kni Posted August 22, 2014 Report Share Posted August 22, 2014 (edited) I'm glad I'm not the only one who was caught out, I thought we'd signed a youngster on loan from Everton. Seems he played as a trialist for Birmingham earlier in the summer, but less chance of him getting a contract with an English club as Tamworth would have been due a fee. Birmingham hand trial to Tamworth defender He was also on trial at Southend United but was not offered a deal. Tamworth may be entitled to compensation if they did not release him. The FIFA compensation rules state "20 Training Compensation Training compensation shall be paid to a player’s training club(s): (1) when a player signs his first contract as a professional, and (2) each time a professional is transferred until the end of the season of his 23rd birthday. The obligation to pay training compensation arises whether the transfer takes place during or at the end of the player’s contract." The story that you linked made Tamworth's position clear. "The 23 year-old has not trained at all with Tamworth this summer despite the club re-engaging the terms of his contract and manager Dave Belford is insisting that the player will not leave unless the club is given compensation due to Richards-Everton being under the age of 24. "...That said, the message for Birmingham City or anyone is that Ben won’t be leaving the club until he is 24, unless we receive a transfer fee or it goes to a tribunal. “We have done everything we can as a club to help Ben over the last 18 months. We have invested a lot of time and effort in developing Ben as a player and we deserve some reward. The fee we have set is miniscule in my opinion.” The club stated that he signed on a free transfer so Tamworth may be sending a claim for compensation to Firhill. Edited August 22, 2014 by kni Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pie Of The Month Posted August 22, 2014 Report Share Posted August 22, 2014 He was also on trial at Southend United but was not offered a deal. Tamworth may be entitled to compensation if they did not release him. The FIFA compensation rules state "20 Training Compensation Training compensation shall be paid to a player’s training club(s): (1) when a player signs his first contract as a professional, and (2) each time a professional is transferred until the end of the season of his 23rd birthday. The obligation to pay training compensation arises whether the transfer takes place during or at the end of the player’s contract." There is a loophole regarding some cross-border transfers. Motherwell exploited it in the past with Chris Porter and Chris Humphrey. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kni Posted August 22, 2014 Report Share Posted August 22, 2014 There is a loophole regarding some cross-border transfers. Motherwell exploited it in the past with Chris Porter and Chris Humphrey. Do you know what the loophole is? The rules seem very clear. ATS delayed signing for Wigan Athletic until the official start of the new season to avoid compensation being payable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunfermline Jag Posted August 22, 2014 Report Share Posted August 22, 2014 Not so much a loophole as different timescales, I think. I don't know the English rules but in Scotland, in order to qualify for training compensation a club has to offer the player a new contract before 15th May or, if the competition they are in concludes later, within 4 working days of that ending, whichever comes later. However, in order to qualify under FIFA rules, which would govern a cross border transfer like this, the offer of a new contract must be made at least 60 days before the old contract ends. It may be that Tamworth didn't offer a new contract soon enough to qualify for FIFA compensation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Legend Blows Posted August 22, 2014 Report Share Posted August 22, 2014 All very nice but can we have a left back please Archie? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted August 23, 2014 Report Share Posted August 23, 2014 All very nice but can we have a left back please Archie? Regardless of what position needs filling signing Richards-Everton was a matter of utmost priority. Then again maybe I'm alone when I argue we'd just lost a player with a double barrel name Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lindau Posted August 23, 2014 Report Share Posted August 23, 2014 (edited) The few Airdrie and even Pars fans that have posted on P&B appear to have been impressed with our new centre half!! We started well and could have been a couple of goals up if not for good goalkeeping and poor finishing. As soon as Dunfermline scored they were in control. We couldn't cope with Ugwu's physical presence, though Richards-Everton looks like he'll do ok. To be fair Richards-Everton was Airdrie's best player at the back. If it wasn't for him we would have scored more. Edited by GordieBoy80, Today, 19:31. Edited August 23, 2014 by Lindau Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angry gaz Posted August 23, 2014 Report Share Posted August 23, 2014 (edited) How long is his loan for? It just seems quite bizarre we're signing players at this stage that are not ready to go straight into the team given our squad . Good to hear he played well though, can we bring him back any time? Edited August 23, 2014 by angry gaz 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lindau Posted August 23, 2014 Report Share Posted August 23, 2014 (edited) How long is his loan for? It just seems quite bizarre we're not signing players at this stage that are not ready to go straight into the team given our squad . Good to hear he played well though, can we bring him back any time? It gets more bizarre by the minute. Dangerous Dan injured, McMillan injured, Piccolo freed. We bring in a guy on a one year contract, with experience in English football, who apparently was wanted by Birmingham City and is just approaching his 23rd birthday, yet we immediately loan him out to Airdrie for 5 months. Something ain't right there I am afraid. If he ain't ready to play 1st team football at our level at 23 he shouldn't have been signed! Edited August 23, 2014 by Lindau 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davie Thistle Posted August 23, 2014 Report Share Posted August 23, 2014 (edited) ..............this is turning intae a friggin nitemare! Faith? Wit the fug diz that mean!! Believe?? well, I'm still tryin!!! Edited August 23, 2014 by Davie Thistle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lindau Posted August 23, 2014 Report Share Posted August 23, 2014 I have plenty of faith DT but I would like someone from the club to explain why BRE has been immediately loaned out when we are patently short of numbers at the back. We didn't loan Piccolo out last year despite him having no experience of UK football yet bring in a guy that has plenty of experience and is certainly not a youngster, yet we immediately loan him out to Airdrie. Can't fathom it out I am afraid. Think Aero and Conrad showed last season that they would struggle playing together at this level and that was proved again today. If Danny was injured I would have thrown Richards-Everton straight in today. If Archie thinks he has a future at Firhill, but needs a bit of toughening up in our lower leagues (at 23!!) why did we only give him a years contract with at least 5 months of that being spent at Airdrie? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted August 23, 2014 Report Share Posted August 23, 2014 Assuming he wasn't out on loan I can't understand why anyone would think Archie would've even have contemplated starting Richards-Everton today. Either playing Lindsay or moving Keenan inside would've been a more likely option. Whatever you think of Muirhead and Balatoni I don't believe we had a better option available today. Perhaps we're bigging up English football too much if you think that an untried lad from Tamworth should walk into the team ahead of what we had available today. The lad, and I'm only judging him on 45 mins of a friendly, looked like he needs a spell out on loan to come up to speed. The fact he's relatively old to need a loan spell may well be down to the level he's been playing at. Archie made no secret that Richards-Everton was signed for potential. Myself, I don't think that talking about a centreback who'e 22 year old as having raw potential is the least bit strange. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted August 24, 2014 Report Share Posted August 24, 2014 Assuming he wasn't out on loan I can't understand why anyone would think Archie would've even have contemplated starting Richards-Everton today. Either playing Lindsay or moving Keenan inside would've been a more likely option. Whatever you think of Muirhead and Balatoni I don't believe we had a better option available today. Perhaps we're bigging up English football too much if you think that an untried lad from Tamworth should walk into the team ahead of what we had available today. The lad, and I'm only judging him on 45 mins of a friendly, looked like he needs a spell out on loan to come up to speed. The fact he's relatively old to need a loan spell may well be down to the level he's been playing at. Archie made no secret that Richards-Everton was signed for potential. Myself, I don't think that talking about a centreback who'e 22 year old as having raw potential is the least bit strange. All this tells you is that Archie is not addressing our key weakness our defence Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lindau Posted August 24, 2014 Report Share Posted August 24, 2014 Assuming he wasn't out on loan I can't understand why anyone would think Archie would've even have contemplated starting Richards-Everton today. Either playing Lindsay or moving Keenan inside would've been a more likely option. Whatever you think of Muirhead and Balatoni I don't believe we had a better option available today. Perhaps we're bigging up English football too much if you think that an untried lad from Tamworth should walk into the team ahead of what we had available today. The lad, and I'm only judging him on 45 mins of a friendly, looked like he needs a spell out on loan to come up to speed. The fact he's relatively old to need a loan spell may well be down to the level he's been playing at. Archie made no secret that Richards-Everton was signed for potential. Myself, I don't think that talking about a centreback who'e 22 year old as having raw potential is the least bit strange. We usually sing from the same sheet M'Lady, but we will agree to disagree on this one. If Archie says he was signed for potential (at nearly 23!!) why have we only given him a one year contract. If he really hits it off with Airdrie, come January, he will be able to sign a pre contract with someone else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norgethistle Posted August 24, 2014 Report Share Posted August 24, 2014 We usually sing from the same sheet M'Lady, but we will agree to disagree on this one. If Archie says he was signed for potential (at nearly 23!!) why have we only given him a one year contract. If he really hits it off with Airdrie, come January, he will be able to sign a pre contract with someone else. This. I can understand bringing "One for the future" in on a 2 or 3 year deal and farming them out for 1st 5 months, but on a 1 year deal and send them out the door straight away for half their contract seems truelly bizarre, as Lindau states he can sign a pre contract 1st January with anyone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Arch Posted August 24, 2014 Report Share Posted August 24, 2014 When was the last time any of our players were signed on a pre contract in January? It really doesn't happen regularly at all. Archie would have been criticised if we'd given him a two year deal as well. Can't win Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norgethistle Posted August 24, 2014 Report Share Posted August 24, 2014 When was the last time any of our players were signed on a pre contract in January? It really doesn't happen regularly at all. Archie would have been criticised if we'd given him a two year deal as well. Can't win Did Erskine & Paton not sign straight after Macnamarra left in February Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lindau Posted August 24, 2014 Report Share Posted August 24, 2014 (edited) When was the last time any of our players were signed on a pre contract in January? It really doesn't happen regularly at all. Afraid that isn't the point, all that was pointed out is that it could happen. We are struggling in central defence. For some strange reason the club hasn't told us why Danny wasn't playing yesterday, or if he is gonna be out for a long time. Piccolo freed and the assumption was Richards-Everton had been brought in to replace him. We give him a one year contract and immediately ship him out to Airdrie for half the season. If you think that's normal, fair enough. Fact is, that doesn't happen regularly at all!! Edited August 24, 2014 by Lindau Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lindau Posted August 24, 2014 Report Share Posted August 24, 2014 Did Erskine & Paton not sign straight after Macnamarra left in February Good point, think they signed their pre contracts in March after Jackie left Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norgethistle Posted August 24, 2014 Report Share Posted August 24, 2014 Good point, think they signed their pre contracts in March after Jackie left If this guy is semi decent, and after playing with Airdrie for 5 months, would they not chance their arm with him in January?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lindau Posted August 24, 2014 Report Share Posted August 24, 2014 If this guy is semi decent, and after playing with Airdrie for 5 months, would they not chance their arm with him in January?? He seemed to have a decent debut yesterday by all accounts, so yeah he will be up for grabs, like any other player in the last year of his contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
La Scimmia Rossa Posted August 24, 2014 Report Share Posted August 24, 2014 (edited) Really? You want a Archie to tell you why a player is injured? Before the game? Get a grip. Seabourne had an injury. Could it be he failed a fitness test on Saturday? Could it be that Muirhead would have started anyway? Could it be that Archie is already on record as saying that the number 20 trialist v Sunderland showed nice touches but was raw(paraphrasing). Maybe he's taking a punt on a boy that will be costing us next to nothing on the off chance he turns out to be decent? If he turns out to be rotten he's gone in may? Doesn't this demonstrate he has learned re Piccolo, Baird etc? Piccolo was a non starter as a player this season. It's been explained why. Little to do with the club and mostly down to the player. Edited August 24, 2014 by La Scimmia Rossa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney Rubble Posted August 24, 2014 Report Share Posted August 24, 2014 Really? You want a Archie to tell you why a player is injured? Before the game? Get a grip. Seabourne had an injury. Could it be he failed a fitness test on Saturday? Could it be that Muirhead would have started anyway? Could it be that Archie is already on record as saying that the number 20 trialist v Sunderland showed nice touches but was raw(paraphrasing). Maybe he's taking a punt on a boy that will be costing us next to nothing on the off chance he turns out to be decent? If he turns out to be rotten he's gone in may? Doesn't this demonstrate he has learned re Piccolo, Baird etc? Piccolo was a non starter as a player this season. It's been explained why. Little to do with the club and mostly down to the player. Quality rant Colin. But Muirhead is not a a better centre-back than Gabby at our current level. So please elaborate on what basis would Gabby have been a non-starter as a player this season? Also, and not directed at you, there's an assumption that Airborne was injured yesterday. Is it possible that he may have been ill? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lindau Posted August 24, 2014 Report Share Posted August 24, 2014 (edited) Really? You want a Archie to tell you why a player is injured? Before the game? Get a grip. Seabourne had an injury. Could it be he failed a fitness test on Saturday? Could it be that Muirhead would have started anyway? Could it be that Archie is already on record as saying that the number 20 trialist v Sunderland showed nice touches but was raw(paraphrasing). Maybe he's taking a punt on a boy that will be costing us next to nothing on the off chance he turns out to be decent? If he turns out to be rotten he's gone in may? As you haven't put a quote on this not sure who you are referring to, but at no point have I personally said that Archie should have said anything before the game, however why not after the game, especially given the defensive shambles at the end of the game? Would have been an ideal time to come out and say " we really missed Dan at the back today" and give the reason for his absence. But we still don't know officially why he wasn't playing Re Richards-Everton, sick to death saying the guy is 23 in October. He should be ready to play for us or at the very least be a squad player at that age. He is in trouble if he isn't ready to play SPFL football at that age. He is around the same age and in quite a few instances, a fair bit older than several players in our usual current 18 man squad Edited August 24, 2014 by Lindau Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cup Posted August 24, 2014 Report Share Posted August 24, 2014 I doubt a spell at Airdrie would allow a decent judgement on whether or not he is good enough for the top flight. I'm sure Muirhead would be excellent at that level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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