Jaggernaut Posted June 18, 2013 Report Share Posted June 18, 2013 The only way round this, that I can see, is to politely say to Celtic; "We have allocated you the Main Stand but the police and council are advising us not to give you these tickets due to previous behaviour of your supporters, sorry about this but our hands are tied." Therefore we play the game with only Jags fans in the ground. This way there are no fires, no smashed seats, no fighting and we wont have rolled over as a club. The alternatives are embarrassing. 100% correct. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jag Posted June 18, 2013 Report Share Posted June 18, 2013 The only way round this, that I can see, is to politely say to Celtic; "We have allocated you the Main Stand but the police and council are advising us not to give you these tickets due to previous behaviour of your supporters, sorry about this but our hands are tied." Therefore we play the game with only Jags fans in the ground. This way there are no fires, no smashed seats, no fighting and we wont have rolled over as a club. The alternatives are embarrassing. If only this would happen. Keep the filthy bogtrotters out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjptfc Posted June 18, 2013 Report Share Posted June 18, 2013 (edited) If I thought it was possible I would be 100% behind it but we got 5000 for promotion and Cup Games - not looking to be negative just looking at how realistic it would be as an aim That's fair comment. To be honest, attendances aside, what I mean is what would the boards feelings be on not giving Celtic an allocation? Edited June 18, 2013 by cjptfc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mediocre Pundit Posted June 18, 2013 Report Share Posted June 18, 2013 Did anyone else get a shitty automatic response to the email they sent? It's also the most obvious auto response when the emails in arial while my name is in times new roman... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoda-jag Posted June 18, 2013 Report Share Posted June 18, 2013 (edited) I don't get this. This is a change to protect Thistle, as they have been advised, and have good reason, to not trust the Sellick fans. It's disappointing but why read things into it that don't exist? It's not even a great position, behind the goals. It means something to our fans, but we're not giving away the best seats in the house. You don't get this ..... And therein lies the problem. We are being fed the line "it's to protect Thistle", and partially that may be true (as in attempting limit some of the damage Firhill will be inflicted with when TGFITW come calling), BUT the bigger picture is it potentially opens the floodgates to the North Stand Shed Singers being moved for countless games (not just one or two games with the green arse cheek), should the police and club be too feart to deal with troublesome away supporters. Such a move could also massively disadvantage (not "protect") Thistle ....we should be maximising our home advantage in our favour, whichever way possible, and the NS is a massive factor that should never be handed over. The North stand.....which you say is "not even a great position" ...... This is the Singing section, the beating heart (and colour) of the Thistle support, the 12th man, the factor that has been repeatedly credited by players, managers (yes, both Judas and Archie), the coaching staff, the board, the media ..... ALL have been hugely positive and favourable in their praise of the CONSTANT vocal backing they received last season, from behind the goals - it's location and structure acoustically means it is the best and most effective location anywhere inside the confines of Firhill where the sounds emanates best and to the maximum effect, from the singers onto the pitch and around the stadium in its splay. The same numbers in the JHS is not as effective, and neither is the (excellent) main stand. But everyone to a man and boy says the atmosphere has been the best at Firhill with the implementation of the North Stand Singing Section, since the halcyon days of the old (and original) shed. Rather than stand up for the supporters everyone connected with the club has heaped praise and thanks on, the board is taking the short term view and easy way out, to roll over for the seat smashing pyromaniac bigotted green arse cheek (and would no doubt do same with the rioting-in-any-city-home-or-abroad blue bigot arse cheek if/when they come calling), and making sure they get the bigots MONEY and to make sure the police have a nice easy day out watching and listening to the the destruction and bile these away supports create, but making no moves to arrest such miscreants, as they wouldn't want to upset them. So it's let the police not do the job they are employed for (to keep order and ensure laws are abided by, and to arrest anyone not doing so, in whatever shape or form it is), PAY the police for the privelage, see and hear our stadium be soiled by the great unwashed and their bigotted sectarian guff and whatever damage they feel so inclined to inflict on our stadium (not to mention the likelihood of assaults outside the stadium in the surrounding streets), and give up and hand over the most important part of the ground that everyone has credited as a major factor in our teams performances and results last season. So, hopefully you now get it allyo, its about the bigotted pounds, and to hell with the Thistle support. We after all, are only the ones who will contribute (at least) £15 for every £1 (and pisses all over murrays £10 for every £5) the green arse cheek will contribute to Thistles coffers this coming season (based on 3000 green arses x 2 games (ave £15/head) = £100k approx, while 4,000 thistle supporters (ave £15/head) x 18 games, plus merchandise(average £50/head), players sponsorship, hospitality etc = £1.5 million (and thats a conservative estimate). How many times will we have to move the north stand singers this coming season? 2 times? 3? 4? 6? 10? Sure fire way to piss offf your main customer base. As others have suggested ..... politelly tell them no, due to Police advice that they can't be sited in the Main Stand because of some of their less savoury supporters, we can't give them any tickets, or, at best, 1,000 in the JHS, but ra cellic will have to foot the bill for all policing and stewarding of their support inside and outside the ground. If they don't accept these conditions ..... tough, we were entirelly reasonable and tried our best to accommodate them, but they will have no supporters in the ground for their visits to Fihill. Home supporters should NOT be moved to accommodate away supporters of any club. Ra cellic (or any other SPFL club) wouldn't do it for us, why should we do ra cellic (or any other SPFL club) ? Edited June 18, 2013 by yoda-jag Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristle Posted June 18, 2013 Report Share Posted June 18, 2013 (edited) If I thought it was possible I would be 100% behind it but we got 5000 for promotion and Cup Games - not looking to be negative just looking at how realistic it would be as an aim Would have thought the Glasgow derby would have been a marketing dream...and 8000 would be realistic given some more press exposure. Guess time will tell Edited June 18, 2013 by Bristle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MerryHell Posted June 18, 2013 Report Share Posted June 18, 2013 Many Jags fans are sitting stewing right now. My mind has drfited to this stance. We could have a "bring a mate" campaign. With a positive campaign I'm totally sure we could pull in an extremely healthy 8,000 + Noble. Moral. Just. We maybe could, but I don't think banning them would help. I imagine many of them would just roll up to the ticket booth and buy a ticket and sit where they wanted. I know the suggestion was made with the best of intentions, but I actually think it would be worse to have them amongst us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uberteeb Posted June 18, 2013 Report Share Posted June 18, 2013 If we took the principled stance we please our supporters and have our dignity intact, and what would inevitably happen is when Celtic fans do the complaining they would be listened to and the situation remidied in such a way they can attend in the Main Stand just like we all want. We have our dignity, Celtic can cry victim, Glasgow City Council can feel smug for rescuing them and the police on the back of the furore can look good when 10,000 people go home safely. Everyone's a winner. In short, tell them to naff off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoda-jag Posted June 18, 2013 Report Share Posted June 18, 2013 Bringing flares into the ground is banned under "The Sporting Events (Control of Alcohol etc.) Act 1985" of which adds to the Football Scotland Act 1980 (If i remember right), plus the fireworks act (2004 I think), so they are banned, by moving us and bowing down to Celtic we (And Strathclydes finest) are in fact stating that we believe this act will be broken within our property prior to it taking place, and are not trying to stop it, we are allowing it to happen and only moving it. The risk still exists that they will launch flares or fireworks even into the main stand (where our fans will be) unless everyone is fully searched or we ban them before the game, and going on their behavior at the Glasgow cup I would ban them plus their blue brothers next time they visit. What was it Beattie stated "Morals over money" or words to that effect Maybe he has a touch of the Judas, and his definition of morals is blurred when a few short term pound signs flash in front of his eyes. Selective memory is a curse when blinded by a few grubby quid for some. Well, in my opinion the solution should be to deny Celtic a ticket allocation. The only way round this, that I can see, is to politely say to Celtic; "We have allocated you the Main Stand but the police and council are advising us not to give you these tickets due to previous behaviour of your supporters, sorry about this but our hands are tied." Therefore we play the game with only Jags fans in the ground. This way there are no fires, no smashed seats, no fighting and we wont have rolled over as a club. The alternatives are embarrassing. Many Jags fans are sitting stewing right now. My mind has drfited to this stance. We could have a "bring a mate" campaign. With a positive campaign I'm totally sure we could pull in an extremely healthy 8,000 + Noble. Moral. Just. Every word of these above. on the spot, they are. If I thought it was possible I would be 100% behind it but we got 5000 for promotion and Cup Games - not looking to be negative just looking at how realistic it would be as an aim I think you underestimate the Jags support and depth and strnegth of feeling over this Jim. #disappointed That would imply that there is a financial element in the decision which has been taken as opposed to the purely safety line which has so far been taken. I think the poster makes a very good suggestion and unless we are obligated by the league to offer the away team an allocation of tickets for their fans then I would support what has been suggested. As David Beattie says - "morals over money". FT, i posted my chapter on this above, before reading your post, but you have struck the nail on the head same way. And there's that pesky annoying and inconvenient word again, "morals". Can't people forget this word, please, just for David Beatties and the club boards sake? Alternatively could we not offer Celtic the main stand on the proviso they are fully responsible for the behaviour of their fans inside the stadium? If they cannot accept this then no tickets. I'm sure we could attract a decent crowd and it would almost certainly generate TV interest I wouldn't trust stewarding them with their own stewards - look how effective they were at the Glasgow Cup Youth Cup Final - they just stood and watched and done the square root of diddley****ingsquat. We took 12,000 to Hampden for the Rangers semi, Around 6,000 to Livingston for the Ramsdens We must have had 6,500 to 7,000 for the Morton game. I'm pretty sure (esp. with a rallying call) we could get over 8,000 Jags fans for this one. First time back in the top league for a while always gets a boost as well. Add in a resolute stance from PTFC, clear statement as discussed already, stating reasons why little or no cellic support in Firhill, and reitterating the fact that PTFC is the clear and bigot free alternative to the two ugly sisters of our fair city, and PTFC are not moving any of their supporters to accomodate away supports, especially where they have a history of trouble on their away fixtures, and PTFC are making a stand (even if it means losing £50 or £100k), for the greater good of PTFC, Scottish Football, Glasgow, Society, and every decent law abiding football supporter in the country. Like the Morton game, such a scenario and stance, it would also attract the neutral in substantial numbers too (especially if cellic had no tickets), and imagine this - a Firhill, bouncing and rocking with stands full of red and yellow and a vociferous home support, playing against the green arse cheek - maximising our home advantage, and potentially seeing our kids humble their megastars, and proving that Thistle are, indeed, the greatest team the world has ever seen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uberteeb Posted June 18, 2013 Report Share Posted June 18, 2013 Being in the SPL wlll pull a lot of fans who have been in hiding out of the woodwork, surely being in the SPL and having a right go at Celtic and standing up for ourselves in the face of being bullied would pull even more fans who have been hiding out of the woodwork. Or even tempt people to committing to a season ticket instead of picking and choosing matches. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nas Posted June 19, 2013 Report Share Posted June 19, 2013 maybe i'm over simplifying it but if celtic are getting the north stand and presumably away section of jhs does this not mean singing section can be housed in the main stand? with the lower roof this creates more sound and could generate a good atmosphere. 1800 + 4000 seats in jhs will accomodate our support. not ideal perhaps but i kind of always expected the police to say north stand to be used for celtic fans. ptfc statement was clear to put the reasons on visiting fan behaviour and was i thought a reasonably worded statement on the whole. but based on comments here i appear to be in the minority on that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billko Posted June 19, 2013 Report Share Posted June 19, 2013 The fact Thistle are giving up a section of the ground the home fans (singing section) use is a joke really. Give them the bing and instead of gnomes you can have leprechauns Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted June 19, 2013 Report Share Posted June 19, 2013 Of course if there was a stand at the city end then this wouldn't be nearly as much of a problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordanhill Jag Posted June 19, 2013 Report Share Posted June 19, 2013 (edited) We took 12,000 to Hampden for the Rangers semi, Around 6,000 to Livingston for the Ramsdens We must have had 6,500 to 7,000 for the Morton game. I'm pretty sure (esp. with a rallying call) we could get over 8,000 Jags fans for this one. First time back in the top league for a while always gets a boost as well. At the Cup replay against Rangers we had about 5500 ,Ramsdens Cup first Cup Game in 40 Years 5300 ,Lift the Trophy 5300 - we had a lot of neutrals against Morton Home support just over 6000 - so a realistic top end figure is 6000 - honestly cant see us getting anymore than that. Its a problem that our Fan Base has fallen over the Years - getting over 5000 is a big achievement and a lot of effort - don't forget that for half the games last Season and despite one of our most exciting teams in decades we got just over 2300 in the home support with an average 650 of that being kids. Edited June 19, 2013 by Jordanhill Jag Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted June 19, 2013 Report Share Posted June 19, 2013 If there's anything positive that might come out of PTFC's capitulation over firebombing away supporters, it's that from the main camera position in the JH stand the main stand, if it was given over to the north stand Jags fans, would show all those Thistle flags draped over the wall at the front of the stand...... Or would that be banned as well? If so, then surely wearing clothes would also need to be banned? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted June 19, 2013 Report Share Posted June 19, 2013 (edited) Wee bit more publicity about this http://www.scotsman....-move-1-2970921 Crackin' photo at least edited to add this from Record http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/celtic-fans-banned-firhills-wooden-1963959? Edited June 19, 2013 by lady-isobel-barnett Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted June 19, 2013 Report Share Posted June 19, 2013 I'm now looking forward to watching us tank that mob from the main stand. There's still the question of whether the Aitken Suite will be open for fans before the game. I very much doubt it, unless it's restricted to season ticket holders (as we are the best fans). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fawlty Towers Posted June 19, 2013 Report Share Posted June 19, 2013 At the Cup replay against Rangers we had about 5500 ,Ramsdens Cup first Cup Game in 40 Years 5300 ,Lift the Trophy 5300 - we had a lot of neutrals against Morton Home support just over 6000 - so a realistic top end figure is 6000 - honestly cant see us getting anymore than that. Its a problem that our Fan Base has fallen over the Years - getting over 5000 is a big achievement and a lot of effort - don't forget that for half the games last Season and despite one of our most exciting teams in decades we got just over 2300 in the home support with an average 650 of that being kids. Market it as "Firhill Flares Day" with the Thistle fan who has the best pair of flares (see the subtle play on words there) winning hospitality at a home game. That was just a quick, off the top of my head suggestion but I am sure the team which brought us "Wear Your Colours With Pride", "Glasgow's Big Game", "Come Home To Firhill", etc could come up with something that would result in a good attendance and allow us to make our point at the same time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted June 19, 2013 Report Share Posted June 19, 2013 Market it as "Firhill Flares Day" with the Thistle fan who has the best pair of flares (see the subtle play on words there) winning hospitality at a home game. That was just a quick, off the top of my head suggestion but I am sure the team which brought us "Wear Your Colours With Pride", "Glasgow's Big Game", "Come Home To Firhill", etc could come up with something that would result in a good attendance and allow us to make our point at the same time. I remember one day many moons ago I was wearing a rather snazzy pair of flares at school. The old headmaster was a bit confused, and said he disapproved of my fl...... fl...... flamboyancies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Jukebox Rebel Posted June 20, 2013 Report Share Posted June 20, 2013 This thread feels like a bomb went off and we're all standing about with our hands in our pockets, ruefully surveying the damage done. You'd think we were bloody Norwegian or something. BAN THE TIMS! BRING A MATE - 8K GATE! Like the Morton game, such a scenario and stance, it would also attract the neutral in substantial numbers too (especially if cellic had no tickets), and imagine this - a Firhill, bouncing and rocking with stands full of red and yellow and a vociferous home support, playing against the green arse cheek - maximising our home advantage, and potentially seeing our kids humble their megastars, and proving that Thistle are, indeed, the greatest team the world has ever seen. http://www.ipetition...he-north-stand/ At the time of writing 660 care enough to sign this petition... keep signing... Jim Alexander has stated on here that he'd be 100% up for it if he thought we could do the numbers. He fears we could only pull 6,000 Thistle fans for this game against Celtic. I personally think he's underestimating big time. For talking sake if the 6,000 were the best we could do, 1 in 3 bringing a mate would get us to 8,000. The first Thistle V Celtic derby game in 9 years? With this issue connected to it? We could have a field day here as per yoda's suggestion. Frhill could be bouncing in red and yellow. NORTH STAND FLARES DAY! What a laugh. Get yer Dougie Bellbottoms on. There's PR angles galore. We could do 8,000 and more - easy. I wish the board would give this some serious consideration... Mon' the Jags Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagsfan1963 Posted June 20, 2013 Report Share Posted June 20, 2013 This thread feels like a bomb went off and we're all standing about with our hands in our pockets, ruefully surveying the damage done. You'd think we were bloody Norwegian or something. BAN THE TIMS! BRING A MATE - 8K GATE! http://www.ipetition...he-north-stand/ At the time of writing 660 care enough to sign this petition... keep signing... Jim Alexander has stated on here that he'd be 100% up for it if he thought we could do the numbers. He fears we could only pull 6,000 Thistle fans for this game against Celtic. I personally think he's underestimating big time. For talking sake if the 6,000 were the best we could do, 1 in 3 bringing a mate would get us to 8,000. The first Thistle V Celtic derby game in 9 years? With this issue connected to it? We could have a field day here as per yoda's suggestion. Frhill could be bouncing in red and yellow. NORTH STAND FLARES DAY! What a laugh. Get yer Dougie Bellbottoms on. There's PR angles galore. We could do 8,000 and more - easy. I wish the board would give this some serious consideration... Mon' the Jags I've bought a season ticket this year for the first time in many years - I'd happily bring a pal and pay him in! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackpool Jags Posted June 20, 2013 Report Share Posted June 20, 2013 No to arsonists, criminal damagers, hooligans and bigots being allowed into our stadium. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Jukebox Rebel Posted June 21, 2013 Report Share Posted June 21, 2013 Eureka! Natural segregation could be observed under the following arrangement: 2,500 to 3,000 Celtic fans restricted to the North end of the Jackie with alternative exit strategies for Thistle fans in the North Stand. North Stand Exit Strategy Plan A Thistle fans wait behind for 1 minute at the final whistle whilst the pitch is cleared of players and officials. They then proceed to exit in a safe and orderly procession along the touchline of the main stand, turning left at the City End, walking along behind the goals, finally exiting at the big grey steel gates where they naturally flow with their own on the traditional exit slope away from the JHS. North Stand Exit Strategy Plan B Thistle fans wait behind for 20 minutes or so. Not ideal but a sacrifice that would be preferable to the proposed arrangement. With both strategies (Plan A being most preferable) coffers are full, coppers are cool, North Stand Rool. Where there's a will there's a way on this one... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted June 21, 2013 Report Share Posted June 21, 2013 Why should it be Thistle fans who have to wait in order to leave their home ground? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Jukebox Rebel Posted June 21, 2013 Report Share Posted June 21, 2013 They shouldn't have to jag, I agree. It may be that last resort tactic that we have to budge the hitherto intransigent controlling forces. Besides, Plan A's 1 minute doesn't seem too bad. Celebrations would take 10 minutes naturally anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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