Norgethistle Posted January 7 Report Share Posted January 7 (edited) 15 hours ago, javeajag said: And it still is ….. As is every team in league bar Dundee United. Every club bar them are losing a goal or more per game average this season, United a goal per 2 games. Raith have conceded 6 less than us, but also scored 4 less than us. Are defences worse this season or attacks better? Only 3 teams have a positive goal difference Edited January 7 by Norgethistle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dl1971 Posted January 7 Report Share Posted January 7 19 minutes ago, Norgethistle said: As is every team in league bar Dundee United. Every club bar them are losing a goal or more per game average this season, United a goal per 2 games. Raith have conceded 6 less than us, but also scored 4 less than us. Are defences worse this season or attacks better? Only 3 teams have a positive goal difference Javeajag won't be happy until we have a goal difference of +100 with no goals conceded. I'm enjoying watching thistle score plenty of goals under Doolan. Be interested to see the total stats under Doolan ( including play off results ). It's impressive I'm sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney Rubble Posted January 7 Report Share Posted January 7 28 minutes ago, dl1971 said: Javeajag won't be happy until we have a goal difference of +100 with no goals conceded. I'm enjoying watching thistle score plenty of goals under Doolan. Be interested to see the total stats under Doolan ( including play off results ). It's impressive I'm sure. All competitions since his appointment in Feb 2023: P46 W25 D11 L10 Points per game: 1.87 (caveat: one Scottish cup game and one Challenge cup game are included in those stats). 54.3% win rate 78.2% positive result rate (assuming a draw is accepted as a positive result). 21.8% loss rate. That's the statistical evidence. Draw your own conclusions. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlsarmy Posted January 8 Report Share Posted January 8 14 hours ago, Barney Rubble said: All competitions since his appointment in Feb 2023: P46 W25 D11 L10 Points per game: 1.87 (caveat: one Scottish cup game and one Challenge cup game are included in those stats). 54.3% win rate 78.2% positive result rate (assuming a draw is accepted as a positive result). 21.8% loss rate. That's the statistical evidence. Draw your own conclusions. Think everyone should be able to see what Doolan is trying to build at our Club , with Stanway , Lyon ,McKenzie, Diack and now Macbeth coming through and giving them a pathway to first team Guys like Milne , Fitzy , Lawless and BG have been signed up on longer contracts which means we don’t have to rebuild every season as we have done for lots of years but hopefully add a few players here and there to enhance the squad . Building a Club takes time but as the stats show Dools has done a magnificent job so far . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted January 8 Report Share Posted January 8 16 hours ago, Norgethistle said: As is every team in league bar Dundee United. Every club bar them are losing a goal or more per game average this season, United a goal per 2 games. Raith have conceded 6 less than us, but also scored 4 less than us. Are defences worse this season or attacks better? Only 3 teams have a positive goal difference You mean the team most likely to win the league will have the best defensive record …..that’s novel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted January 8 Report Share Posted January 8 16 hours ago, dl1971 said: Javeajag won't be happy until we have a goal difference of +100 with no goals conceded. I'm enjoying watching thistle score plenty of goals under Doolan. Be interested to see the total stats under Doolan ( including play off results ). It's impressive I'm sure. It’s not complicated score lots of goals and don’t concede many that’s the route to football success look at Man City or Liverpool……our defensive capabilities will most likely cost us promotion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted January 8 Report Share Posted January 8 15 hours ago, Barney Rubble said: All competitions since his appointment in Feb 2023: P46 W25 D11 L10 Points per game: 1.87 (caveat: one Scottish cup game and one Challenge cup game are included in those stats). 54.3% win rate 78.2% positive result rate (assuming a draw is accepted as a positive result). 21.8% loss rate. That's the statistical evidence. Draw your own conclusions. The statistical evidence that matters is getting promoted. If we keep those stats and are in the championship next year then it’s failure ( cue posts of people telling us why nit getting promoted is actually a great outcome ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duke Gekantawa Posted January 8 Report Share Posted January 8 14 minutes ago, javeajag said: The statistical evidence that matters is getting promoted. If we keep those stats and are in the championship next year then it’s failure ( cue posts of people telling us why nit getting promoted is actually a great outcome ) But if we punt our manager every time we fail to get promoted, we'd be a mess. To be honest, I'm not sure exactly what your point is. You said you didn't think McCall should have been punted when he was (i.e., when he was clearly again failing to win promotion while being heavily backed), and you've also said you don't think Doolan should be punted (even though he has been a failure so far by your own single metric). It seems that you view these managers as failures but think we should have stuck/stick with them. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlsarmy Posted January 8 Report Share Posted January 8 24 minutes ago, javeajag said: The statistical evidence that matters is getting promoted. If we keep those stats and are in the championship next year then it’s failure ( cue posts of people telling us why nit getting promoted is actually a great outcome ) Not really sure where you are coming from ? This was always going to be a season in transition because the playing budget was slashed because of the overspend from the previous incumbents ( MCCall included ) Probably lost our 4 best players into the bargain and at this moment I’m not sure the quality of these players has been replaced with the Wages on offer . At this moment I don’t think we’re ready for the step up yet but the signs are that we are making good progression Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlsarmy Posted January 8 Report Share Posted January 8 34 minutes ago, javeajag said: The statistical evidence that matters is getting promoted. If we keep those stats and are in the championship next year then it’s failure ( cue posts of people telling us why nit getting promoted is actually a great outcome ) That shouldn’t be the defining stat at our level. The supporters can see the progress , young players coming through the system and getting minutes in the first team which should be the template for the future. Did you really want to continue as per last season in the hunger or bust business model that Jaqui Lowe , McCall etc advocated They nearly put us out of business again Maybe time for a reality check Javeajag Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dl1971 Posted January 8 Report Share Posted January 8 57 minutes ago, javeajag said: The statistical evidence that matters is getting promoted. If we keep those stats and are in the championship next year then it’s failure ( cue posts of people telling us why nit getting promoted is actually a great outcome ) We can still get promoted. As you say it doesn't matter how. Automatic or play offs. You seem reluctant to give Doolan ( or the team ) any praise no matter what. That is of course up to you but your reasoning seems to have little....reason. I hope we do get promoted by whatever means, but if we don't it's not the end of the world. I don't think anyone has said not being promoted is a great outcome ( bar your own post ). Anyway onwards to Greenock. I'm predicting 4 3 to us... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted January 8 Report Share Posted January 8 41 minutes ago, Duke Gekantawa said: But if we punt our manager every time we fail to get promoted, we'd be a mess. To be honest, I'm not sure exactly what your point is. You said you didn't think McCall should have been punted when he was (i.e., when he was clearly again failing to win promotion while being heavily backed), and you've also said you don't think Doolan should be punted (even though he has been a failure so far by your own single metric). It seems that you view these managers as failures but think we should have stuck/stick with them. We will never know if McCall would have gotten promotion last season…. We know Doolan didn’t. We will see what he achieves this season then we can judge him, at the end of the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted January 8 Report Share Posted January 8 34 minutes ago, jlsarmy said: Not really sure where you are coming from ? This was always going to be a season in transition because the playing budget was slashed because of the overspend from the previous incumbents ( MCCall included ) Probably lost our 4 best players into the bargain and at this moment I’m not sure the quality of these players has been replaced with the Wages on offer . At this moment I don’t think we’re ready for the step up yet but the signs are that we are making good progression It’s quite simple I don’t accept it was always going to be a transition season ( it was going to be a transitional season for Liverpool this season oh look ) nor do I accept the four player excuse either. it will be really funny if we do get promotion and listen to how though it happened it shouldn’t have …. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dl1971 Posted January 8 Report Share Posted January 8 1 hour ago, javeajag said: It’s not complicated score lots of goals and don’t concede many that’s the route to football success look at Man City or Liverpool……our defensive capabilities will most likely cost us promotion Aye. Let's compare us to probably the best two teams in Europe. I think their defenders may be outwith our budget. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted January 8 Report Share Posted January 8 29 minutes ago, jlsarmy said: That shouldn’t be the defining stat at our level. The supporters can see the progress , young players coming through the system and getting minutes in the first team which should be the template for the future. Did you really want to continue as per last season in the hunger or bust business model that Jaqui Lowe , McCall etc advocated They nearly put us out of business again Maybe time for a reality check Javeajag Our level is in the premier league . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted January 8 Report Share Posted January 8 Just now, dl1971 said: Aye. Let's compare us to probably the best two teams in Europe. I think their defenders may be outwith our budget. Aim low go lower . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlsarmy Posted January 8 Report Share Posted January 8 3 minutes ago, javeajag said: It’s quite simple I don’t accept it was always going to be a transition season ( it was going to be a transitional season for Liverpool this season oh look ) nor do I accept the four player excuse either. it will be really funny if we do get promotion and listen to how though it happened it shouldn’t have …. The only difference is Liverpool spent 200 million to rebuild their team Absolutely no difference! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dl1971 Posted January 8 Report Share Posted January 8 5 minutes ago, javeajag said: We will never know if McCall would have gotten promotion last season…. We know Doolan didn’t. We will see what he achieves this season then we can judge him, at the end of the season. You can say that about any sacked manager. For example Wayne Rooney or Steve Cooper may be muttering I would have won the league if..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dl1971 Posted January 8 Report Share Posted January 8 6 minutes ago, javeajag said: It’s quite simple I don’t accept it was always going to be a transition season ( it was going to be a transitional season for Liverpool this season oh look ) nor do I accept the four player excuse either. it will be really funny if we do get promotion and listen to how though it happened it shouldn’t have …. So your position is you still expect us to get promoted? Just to pin you down, is promotion via the play offs a success? For future reference later in the season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlsarmy Posted January 8 Report Share Posted January 8 6 minutes ago, javeajag said: Our level is in the premier league . Where does that come from ? Apart from possibly Livingston, every other team in the SPFL has got a better infrastructure than us and that’s what we’re trying to aspire to . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted January 8 Report Share Posted January 8 7 minutes ago, jlsarmy said: The only difference is Liverpool spent 200 million to rebuild their team Absolutely no difference! Dear oh dear …. It’s the principle they changed their whole midfield , we lost four players …. It’s the same argument . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted January 8 Report Share Posted January 8 4 minutes ago, jlsarmy said: Where does that come from ? Apart from possibly Livingston, every other team in the SPFL has got a better infrastructure than us and that’s what we’re trying to aspire to . Therein lies the issue I think we should be in the premier league, you don’t. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted January 8 Report Share Posted January 8 6 minutes ago, dl1971 said: So your position is you still expect us to get promoted? Just to pin you down, is promotion via the play offs a success? For future reference later in the season. No reason why we can’t as much as you would hate us to , Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted January 8 Report Share Posted January 8 10 minutes ago, dl1971 said: You can say that about any sacked manager. For example Wayne Rooney or Steve Cooper may be muttering I would have won the league if..... It’s a simple fact. We sacked McCall and didn’t get promoted. Which was presumably the point of sacking him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert's Ghost Posted January 8 Report Share Posted January 8 5 minutes ago, javeajag said: It’s a simple fact. We sacked McCall and didn’t get promoted. Which was presumably the point of sacking him. No. We sacked McCall because we lost successive home games to the 2 worst sides in the league. I was at both games - I was raging. Dools just emerged from the equivalent 2 games with maximum points. Gie us peace. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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