Positive Spin - Overkill

[potty trained]

Now, in my opinion, that may have been the worst game of football I have ever witnessed. One shot on target from Morton (in the first half) and NO shots on target from Thistle (unless you include a block on their 6 yard line).

 

I really believe that the Thistle players either did not break sweat, or are a shambles of a team with very little skill, imagination, will to win, fight, desire, self belief, talent or passion. The sort of things you need to win a game. Or at least, if you don't win, to get the fans either out their seat, or at the very least, returning next week!

 

And yet, at Firhill:

 

Paddy Boyle:

 

Paddy felt that it was a game, that of the two teams, we had the stronger case for the three points.

 

we did have the better of the chances. In the first half in particular we had two or three really good chances and if we had taken one of them then it could have been a different game entirely.

 

All very well n good, but Paddy, you're describing a team who could not hit the target once in 90 minutes! Their keeper didn't have a save to make.

The fact that Saturday’s game signified the third consecutive home game in which we hadn’t conceded a single goal was probably the main plus point to take from the 90 minutes.

 

A plus? Or you can look at Morton and put them in the same bracket as Thistle. Devoid of anything and everything.

 

“The manager has been stressing to us the importance of making our home games count and trying to turn Firhill into a place where teams really don’t want to come.”

Well, as long as the team keeps that style of play up, there will be no atmosphere and away players will feel like they are playing in a reserve game. Is that the tactic?

“I think we owe the supporters a performance against Stirling Albion. When we lost there in the league recently and when they won at Firhill it wasn’t as if we had been unlucky in losing. They were better than us on the day and that’s something we want to try and put right. It’s a game that we are really looking forward to.”

 

Take aside the fact it is the Scottish Cup, are any fans looking forward to watching Thistle? It's one thing looking forward to attending... Meeting your mates, having a laugh... But is anyone actually looking forward to watching Thistle play against a part time team who have beaten us twice before the end of October?

 

Ian McCall Post Match:

 

Of the two sides it were Thistle that looked the most likely to break the deadlock, a view that manager Ian McCall concurred with.

 

Really? Without making their keeper make a save?

 

I felt that we had four really good chances. If you analysis the game then I think that we deserved to win 1-0

 

A bold statement from someone on a Saturday night who has almost definently not analysed the game. If you have 10 chances, hit the target with 3, then maybe you deserve to win 1-0. If you have 4 chances, and none of them hit the target, you have a problem.

 

If we had done that(won 1-0) then everyone would be going home happy at the end of the game.

 

Now that is nonsense. I don't think I would have been happy. Relieved, maybe. Happy, no. Satisfied? Definently not!

 

We didn’t though and the strikers really need to start to put the ball in the back of the net and they have been made aware of that.

 

See my signature quote from McCall under this thread, when he was trying to sell season tickets.

 

I’ve few complaints about the way we played at the back and through the middle of the park.

 

Really? That would suggest that we held the ball, passed it with ease and generally made it difficult for Morton. Strangely, I saw a defence and midfield who couldn't find a man, punted the ball in the air, or hit it 10 yards to the side of the player they were aiming at and watched the ball fly out the park.

 

“There’s seven teams that are battling away at the foot of the league"

 

Not strictly true, there are 5 teams with 4 points between them. Queens are 4 points above the five, equal with Dundee. Dundee have to wait on their appeal, but since they got their "points deduction" have not dropped a point, and don't look like doing so. Falkirk are only 2 points above Dundee and Queens, why not include them too. Is McCall saying that in November, that the league is a 2 horse race?

 

We have a great support but at times I just wish they would really get behind us and give the players the support that they deserve.”

 

What support did that display deserve? Does McCall think that that sort of football deserves £17 from people who in the middle of a recession are struggling to afford to buy fruit n veg for their kids, because a 99p microwave meal in iceland is a cheaper option? McCall, you are putting a product out to the people of Maryhill, first and foremost, then Glasgow. You are asking people to come see YOUR team, watch them, and enjoy it so much that they come back...

 

 

On Saturday's show, what is there to come back to?

Edited November 17, 2010 by potty trained

[Steven H]

 

On Saturday's show, what is there to come back to?

 

Aye lets all just chuck it, whats the point anyway?...Now were's that hosepipe coz I need it for my car exhaust.

 

I aint disagreeing with you, but you signed up for the sh!te we often endure following the Jags...suck it up or pack it in. Football is not meant to make people this miserable for this long. If you aint over a poor performance (which we got a point out of) by now you are perhaps forgetting the team you support. How is this era of PTFC much different to any other of the last 30 years (the Lambie years aside)?

Edited November 17, 2010 by Steven H

[PaleGreySky]

I agree with most, if not all, of that. We shouldn't be making excuses for anything about the teams performance so far this season. Does this mean McCall isn't looking to improve the midfield or defence's performances from Saturday? Our defence's distribution is one of the reasons we're so poor, and it's been holding us back for 2 or more seasons.

[potty trained]

Aye lets all just chuck it, whats the point anyway?...

 

The point is that I turn up on a Saturday. I meet my mates for a pint around half one. I go to Firhill full of the buzz as I walk up to and see the ground, take my seat. And watch the most pathetic excuse for a game I have seen.

 

If you had brought 3 stay away fans with you on Saturday, would you have apologised?

 

you signed up for the sh!te we often endure following the Jags...suck it up or pack it in.

 

So you admit that the product on the park is Sh!te? Whilst i can give and take a sh!te performance. I've been following Thistle for 21 years. Why should I part with £17. Yip, £17 quid to watch 1 shot on target in 90 minutes.

 

Football is not meant to make people this miserable for this long. If you aint over a poor performance by now you are perhaps forgetting the team you support.

 

Good point, turn up, part with my money, moan for 2 days, and back on the jolly bus, ready to watch us play a part time team we can't take a point off of!

 

How is this era of PTFC much different to any other of the last 30 years (the Lambie years aside)?

 

Because I can't see a way out of this mess.

 

 

Lets face it, the common theme in a "McCall must go" thread, is, who would we get to replace him? So if all those people are right, and there is no one able to replace McCall, then for the first time in 30 years, we are in a position where there is no way out. We have to endure this until he moves on and someone worse comes along.

[GrantB]

Didn't Colin Stewart tip a Martin grehan effort over the bar in the first 10 minutes or did I imagine it?

 

Also, Buchannan's effort a couple of mins later had the keeper beaten but was cleared off the line.

 

Apart from that, it was an awful game but Boyle is right in saying we had chances to score. Counting Grehan's shocking miss in the 2nd half, I'd say we had 3 that should have been goals.

 

By contrast, Morton had one shot which was going nowhere until a deflection and one free kick that Fox saved. neither could be described as good chances.

[lady-isobel-barnett]

I've long been a believer in a goalless draw getting 0pts. No team has scored so why should that team get the same as a team drawing 3-3. Besides it's quite easy for two teams to play out a 0-0 if say at the end of the season one team needs a point to win the league and the other to save relegation. More likely scenario would be if both teams needed only a point apiece to avoid relegation or qualify for Europe. The overriding reason for not awarding points for a 0-0 is to motivate teams to at least attack for some part of the game. Crowds are drifting away from the game and the last thing we need in general or at Firhill is an attitude (or perceived attitude) where clubs, players and managers are content (or appear content) with not scoring.

[Alan Murray]

People are forgetting that Morton beat Dunfermline the week before. Obviously we would like to win at home but every point is vital. We have started picking up points regularly and if we keep doing that then we will avoid relegation.

 

If McCall can keep us up and blood 6 or 7 or our young player’s then job well done for this season.

[Alan Murray]

I've long been a believer in a goalless draw getting 0pts. No team has scored so why should that team get the same as a team drawing 3-3. Besides it's quite easy for two teams to play out a 0-0 if say at the end of the season one team needs a point to win the league and the other to save relegation. More likely scenario would be if both teams needed only a point apiece to avoid relegation or qualify for Europe. The overriding reason for not awarding points for a 0-0 is to motivate teams to at least attack for some part of the game. Crowds are drifting away from the game and the last thing we need in general or at Firhill is an attitude (or perceived attitude) where clubs, players and managers are content (or appear content) with not scoring.

 

Total agreement about 0 points for a goalless draw.

[Big Col]

People are forgetting that Morton beat Dunfermline the week before. Obviously we would like to win at home but every point is vital. We have started picking up points regularly and if we keep doing that then we will avoid relegation.

 

If McCall can keep us up and blood 6 or 7 or our young player’s then job well done for this season.

 

After reading Jackie's comments in ET last night, it is doubtful we will see any young players in starting 11 any time soon which is a real shame cos we have some good talented young players who I am sure would do a better job than some of the jokers who have featured in recent games.

[Alan Murray]

After reading Jackie's comments in ET last night, it is doubtful we will see any young players in starting 11 any time soon which is a real shame cos we have some good talented young players who I am sure would do a better job than some of the jokers who have featured in recent games.

 

He has to play two under 21’s on Saturday so we could see one getting some playing time on from the bench. Over the next few months I think you will see a few getting on off the bench.

 

Bannigan played the full 90 mins for Ayr and comment on the Ayr forum suggests he played well. Pretty sure he will feature for us when he comes back.

[lady-isobel-barnett]

He has to play two under 21’s on Saturday so we could see one getting some playing time on from the bench. Over the next few months I think you will see a few getting on off the bench.

 

Bannigan played the full 90 mins for Ayr and comment on the Ayr forum suggests he played well. Pretty sure he will feature for us when he comes back.

Be interesting to see whether we'll allow Ayr to play him in the Cup.

[Big Col]

I think the issue of young players is one that we're all agreed on (there had to be one subject!).

 

Those that were involved in the pre-season and early league games showed good enthusiasm, skill and desire. Many other teams have done well with a good blend of youth and experience (Hamilton and ICT spring immediately to mind) so I hope that the door is open to our good young players in the not so distant future and they get a good run out in the team, and not just the last 5 minutes when we're already 2 down!

[uberteeb]

0 points for a 0-0 is a brilliant idea.

 

You could take it a step further and force clubs to issue a refund/voucher redeemable at the nearest pub if the game ends 0-0.

[Woodstock Jag]

0 points for a 0-0 is a brilliant idea.

 

You could take it a step further and force clubs to issue a refund/voucher redeemable at the nearest pub if the game ends 0-0.

 

The danger is it leads to a gentleman's agreement to let each other score really early on and not only do you feel cheated about the scoreline, but also about the drinks refund! That's not going to cheer up punters!

[Jaggernaut]

Now, in my opinion, that may have been the worst game of football I have ever witnessed. One shot on target from Morton (in the first half) and NO shots on target from Thistle (unless you include a block on their 6 yard line).

 

I really believe that the Thistle players either did not break sweat, or are a shambles of a team with very little skill, imagination, will to win, fight, desire, self belief, talent or passion. The sort of things you need to win a game. Or at least, if you don't win, to get the fans either out their seat, or at the very least, returning next week!

 

And yet, at Firhill:

 

Paddy Boyle:

 

Paddy felt that it was a game, that of the two teams, we had the stronger case for the three points.

 

we did have the better of the chances. In the first half in particular we had two or three really good chances and if we had taken one of them then it could have been a different game entirely.

 

All very well n good, but Paddy, you're describing a team who could not hit the target once in 90 minutes! Their keeper didn't have a save to make.

The fact that Saturday’s game signified the third consecutive home game in which we hadn’t conceded a single goal was probably the main plus point to take from the 90 minutes.

 

A plus? Or you can look at Morton and put them in the same bracket as Thistle. Devoid of anything and everything.

 

“The manager has been stressing to us the importance of making our home games count and trying to turn Firhill into a place where teams really don’t want to come.”

Well, as long as the team keeps that style of play up, there will be no atmosphere and away players will feel like they are playing in a reserve game. Is that the tactic?

“I think we owe the supporters a performance against Stirling Albion. When we lost there in the league recently and when they won at Firhill it wasn’t as if we had been unlucky in losing. They were better than us on the day and that’s something we want to try and put right. It’s a game that we are really looking forward to.”

 

Take aside the fact it is the Scottish Cup, are any fans looking forward to watching Thistle? It's one thing looking forward to attending... Meeting your mates, having a laugh... But is anyone actually looking forward to watching Thistle play against a part time team who have beaten us twice before the end of October?

 

Ian McCall Post Match:

 

Of the two sides it were Thistle that looked the most likely to break the deadlock, a view that manager Ian McCall concurred with.

 

Really? Without making their keeper make a save?

 

I felt that we had four really good chances. If you analysis the game then I think that we deserved to win 1-0

 

A bold statement from someone on a Saturday night who has almost definently not analysed the game. If you have 10 chances, hit the target with 3, then maybe you deserve to win 1-0. If you have 4 chances, and none of them hit the target, you have a problem.

 

If we had done that(won 1-0) then everyone would be going home happy at the end of the game.

 

Now that is nonsense. I don't think I would have been happy. Relieved, maybe. Happy, no. Satisfied? Definently not!

 

We didn’t though and the strikers really need to start to put the ball in the back of the net and they have been made aware of that.

 

See my signature quote from McCall under this thread, when he was trying to sell season tickets.

 

I’ve few complaints about the way we played at the back and through the middle of the park.

 

Really? That would suggest that we held the ball, passed it with ease and generally made it difficult for Morton. Strangely, I saw a defence and midfield who couldn't find a man, punted the ball in the air, or hit it 10 yards to the side of the player they were aiming at and watched the ball fly out the park.

 

“There’s seven teams that are battling away at the foot of the league"

 

Not strictly true, there are 5 teams with 4 points between them. Queens are 4 points above the five, equal with Dundee. Dundee have to wait on their appeal, but since they got their "points deduction" have not dropped a point, and don't look like doing so. Falkirk are only 2 points above Dundee and Queens, why not include them too. Is McCall saying that in November, that the league is a 2 horse race?

 

We have a great support but at times I just wish they would really get behind us and give the players the support that they deserve.”

 

What support did that display deserve? Does McCall think that that sort of football deserves £17 from people who in the middle of a recession are struggling to afford to buy fruit n veg for their kids, because a 99p microwave meal in iceland is a cheaper option? McCall, you are putting a product out to the people of Maryhill, first and foremost, then Glasgow. You are asking people to come see YOUR team, watch them, and enjoy it so much that they come back...

 

 

On Saturday's show, what is there to come back to?

Excellent alternative view. Well done.

[Jaggernaut]

Didn't Colin Stewart tip a Martin grehan effort over the bar in the first 10 minutes or did I imagine it?

 

Also, Buchannan's effort a couple of mins later had the keeper beaten but was cleared off the line.

 

Apart from that, it was an awful game but Boyle is right in saying we had chances to score. Counting Grehan's shocking miss in the 2nd half, I'd say we had 3 that should have been goals.

 

By contrast, Morton had one shot which was going nowhere until a deflection and one free kick that Fox saved. neither could be described as good chances.

I'm surprised that he hasn't come in for more criticism for what was really an inexcusable miss for a striker. Any half-decent striker would have put even just a little swerve on the shot so it would end up in at the post, but he just belted it in the direction his foot happened to be pointed. Terrible stuff.

[Jaggernaut]

I've long been a believer in a goalless draw getting 0pts. No team has scored so why should that team get the same as a team drawing 3-3. Besides it's quite easy for two teams to play out a 0-0 if say at the end of the season one team needs a point to win the league and the other to save relegation. More likely scenario would be if both teams needed only a point apiece to avoid relegation or qualify for Europe. The overriding reason for not awarding points for a 0-0 is to motivate teams to at least attack for some part of the game. Crowds are drifting away from the game and the last thing we need in general or at Firhill is an attitude (or perceived attitude) where clubs, players and managers are content (or appear content) with not scoring.

Serious suggestion here: why not do away with points completely, and simply use goals scored and shipped (i.e., goal difference) to decide league placings?

Edited November 17, 2010 by Jaggernaut

[Alan Murray]

Be interesting to see whether we'll allow Ayr to play him in the Cup.

 

I am sure McCall will let him play and that he will stay longer than a month. It’s a perfect move for him.

[yoda-jag]

Posts 1 & 4 by the OP, spot on.

 

All this smoke and mirrors and labouresque-spin, is poor stuff from McCall & Co, but hardly unexpected or a rarity when it comes to public utterances from within Firhill.

 

 

As for:

 

If McCall can keep us up and blood 6 or 7 or our young player’s then job well done for this season.

 

That would more preferrable to having to see the same old names on teamsheet, and would make the season more enjoyable and worthwhile for a good proportion of the Jags support IMO.

 

 

After reading Jackie's comments in ET last night, it is doubtful we will see any young players in starting 11 any time soon which is a real shame cos we have some good talented young players who I am sure would do a better job than some of the jokers who have featured in recent games.

 

Agree with this.

 

 

Those that were involved in the pre-season and early league games showed good enthusiasm, skill and desire. Many other teams have done well with a good blend of youth and experience (Hamilton and ICT spring immediately to mind) so I hope that the door is open to our good young players in the not so distant future and they get a good run out in the team, and not just the last 5 minutes when we're already 2 down!

 

And with this.