ChewinGumMacaroonBaaaz Posted July 2, 2013 Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 (edited) The problem was inevitable and the solution should have been addressed and solved prior to the sale of season tickets, after potential problems were made evident at the morton game ( 1-0 ) . Give the smeltic fans ( or large away supports) the south half of the JHS. The main stand is a designated family section for both supports with extra stewarding. The north stand remains the domain of the vocal Thistle support we should be extremely proud of and encouraging to grow rather than acting like a club with no spine or self respect. I would add in explanation that, from my reading of the issue, the re-arrangement of supporter placement has been driven by the police. Their main concerns being, not only the flare issue but, fan movement and inter-action on approach and departure from the stadium. What a c*ck up. Let's hope it does not reflect the sporting efforts of the club. edit : doh! Edited July 2, 2013 by ChewinGumMacaroonBaaaz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uberteeb Posted July 2, 2013 Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 The problem was inevitable and the solution should have been addressed and solved prior to the sale of season tickets, after potential problems were made evident at the morton game ( 1-0 ) . Give the smeltic fans ( or large away supports) the south half of the JHS. The main stand is a designated family section for both supports with extra stewarding. The north stand remains the domain of the vocal Thistle support we should be extremely proud of and encouraging to grow rather than acting like a club with no spine or self respect. I would add in explanation that, from my reading of the issue, the re-arrangement of supporter placement has been driven by the police. Their main concerns being, not only the flare issue but, fan movement and inter-action on approach and departure from the stadium. What a c*ck up. Let's hope it does not reflect the sporting efforts of the club. edit : doh! The only thing that could be considered a problem at the Morton game was that the opening of the overspill area in the JHS. This is irrelevant to any ticketed game (ie all SPL ones) as we will know exactly whether the JHS overspill area will need to be open as we will know exactly how many away tickets we have sold and for what areas. The segregation before/after the game is a total misnomer. In the other thread examples were given of when this happens at other grounds. This is very easily solved by keeping away fans in for a short period after the final whistle, this is routinely done at other games. If the police can keep a few thousand Celtic fans safe from 40,000+ Rangers fans who surround the Celtic fans on both sides at Ibrox they can do it at Firhill. It seems the police can't be bothered, same way they can't be bothered ensuring they don't bring in dangerous illegal items to the ground in the first place. Where was the challenge from the club on this? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Willjag Posted July 2, 2013 Members Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 Ok. Let's approach this from a different angle. Given that moving the singing section to the North Stand last season was a great success and praised by fans, players and board members alike, does anyone really think the Club would have given this success up so easily without a fight? The we come to the question of why don't the Club communicate that it's only for the Celtic home games as hinted by various Club insiders. So the Club make this announcement then in the next few weeks, we draw Rangers at home in the Cup and they have to come and say, "Sorry we know we said it was only for Celtic league games but we have to include this as well" or some unforeseen circumstance happens and again they have to ask the fans not to use the North Stand. It would cause an uproar every time. I'd argue that it's better to say nothing at all and allow hints to be dropped than to make a statement that they may have to go back on. As it happens, I reckon this latest "interview" with Beattie is just a rehash of what he said a few weeks ago. There doesn't look as if there's anything new there. Column inches filled with old news on a slow news day isn't that unusual is it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jags365 Posted July 2, 2013 Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 Hope we're all looking forward to the 'Meet the Board' night to be held eh..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uberteeb Posted July 2, 2013 Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 Ok. Let's approach this from a different angle. Given that moving the singing section to the North Stand last season was a great success and praised by fans, players and board members alike, does anyone really think the Club would have given this success up so easily without a fight? The we come to the question of why don't the Club communicate that it's only for the Celtic home games as hinted by various Club insiders. So the Club make this announcement then in the next few weeks, we draw Rangers at home in the Cup and they have to come and say, "Sorry we know we said it was only for Celtic league games but we have to include this as well" or some unforeseen circumstance happens and again they have to ask the fans not to use the North Stand. It would cause an uproar every time. I'd argue that it's better to say nothing at all and allow hints to be dropped than to make a statement that they may have to go back on. As it happens, I reckon this latest "interview" with Beattie is just a rehash of what he said a few weeks ago. There doesn't look as if there's anything new there. Column inches filled with old news on a slow news day isn't that unusual is it? Do you have anything to suggest this isn't exactly what has happened. Looks that way to me. You talk about not putting up a fight, what fight? There seems to have been one meeting where questions were asked between the club and authorities. The club have then accepted everything they said. Beattie then dismisses it as upsetting 'a few' fans but for the greater good. I see absolutely no evidence that we have put up a fight, either directly to the authorities or through the media. If Beattie has put up a fight I would expect him to have told the fans exactly how hard he fought and who with, as you say "moving the singing section to the North Stand last season was a great success and praised by fans, players and board members alike". He is also fully aware how many fans he has upset with this move yet provides no detail about how hard he fought. And your bit about a potential Rangers game, he could set out in black and white that for all other SPL games (the ones we pay for through season tickets), we will be in the North Stand. He hasn't done this, and even if he did it does not account for the Celtic shambles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mediocre Pundit Posted July 2, 2013 Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 I was all ready to buy a ST a few weeks ago, especially given the positivityy at the end of last season, and then this nonsense happened. I've not bought one yet and doubt that I will. I would never have attended enough home games to make it "value for money" (sic) but wanted to do it as a gesture of appreciation to the club. Currently I just feel like I'll attend those games I can make, paying at the gate, and probably not attend any game where I can't stand in the North Stand. Not negative, not bitter, just my opinion and how I feel. All totally avoidable if our board had chosen to put our fans before the needs of a bunch of ned hooligans from the East End. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChewinGumMacaroonBaaaz Posted July 2, 2013 Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 (edited) The only thing that could be considered a problem at the Morton game was that the opening of the overspill area in the JHS. This is irrelevant to any ticketed game (ie all SPL ones) as we will know exactly whether the JHS overspill area will need to be open as we will know exactly how many away tickets we have sold and for what areas. The segregation before/after the game is a total misnomer. In the other thread examples were given of when this happens at other grounds. This is very easily solved by keeping away fans in for a short period after the final whistle, this is routinely done at other games. If the police can keep a few thousand Celtic fans safe from 40,000+ Rangers fans who surround the Celtic fans on both sides at Ibrox they can do it at Firhill. It seems the police can't be bothered, same way they can't be bothered ensuring they don't bring in dangerous illegal items to the ground in the first place. Where was the challenge from the club on this? You may not have considered it a problem, but I have little doubt the police, who witnessed the jubilant jags fans exiting the north stand, turning left towards the star and garter on a victory march, straight through the miserable morton mob, exiting the main stand and turning right towards their buses, would have thought their may have been some slight potential for some cross words and joshing between the two sets of supporters. Although not wholly ineffective, holding fans in is a last resort as far as the police are concerned. It riles up those being penned in, and if there is some in the the other support intent on causing trouble, it gives them a chance to organise their assault or "mob up", leaving the police the additional problem of having to disperse them. Success of this method usually relies on holding fans inside a ground for 30-40 minutes or more. A short time? More broken seats in the JHS courtesy of the smeltic "part-time" baby crew? Short of a body search on every individual entering the ground, how can the police guarantee no dangerous illegal items enter the ground? And, if a flare or is set off it cant be easy finding the culprit. Police can't be bothered? .... Na. The police advised. The club agreed. It's the club who can't be bothered on this issue. I say there are other obvious options which would have been better. That is all. Edited July 2, 2013 by ChewinGumMacaroonBaaaz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allyo Posted July 2, 2013 Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 (edited) The problem was inevitable and the solution should have been addressed and solved prior to the sale of season tickets, after potential problems were made evident at the morton game ( 1-0 ) . Give the smeltic fans ( or large away supports) the south half of the JHS. The main stand is a designated family section for both supports with extra stewarding. The north stand remains the domain of the vocal Thistle support we should be extremely proud of and encouraging to grow rather than acting like a club with no spine or self respect. edit : doh! Sorry. I'm repeating myself. But why should we be giving half of the best stand at Firhill to away fans, in favour of one behind the goals? You can argue either way, fact is that JH is a better view and it's where most Jags fans want to sit. You've just suggested giving away the spot that I've bought a season ticket for, and where I've been sitting or standing at Firhill for the last 30 years. I'd be unhappy at being stuck behind the goals (though I wouldn't make this much fuss about it). Fact is you can't please everyone. Edited July 2, 2013 by allyo 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougie T Posted July 2, 2013 Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 Sorry. I'm repeating myself. But why should we be giving half of the best stand at Firhill to away fans, in favour of one behind the goals? You can argue either way, fact is that JH is a better view and it's where most Jags fans want to sit. You've just suggested giving away the spot that I've bought a season ticket for, and where I've been sitting or standing at Firhill for the last 30 years. I'd be unhappy at being stuck behind the goals (though I wouldn't make this much fuss about it). Fact is you can't please everyone. Yep, I'm a North Stander but there is no way we should be moving the JHS Jags fans either. Ideal solution IMO would have been to give the Celtic fans the 2 away sections of JHS stand (like for most teams we played last season), keep Main Stand closed if necessary and Jackie Husband Jags And North Stand Jags dominate the away support with our noise, singing and general bedlam, like what a real home game should be like. home advantage and all that. But aye, no way any Jags fans anywhere should have to move for a home match! Having said that, the man Beattie seems to be doing a good job but this whole North Stand controversy is a let down really. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the saint Posted July 2, 2013 Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 Some wise words by Willjag and Allyo and some complete over reaction by others Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lenziejag Posted July 2, 2013 Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 Again, it's all about the way these things are communicated Will. People may have been told face to face that it's only for the Celtic game, but that has never been clarified officially. Beattie has done many interviews, and had plenty of opportunities to tell us that it's only Celtic who will get the North Stand. So why has he not done this? Why are office staff telling fans what they want to hear on an individual basis? For a start, probably to save themselves from being drawn in to an argument. And obviously, they want to make sure that they get your season ticket money there and then. To be honest, at the moment I just don't trust anything that's being said, as I know fine well that the board can go back on their word when it suits them. When me and Dave were first consulted on the North Stand move, we were promised that the North Stand would be ours and we wouldn't be moved for anyone. Had we not been given this assurance we wouldn't have got involved. The reason we asked for this assurance was precisely to avoid the situation that we now find ourselves in. So excuse me for not being too confident in the new promises being made by the club regarding the North Stand. Ian, How about the One thistle group try to get a meeting with David Beattie and ask him. To me, all the confusion is coming about from how the media are reporting the situation and we all know that they always tell it as it is ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambies Lost Doo Posted July 2, 2013 Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 Mediocre Pundit. It is disappointing you have turned into a drama queen. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mediocre Pundit Posted July 2, 2013 Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 Mediocre Pundit. It is disappointing you have turned into a drama queen. There was no logic in me buying a ST, I play sport on Saturdays and will make, at a push, ten home games. I was buying one due to feel good factor around the club. Sadly the way this issue has been handled, including the dismissive copy-and-paste reply to the email I sent the club on the matter, destroyed a lot of that. I'll still go to as many games as I can make and I'll pay at the gate. I'll still be supporting the team with all my heart. But this needless issue, badly handled, has taken the shine off things, and hats the difference between 'donating' some extra money to the club and not. If you think that's being a drama queen then fair enough. But if the club want to treat me like a customer I'll reserve the right to act like one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uberteeb Posted July 2, 2013 Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 Ian, How about the One thistle group try to get a meeting with David Beattie and ask him. To me, all the confusion is coming about from how the media are reporting the situation and we all know that they always tell it as it is ! We have a website, we can put exactly what we want there. We haven't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr.D Posted July 2, 2013 Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 I was all ready to buy a ST a few weeks ago, especially given the positivityy at the end of last season, and then this nonsense happened. I've not bought one yet and doubt that I will. I would never have attended enough home games to make it "value for money" (sic) but wanted to do it as a gesture of appreciation to the club. Currently I just feel like I'll attend those games I can make, paying at the gate, and probably not attend any game where I can't stand in the North Stand. Not negative, not bitter, just my opinion and how I feel. All totally avoidable if our board had chosen to put our fans before the needs of a bunch of ned hooligans from the East End. Yes, spoken like a real Partick Thistle supporter. Onwards and upwards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lenziejag Posted July 3, 2013 Report Share Posted July 3, 2013 We have a website, we can put exactly what we want there. We haven't. Last year a statement was put on the website regarding the vote for Rangers in SFL1 or SFL 3 which wasn't believed. That is why I suggest that you should try to get a meeting and ask him directly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uberteeb Posted July 3, 2013 Report Share Posted July 3, 2013 Last year a statement was put on the website regarding the vote for Rangers in SFL1 or SFL 3 which wasn't believed. That is why I suggest that you should try to get a meeting and ask him directly The club chose how to word the statement on the website, nobody else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lenziejag Posted July 3, 2013 Report Share Posted July 3, 2013 The club chose how to word the statement on the website, nobody else. Missing the point. Even putting a statement on the website might not be enough for some people. Therefore, somebody(like One thistle) need to speak to him personally and ask the specific question you want answered eg how often are the Thistle fans likely to be moved from the NS this season. If you are a recognised part of One Thistle, why don't you do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ian_mac Posted July 3, 2013 Report Share Posted July 3, 2013 Onethistle don't get involved in club politics, never have done and never will, they are a matchday operations team. If only we had an actual fans representative body, who maybe had a substantial shareholding in the club? That's the kind of body with an actual bonafide mandate to ask these types of questions. IE - Exactly what the jags trust have in name, but in reality, have never risen to the challenge of resolving conflicts between supporters and the club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uberteeb Posted July 3, 2013 Report Share Posted July 3, 2013 Missing the point. Even putting a statement on the website might not be enough for some people. Therefore, somebody(like One thistle) need to speak to him personally and ask the specific question you want answered eg how often are the Thistle fans likely to be moved from the NS this season. If you are a recognised part of One Thistle, why don't you do it. Putting out a completely clear statement would satisfy everyone, And I don't have enough hair to be in One Thistle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lenziejag Posted July 3, 2013 Report Share Posted July 3, 2013 Ian/uberteeb, Why are you both reluctant to get the real story directly from he Chairman. For me, your accusations of poor communication by the club are wearing thin if you are not prepared to try to clarify it yourselves Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uberteeb Posted July 3, 2013 Report Share Posted July 3, 2013 Ian/uberteeb, Why are you both reluctant to get the real story directly from he Chairman. For me, your accusations of poor communication by the club are wearing thin if you are not prepared to try to clarify it yourselves I wrote him an email, he didn't read it and got someone to forward me an automated message. Either that or he did read it and chose not to reply. Do you want me to go to his house and chap his door? How do you suggest I get a response from him? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ian_mac Posted July 3, 2013 Report Share Posted July 3, 2013 (edited) Ian/uberteeb, Why are you both reluctant to get the real story directly from he Chairman. For me, your accusations of poor communication by the club are wearing thin if you are not prepared to try to clarify it yourselves Reluctant? Are you having a f*cking laugh? How do you know that I haven't been doing exactly as you've been suggesting? I also e-mailed the chairman and received this response: Thank you for your email. I refer you to the statement on www.ptfc.co.uk, the club will not be making any further comment. Regards Andrew Byron That's the only way I currently have of getting in contact with the chairman. Sorry if you thought otherwise, but I don't have a cold-war style hotline straight to his desk. Also, not that it's any of your business, but myself and Dave have been in constant dialogue with Jim and Lance throughout this whole affair, seeking clarification from the chairman. So, now that I've clarified that, how about I tell you what's wearing thin. The fact that you and other jags fans now seem to be mocking those who feel aggrieved by this decision. Also, accusing those of us who have been the most vocal of being "reluctant" to seek clarification is a complete and utter contradiction. The reason we have been so vocal is precisely because WE ARE SEEKING CLARIFICATION. Seeing as how our emails have been ignored, how else would you suggest we do this? I'd be really interested to know. If you think that we are simply using this issue to indulge in a bit of board bashing, then again, I can point you to plenty of threads throughout last season where myself, potty trained and uberteeb have supported and defended the club on many different issues. Edited July 3, 2013 by ian_mac 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lenziejag Posted July 4, 2013 Report Share Posted July 4, 2013 Ok guys, Maybe I missed something in earlier posts that you have made - but these last 2 posts are the only ones I read where it is clear you have made contact with the club. I now understand your frustration and disappointment at the lack of response from the club. However, I still like to think that it will only be the Celtic games the fans are moved from the NS and prefer to give the benefit of the doubt to the club rather than think the worse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uberteeb Posted July 4, 2013 Report Share Posted July 4, 2013 Ok guys, Maybe I missed something in earlier posts that you have made - but these last 2 posts are the only ones I read where it is clear you have made contact with the club. I now understand your frustration and disappointment at the lack of response from the club. However, I still like to think that it will only be the Celtic games the fans are moved from the NS and prefer to give the benefit of the doubt to the club rather than think the worse Fool me once, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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