Firhillista Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 Let's get real - it's all about money. MacNamara is as good as we can afford, the players are all the club can afford as well. Yesterday's result was about the fact that we can't afford anything better. The team's full of youngsters, some promising, others less so, and older guys at the end of their careers. The manager is, maybe, promising as well, but only time will tell. A more experienced team would have known how to break down QoS yesterday - our lot don't have the nous and neither did Jackie. Going 4-2-4 at the end was probably a good idea, but not when the players at the back simply lump the ball forward in the hope of something happening. Get used to this - it's as good as it's going to get until something happens to change Scottish football as a whole. Thistle and every other First Division club with any ambition need re-organisation of the leagues and increased income or we're stuck with fielding teams of youngster, geriatrics and loanees. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 Let's get real - it's all about money. MacNamara is as good as we can afford, the players are all the club can afford as well. Yesterday's result was about the fact that we can't afford anything better. The team's full of youngsters, some promising, others less so, and older guys at the end of their careers. The manager is, maybe, promising as well, but only time will tell. A more experienced team would have known how to break down QoS yesterday - our lot don't have the nous and neither did Jackie. Going 4-2-4 at the end was probably a good idea, but not when the players at the back simply lump the ball forward in the hope of something happening. Get used to this - it's as good as it's going to get until something happens to change Scottish football as a whole. Thistle and every other First Division club with any ambition need re-organisation of the leagues and increased income or we're stuck with fielding teams of youngster, geriatrics and loanees. We all know this but don't want anything to diffuse our anger at this stage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Passenger Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 Let's get real - it's all about money. Too true, and it doesn't help that one of the poorest cup campaigns in my living memory have cost us much-needed income. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig-W Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 Hey, we managed to force Culter to a replay, that must have been worth a pretty penny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chachi Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 uberteeb - your upset and frustrations are felt by all on this forum however your reaction seems a knee jerk one and way OTT in my opinion. I was gutted yesterday and also found myself saying 'seasons over' as i trudged away from Firhill. I also think we should have beaten QOS, they were awful 2 weeks ago and awful yesterday. However we would have toiled to beat anyone yesterday, given our impotence in the final third of the pitch. I also agree that Jackie got his tactics wrong, Flannigan in central mid with Cariney shunted to the left was baffling, as was the starting of Stewart, who i don't rate at all (we dont have anyone else to be fair). Doolan needs a decent foil up front and its shame he doesn't have one. At HT i actually thought we had played quite well without showing any cutting edge and thought we would see out a narrow win, but our lack of options going forward cost us again, not surprisingly. Also our inablity to make set peices count and to defend them propoerly is a real bone of contention and would make a big difference to our results if we could reverse the trend. We have no cash, so young inconsistent players with a hope of progressing, mixed with the odd veteran are about as good as we will get, unless things change. I was heartily gutted yesterday, but this morning whilst still gutted, i can put a bit of perspective on to things. Sacking Jackie? Not even a consideration at this stage for me. I see promise in him (as well as some obvious failings that he will hopefully overcome). We'd also struggle to get anyone else on the wages we pay him. A someone mentioned, it would be another punt on a young, untried ageing pro. Not sure that would serve us any better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kni Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 McNamara and Donnelly are on one year rolling contracts. It would cost us a lot of money to fire them. Our cup form is appalling but our league position is a bit better than I expected. With no more cup money, it's unlikely that the manager will have any money to spend in the window. Hutton is missed already so it's going to be a tough start to 2012. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uberteeb Posted January 8, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 Let's get real - it's all about money. MacNamara is as good as we can afford, the players are all the club can afford as well. Yesterday's result was about the fact that we can't afford anything better. The team's full of youngsters, some promising, others less so, and older guys at the end of their careers. The manager is, maybe, promising as well, but only time will tell. A more experienced team would have known how to break down QoS yesterday - our lot don't have the nous and neither did Jackie. Going 4-2-4 at the end was probably a good idea, but not when the players at the back simply lump the ball forward in the hope of something happening. Get used to this - it's as good as it's going to get until something happens to change Scottish football as a whole. Thistle and every other First Division club with any ambition need re-organisation of the leagues and increased income or we're stuck with fielding teams of youngster, geriatrics and loanees. McNamara is a big name in Scottish football, he is an ex pro looking for a break in management. There will be plenty of others out there who we can take a punt on, if we can afford Jackie we can afford them. And the second bit in bold, why does Jackie not know how to break them down. Firstly, he is a very experienced player who has played at the "top level" and played for managers of some repute. Secondly, we played them 2 weeks ago and had the same problem. If he can't fix it he isn't good enough. He didn't fix it. uberteeb - your upset and frustrations are felt by all on this forum however your reaction seems a knee jerk one and way OTT in my opinion. I was gutted yesterday and also found myself saying 'seasons over' as i trudged away from Firhill. I also think we should have beaten QOS, they were awful 2 weeks ago and awful yesterday. However we would have toiled to beat anyone yesterday, given our impotence in the final third of the pitch. I also agree that Jackie got his tactics wrong, Flannigan in central mid with Cariney shunted to the left was baffling, as was the starting of Stewart, who i don't rate at all (we dont have anyone else to be fair). Doolan needs a decent foil up front and its shame he doesn't have one. At HT i actually thought we had played quite well without showing any cutting edge and thought we would see out a narrow win, but our lack of options going forward cost us again, not surprisingly. Also our inablity to make set peices count and to defend them propoerly is a real bone of contention and would make a big difference to our results if we could reverse the trend. We have no cash, so young inconsistent players with a hope of progressing, mixed with the odd veteran are about as good as we will get, unless things change. I was heartily gutted yesterday, but this morning whilst still gutted, i can put a bit of perspective on to things. Sacking Jackie? Not even a consideration at this stage for me. I see promise in him (as well as some obvious failings that he will hopefully overcome). We'd also struggle to get anyone else on the wages we pay him. A someone mentioned, it would be another punt on a young, untried ageing pro. Not sure that would serve us any better. So in other words the 2 problems that have been evident all season have not improved at all under Jackie, what use is he as a manager if he can't correct even the most basic of errors? McNamara and Donnelly are on one year rolling contracts. It would cost us a lot of money to fire them. Our cup form is appalling but our league position is a bit better than I expected. With no more cup money, it's unlikely that the manager will have any money to spend in the window. Hutton is missed already so it's going to be a tough start to 2012. If they are on one year rolling contracts does that not mean we can simply not "roll" their contracts in the summer and get rid of them for nowt? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Passenger Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 (edited) If they are on one year rolling contracts does that not mean we can simply not "roll" their contracts in the summer and get rid of them for nowt? Someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but, if it's the case, their year-long contracts basically begin again every waking day. Edited January 8, 2012 by Dark Passenger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kni Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 Someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but, if it's the case, their year-long contracts basically begin again every waking day. You are correct. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uberteeb Posted January 8, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 Someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but, if it's the case, their year-long contracts basically begin again every waking day. You are correct. Jesus Christ, well let's not renew it as of today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kni Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 Jesus Christ, well let's not renew it as of today. You can't do that. The current contract would need to be terminated and that would cost a year's salary for Jackie and SID. Usually, one-year rolling contracts are replaced by longer fixed term contracts. If I recall correctly, McCall's rolling contract was replaced by a 2 or 3 year deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uberteeb Posted January 8, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 You can't do that. The current contract would need to be terminated and that would cost a year's salary for Jackie and SID. Usually, one-year rolling contracts are replaced by longer fixed term contracts. If I recall correctly, McCall's rolling contract was replaced by a 2 or 3 year deal. Are you saying that this means unless another team wants him and we accept their approach at no point can we sack the pair of them without it costing us a years salary? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thistle4tw Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 It's a real shame we lost Gerry As our assistant in my opininon when he took over we progressed To our promotion push but when he left the following season we ended up on that shocking run that led to us finishing in the bottom half of the table. All the major success in mccalls tenure occurred when Gerry was there.Think a man LIKE Gerry is the perfect man for the job in my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Passenger Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 All the major success in mccalls tenure occurred when Gerry was there. And Gary Harkins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chunky jag Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 (edited) Surely McNamara must see week in week out that we don't create many chances in the box for our strikers to try to show that they are good at scoring. So what has he been doing to change this? Answers on a postcard, please. Or even just on this forum. Over the last few games I've also noticed our forwards don't attack the ball enough. It's true tho' the service they receive is not of sufficient quality but yesterday in particular they did receive a lot of balls from O'Donnell & to a lesser extent Sinclair. By sheer percentage alone some of those balls in could've been challenged more vigorously. Instead of waiting for the inch perfect cross, which is unlikely the strikers could put themselves about a more. Try a little bit of anticipation, it's worked for a lot better strikers than we've got. It does my nut in how little work Doolan and whoever is playing with him have to do in the opposition area - the service to them is usually pretty bad as we're trying to walk it into the box instead of whipping a cross in for example. I thought we'd turned the corner with Doolans 2 tap ins recently against Morton and QOTS, with a player actually hitting the by line and putting a cross in for a goal, our strikers dont score enough tap ins. The lack of a striker that makes a front post run every once in a while is also heartbreaking to watch. Edited January 8, 2012 by chunky jag Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thistle4tw Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 I reckon if jackie could just get them to pull the bloody trigger at the right time we would do better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kni Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 (edited) Are you saying that this means unless another team wants him and we accept their approach at no point can we sack the pair of them without it costing us a years salary? Yes. The only way we can escape the year's salary is if there is a clause which specifies a lesser amount. Normally, there is no such clause because the manager does not have the security of a longer contract. Edited January 8, 2012 by kni Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ian_mac Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 Lenny, always find it quite remarkable how you "weigh in" to these threads when you have absolutely no idea about what has gone on. Culter - you slandered anyone who criticised at the final whistle, especially those who appeared in the video on youtube. As it turned out, not only were you not at the game, you didn't even see the video before it got taken down. Now, here you are again, criticising those who are unhappy about the way we approached the game yesterday. Yet again, you weren't even at the game. Astounding. You may think you are entitled to your opinion. Wrong - you are entitled to an informed opinion. There's a big difference. Make no mistake, barring a minor miracle, our season ended yesterday. We haven't managed 3 consecutive wins all season, so would someone explain to me how we are supposed to challenge for the title? The players quite clearly did not care yesterday. As has been pointed out, they all know they are not capable of playing at a higher level, they are still getting paid, so why should they? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uberteeb Posted January 8, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 Yes. The only way we can escape the year's salary is if there is a clause which specifies a lesser amount. Normally, there is no such clause because the manager does not have the security of a longer contract. Why the hell did we give an unproven manager a contract that makes him unsackable for financial reasons? Ridiculous. Still, if he hasn't improved things drastically by the summer we need to pay him off, everyone is saying he is on buttons so just give him a years worth of them. Lenny, always find it quite remarkable how you "weigh in" to these threads when you have absolutely no idea about what has gone on. Culter - you slandered anyone who criticised at the final whistle, especially those who appeared in the video on youtube. As it turned out, not only were you not at the game, you didn't even see the video before it got taken down. Now, here you are again, criticising those who are unhappy about the way we approached the game yesterday. Yet again, you weren't even at the game. Astounding. You may think you are entitled to your opinion. Wrong - you are entitled to an informed opinion. There's a big difference. Make no mistake, barring a minor miracle, our season ended yesterday. We haven't managed 3 consecutive wins all season, so would someone explain to me how we are supposed to challenge for the title? The players quite clearly did not care yesterday. As has been pointed out, they all know they are not capable of playing at a higher level, they are still getting paid, so why should they? Thistle wages afford them Nando's, the brew would mean a step down to KFC. Maybe McNamara could use that in a motivational speech? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
northernsoul Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 I'd say the next three games are massive for McNamara, in response to the result yesterday and considering how shit the team have performed since the Raith match. Hamilton away and then a double header at home against Dundee and Ayr. If the team continue to put in rubbish and toothless performances, backed up poor results by the end of the Ayr game then questions have to be asked about McNamara, in my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angry gaz Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 It does my nut in how little work Doolan and whoever is playing with him have to do in the opposition area - the service to them is usually pretty bad as we're trying to walk it into the box instead of whipping a cross in for example. I thought we'd turned the corner with Doolans 2 tap ins recently against Morton and QOTS, with a player actually hitting the by line and putting a cross in for a goal, our strikers dont score enough tap ins. The lack of a striker that makes a front post run every once in a while is also heartbreaking to watch. ................quite right,it;s agony watching our forward play at the moment and what's worse these are the absolute basics in what it takes to create and score a goal.The worst aspect for me is also the inability of our forwards to shoot first time of asking in the box.Take a touch and the chance is gone ,the goalie has set himself for a save or the defender will block it.If you watch highlights of goals across all leagues and divisions ,90% of the goals scored are first time shots when the ball falls to the striker.As soon as you have a glimpse of the goal the ball should be struck.Elliot was doing this at the start and has stopped,Dools has his back to goal too much in the box and Tommy Stewart seems intent on taking as many touches as he can before laying it sideways to someone in a worse position.The supply yesterday was poor but there was still enough chances to. give us some shots on target .Did we have one shot on target in the game? It's a feckin grind watching the Jags at the moment FFS CAN WE NOT AT LEAST JUST SHOOT MORE!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joejag Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 I said this earlier in the season.I DO NOT think that sacking McNamara will move us on, I believe that he should have brought in an experienced coach to guide him through troubles and difficulties. There must be some experienced ex managers/coaches out there who want back in the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kni Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 Why the hell did we give an unproven manager a contract that makes him unsackable for financial reasons? Ridiculous. Still, if he hasn't improved things drastically by the summer we need to pay him off, everyone is saying he is on buttons so just give him a years worth of them. If we had given Jackie a fixed 2 year contract, we would have to pay him at least a year's salary on termination. McCall resigned so we did not have to pay him compensation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kni Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 There must be some experienced ex managers/coaches out there who want back in the game. Who do you have in mind - Calderwood, Chisholm, Hughes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joejag Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 Who do you have in mind - Calderwood, Chisholm, Hughes? Why not?? If they want to be a no.2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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