potty trained Posted January 17, 2012 Report Share Posted January 17, 2012 looks like 2 players zonal marking each other, i.e not body to body... Imrie checks Archie's run with a blocking chest. Archie "charges" imrie... in a "i'm bigger than you, who do you think you are" kind of way. He shoulder barges Imrie and momentum carries his head forward into the top of Imries head... his shoulder injures Imrie, and he gets a black eye off the top of Imries head. I think Archie intended to "charge" him, but obvious without intent of causing serious injury. Think it was more of a "who d'ye think ye are, blockin me, i'll show ye" moment from Archie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaleGreySky Posted January 17, 2012 Report Share Posted January 17, 2012 I don't think it looks like Archie's head that makes contact. He shoulder barges him it looks like. Don't know how Archie got the Lump on his head from that, but the end doesn't necessarily explain the means. Also, if you watch the timing carefully, the ref actually misses it and only turns his head just after the contact. I was ready to concede it was Archie's fault, but after seeing that Im not so sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fawlty Towers Posted January 17, 2012 Report Share Posted January 17, 2012 I did not see any headbutt from Archie, he shoulder charged Imrie nothing more or less (in my humble opinion). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrantB Posted January 17, 2012 Report Share Posted January 17, 2012 I read a comment from one of the Accies players that he switched with Imrie to pick up Archie seconds prior to the corner coming in. I think it's fair to say that Archie doesn't have his eye on the player when contact is made. It is possible that Archie doesn't even know what player he collided with which would make the accusation that it is a premeditated foul out of the question. Talk of stripping a great servant of the club captaincy over this is nothing short of disrespectful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasmclaughlin Posted January 17, 2012 Report Share Posted January 17, 2012 I did not see any headbutt from Archie, he shoulder charged Imrie nothing more or less (in my humble opinion). No need to be humble! I didn't see any headbutt either. He nudged him away ,I'm wondering whether the side of his head hit Imrie. I know all players act up a bit ,but I think Archie might have briefly thought he was the "victim". Worth an appeal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted January 18, 2012 Report Share Posted January 18, 2012 (edited) it was indisciplined and it did lead to an action that would be classed as an assault if it happened anywhere other than a sports field. That's wee bit clichéd, DP. Just about any straight sending off (for violent conduct) could be termed as assault outside of a football field. Anyway I can't see enough from that clip to make a judgement one way or other. I know Archie has previous but his red cards are hardly than often an occurrence. Also we've got a ref who's evidently been demoted by being taken off the SPL circle. I assume his 2 red cards and 17 yellows in his last 4 games last season may have had something to do with that. He has now sent off 5 players in his last twelve matches. Even leaving out the obvious handball error in the Raith game his officiating in the two games we've had him of late has been atrocious. And there rests the case for the defence Edited January 18, 2012 by lady-isobel-barnett Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ian_mac Posted January 18, 2012 Report Share Posted January 18, 2012 Sorry lads, there is definitely intent from Archie towards Imrie. His head lunges towards Imrie when the ball is nowhere near either of them. That's a clear sign of intent and he deserved to be sent off for the extent of the injury he caused as well. All things considered, a very costly error of a judgement from an experienced professional who really should know better Spoke to someone yesterday who said it could be a sign of Archie's frustration as he realises that his legs have gone and he can't quite cut it at this level anymore. Let's not forget that this guy was touted as a potential Scotland cap in his younger days. Things haven't quite worked out that way. He definitely isn't the player he once was, not even as good as when he returned to the club for his second spell. He is becoming a liability, dare I say it, a bombscare. Add to that, he is NEVER a captain. I'd certainly have Rowson as captain before him and even Paton would be a better bet since his move in to the centre of midfield. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Willjag Posted January 18, 2012 Members Report Share Posted January 18, 2012 Looks like a clear head butt to me. As for the other issues, he's the senior member of a defence that doesn't give very much away despite having quite a few younger players there. You don't need to be quick to play his position. The yards he'll have lost in pace will have been regained by his experience and reading of the game. Probably Captain owing to the example he shows to the younger members of the team (Let himself down on Friday admiteddly!) and the fact he's been at the Club so long. Rowson is probably the best leader on the park closely followed by Kinniburgh and Paton. Paton is vocal and very determined and I'd hope he sticks around long enough to make a Jags Captain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamiltonjag Posted January 19, 2012 Report Share Posted January 19, 2012 Aw nawwww. So it's true then, you really should never argue with idiots as they just bring you down to their level No argument there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balintore jag Posted January 19, 2012 Report Share Posted January 19, 2012 This topic has generated a lot of talk about Archie's intent and was it a head butt or not. Look again at the incident and you will see clearly that the ref was not looking at the incident. He turned his head round after Imrie had gone down. He probably saw the blood and promptly sent Archie off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty Posted January 19, 2012 Report Share Posted January 19, 2012 Spoke to someone yesterday who said it could be a sign of Archie's frustration as he realises that his legs have gone and he can't quite cut it at this level anymore. Can't remember the excuse the last time Archie got sent off for nutting someone but am sure it wasn't this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ian_mac Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 This topic has generated a lot of talk about Archie's intent and was it a head butt or not. Look again at the incident and you will see clearly that the ref was not looking at the incident. He turned his head round after Imrie had gone down. He probably saw the blood and promptly sent Archie off. It's a clear headbutt, can't believe people are still debating this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
potty trained Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 It's a clear headbutt, can't believe people are still debating this. Even if it's not a deliberate head butt, the intent was on Archies side to either head but or shoulder charge, the blame lies with him... if it doesn't and he is the innocent party... why isn't he appealing the decision? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoda-jag Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 Even if it's not a deliberate head butt, the intent was on Archies side to either head but or shoulder charge, the blame lies with him... if it doesn't and he is the innocent party... why isn't he appealing the decision? in a nut (shell) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 Anyways I see Archie has heidbutted Imrie all the way to Paisley. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 John Lambie Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 No way was it a deliberate headbutt, Archie ran forward, with no doubt the intent to give Imrie agoodmdunt with his shoulder. This he does, but with Imrie standing firm Archie's head flies forward & makes contact. There's no way he deliberately went to nut him, but given the fact he did, by mistake, it is probably still a red card. The area that Imrie was caught is fragile & that's why it looked really bad, The ref also missed the incident, seeing Imrie falling to the ground & putting 2 & 2 together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Murray Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 No way was it a deliberate headbutt, Archie ran forward, with no doubt the intent to give Imrie agoodmdunt with his shoulder. This he does, but with Imrie standing firm Archie's head flies forward & makes contact. There's no way he deliberately went to nut him, but given the fact he did, by mistake, it is probably still a red card. The area that Imrie was caught is fragile & that's why it looked really bad, The ref also missed the incident, seeing Imrie falling to the ground & putting 2 & 2 together. This is most likely what happened but it’s not clear to say for certain either way for me. The only person who could tell you for certain is Archie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Earl of Hathaway Posted January 20, 2012 Report Share Posted January 20, 2012 (edited) Two things: 1) I was there last Friday and I'm amazed we managed to get A highlight out of i, far less 5 minutes 2) I don't know if Archie stuck the heid on Imrie, but even if he didn't, it's amazing the amount of other football fans that I've talked to (Motherwell, Old Firm, Queens Park) who see it as a perfectly reasonable thing to do..... (even if I don't think it is) PS Anyone remember Archie's previous straight red? Zahany-Oni, anyone? Edited January 20, 2012 by The Earl of Hathaway Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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