess ?

Looking at how things are run from the outside - factoring in past experience - looking at the overhead  between £150 to £200K  

If things got really desperate and your cutting to the core - maybe another £100K 

 

[Lenziejag]

2 hours ago, javeajag said:

No I simply presented the facts that all three clubs had injections of £500k and we had the least cash in the bank to the extent we will lose £280k this year. You then speculate on what they might need it do but that’s speculation on your part.

At the same point in time(May/June 23) we had the most cash in the bank and we hadn’t had the investment at that point. I wasn’t speculating what Raith had to do - I just looked at their Balance sheet. You are right, I speculated that Ayr needed to fork out a significant amount for their stand. We will see when 23/24 accounts are issued. 
But let’s just go with your theory PTFC bad, every other club good

[Lenziejag]

13 minutes ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

No I didn't - I was describing the Financing arrangements of the Two Club Mentioned 

We have run the Club in the Championship in the past - at a Profit & gained promotion - so what you are saying is not correct  

Also Tranche 2 is likely to be end game on "Support" so if the Boards  Plan is dependant on getting someone to underwrite the losses each Year - I suggest there needs to be another Plan ( and another Board )   

I asked you previously if you had looked at the accounts of Championship clubs. If you did you would see that virtually none of them can operate at a profit or without ongoing support from somewhere.

The world has changed since we got promoted. Promoted clubs in the last 10 years overspent in hundreds of thousands.

[Jordanhill Jag]

8 minutes ago, Lenziejag said:

At the same point in time(May/June 23) we had the most cash in the bank and we hadn’t had the investment at that point. I wasn’t speculating what Raith had to do - I just looked at their Balance sheet. You are right, I speculated that Ayr needed to fork out a significant amount for their stand. We will see when 23/24 accounts are issued. 
But let’s just go with your theory PTFC bad, every other club good

We are not interested in "other clubs" we are interested in PTFC 

Without Tranche 2 we will struggle to pay our debts end of this Season ie we could go bust  

We Run at significant losses each Year 

There is No Plan to stop the losses - so they will continue 

The odds of getting continuing funding to shore up the losses are unlikely 

So what do you suggest ?  

 

[Lenziejag]

14 minutes ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

Looking at how things are run from the outside - factoring in past experience - looking at the overhead  between £150 to £200K  

If things got really desperate and your cutting to the core - maybe another £100K 

 

Where are you taking that from ? Bearing in mind that a fair chunk of that overhead is going to be locked into contracts. I would think with that level of cut you are bringing the club to a standstill.