Sticking With A Manager And Bucking The Trend

[Barney Rubble]

My long term thinking is that I want to support a team that is competitive at the top level of Scottish football.

 

Why can't we be like Fake Thistle, St Johnstone, Kilmarnock and St Mirren who have been competitive at the top level for a number of years AND won a trophy? What's wrong with having that ambition? What's unrealistic about it?

 

I'm sick to death of being fed that we should be happy to accept mediocrity because we have no money.

 

That argument lost its taste a long time ago. Given what Archie achieved in keeping us up last year, PTFC's claims of ambition no longer stand up to scrutiny.

 

It's no longer acceptable - if this club wants customers to believe the vision and that hype, then it needs to be serious about properly preparing financially to be competitive.

[jags on tour]

I was surprised that we stuck with the same formation with Welsh,Osman and Bannigan in the midfield, one of them needed dropped, not Stevenson (as poor as he was last week). This is going to be a long season, one where we will probably finish with the lowest points tally and probably lowest goal tally ever in this division. Is someone else coming in going to change that? I dunno, I've accepted we're going down already and Archie has obviously won the 1st division before, plus we seem to have a few decent boys coming through the youth ranks, we may aswell stick it out and go for it in the Championship next year.

[Barney Rubble]

I was surprised that we stuck with the same formation with Welsh,Osman and Bannigan in the midfield, one of them needed dropped, not Stevenson (as poor as he was last week). This is going to be a long season, one where we will probably finish with the lowest points tally and probably lowest goal tally ever in this division. Is someone else coming in going to change that? I dunno, I've accepted we're going down already and Archie has obviously won the 1st division before, plus we seem to have a few decent boys coming through the youth ranks, we may aswell stick it out and go for it in the Championship next year.

 

If we go down we are going down for a long time, believe me.

[topcat]

If we go down we are going down for a long time, believe me.

If we go down we are going down for a long time, believe me.

 

The thing is Barney you make that sound like the end of the world and for me over the last 30+ years that is just business as usual. The club have ambition I am sure but they are up against the SPL and all that crap.

 

We have endured 10000 seater stadium requests, been chucked out of the league because really they fancied ICT more.

 

I would rather just have a manager who if you cut him in half has Thistle down the middle rather than the merrygo ride of the same old

[Norgethistle]

Stick with the manager give him the chance to pull it together we owe him that for taking us up and keeping us up (twice)

 

To quote Shankley "If you can't support the team when we draw or lose then don't support us when we're winning"

[Barney Rubble]

The thing is Barney you make that sound like the end of the world and for me over the last 30+ years that is just business as usual. The club have ambition I am sure but they are up against the SPL and all that crap.

 

We have endured 10000 seater stadium requests, been chucked out of the league because really they fancied ICT more.

 

I would rather just have a manager who if you cut him in half has Thistle down the middle rather than the merrygo ride of the same old

 

It's been business as usual for me for the last 50 years man, and the last couple of relegations have affected the club more deeply than those in the 70s and 80s, believe me.

 

And apart from Davie McParland, and Archie when have Thistle ever had a manager that is Jags through and through?

[topcat]

So I think you agree maybe just in part.

 

Time to just stick with our own and weather the storm.

[topcat]

Signing out from here in Dubai. Be interesting to see how this pans out in tomorrow.

 

Mona Thistle

[milhouse]

 

 

It's been business as usual for me for the last 50 years man, and the last couple of relegations have affected the club more deeply than those in the 70s and 80s, believe me.

 

And apart from Davie McParland, and Archie when have Thistle ever had a manager that is Jags through and through?

 

Sentimental nonsense. The only people who are "Jags through and through" are the fans who pay to go every week.

[Liamconnollyglasgow]

I really don't think it works playing welsh with bannigan and osman. If pogbas not fit id give nisbet a start next week doolans best with a link up player behind him don't feel he's getting the support he needs at the moment not that it's his fault

[Big Col]

It's been obvious all season that the sole striker isn't working. Neither is the 6 man defence or the 3 man midfield.

 

We can all see it - the management team can't. They seem incapable of changing things. No bite, no cutting edge. Lowest scoring team in UK. Bottom of the table. No wins in any competitive game. Wasting scarce resources on dud players.

 

I've lost all confidence in them - it's time for a change.

[Bleeding Gums Murphy]

 

And apart from Davie McParland, and Archie when have Thistle ever had a manager that is Jags through and through?

 

McParland I'll give to.a large extent but Archibald?

 

If Thompson Jnr was to phone tomorrow (as if) & offer him the DU job do you think he would do anything different than he did when he was a player & McCall/Thompson snr came a calling?

[Fearchar]

Today showed that adding another striker (making a whole 2 against 4 defenders and a goalkeeper!) brought much more bite to attacking movements, and held the ball in the opposition half long enough to take the pressure off our defence. The alternative is hoping that when the ball is sent forward, the single striker will be able to hold it up and not be robbed of possession, sparking off another attack from the opposition. Still Archie continues to sacrifice Doolan's (or any other lone striker's) effectiveness by expecting miracles from him.

 

Today our team had 57% of the possession but 1 in 3 of the goals. Against Ross County the team had 62% but failed to score, while Ross County capitalised on a low level of possession and won. Against Kilmarnock the team had 59% of the possession and could still only manage a draw.

 

Can Archie overcome his reluctance to adjust the team, and start to make forward play count, or will he continue to insist on playing the "right" way, even in the face of the results? If he rejects what the results are telling him, then relegation looms (or his jotters for him).

 

It's not looking good, since the expectation is that hope will succeed: “We’ll have to go back to basics this week....hopefully the win is the next record to go." Presumably that hope is to be paired with faith in tactics that aren't working and charity from the opposition.

[Barney Rubble]

McParland I'll give to.a large extent but Archibald?

 

If Thompson Jnr was to phone tomorrow (as if) & offer him the DU job do you think he would do anything different than he did when he was a player & McCall/Thompson snr came a calling?

 

No I don't.

 

He would probably be offered double his current salary to do so. Would you blame him?

 

That's the way of the world in this century.

[Bleeding Gums Murphy]

 

 

No I don't.

 

He would probably be offered double his current salary to do so. Would you blame him?

 

That's the way of the world in this century.

 

Absolutely.

 

No such thing as loyalty anymore whether it be a player/manager/managing director/office staff.

 

A football club is a business & if in business an employee was costing that business money with constant bad decision making, then what happens?

 

I did say a few weeks ago I'd give him til international break, even did last week, but after that today I think he should go now or the BoD put him on gardening leave.

[AndyMac]

If we were getting tanked each week, there would be a case for showing any manager the door. However we are only getting beat by the odd goal. Infact we have shipped the same amount of goals as third placed Hearts.

 

I don't think it will be pretty, but I do trust that Archie will turn it round. We need a lucky break.

[Metz]

 

 

McParland I'll give to.a large extent but Archibald?

 

If Thompson Jnr was to phone tomorrow (as if) & offer him the DU job do you think he would do anything different than he did when he was a player & McCall/Thompson snr came a calling?

And do you think that if he was stupid enough to read the dross written on here that he would think it was a support worth hanging around for?

[La Scimmia Rossa]

This is the part where i ask "who do want to replace him?" then one of two things happen 1. Posters get upset for having to think about alternatives. 2. Danny Lennon, Ian McCall and maybe Jimmy Calderwood get mentioned.

 

Have some balls. Don't be like all thise other fickle ****wits around Scotland. Stick with the manager.

[javeajag]

This is the part where i ask "who do want to replace him?" then one of two things happen 1. Posters get upset for having to think about alternatives. 2. Danny Lennon, Ian McCall and maybe Jimmy Calderwood get mentioned.

 

Have some balls. Don't be like all thise other fickle ****wits around Scotland. Stick with the manager.

 

There is always a new manager for every club....no point in speculating imo

The question at the moment is whether Archie can turn it round and his long he should be given to do that

[Bleeding Gums Murphy]

This is the part where i ask "who do want to replace him?" then one of two things happen 1. Posters get upset for having to think about alternatives. 2. Danny Lennon, Ian McCall and maybe Jimmy Calderwood get mentioned.

 

Have some balls. Don't be like all thise other fickle ****wits around Scotland. Stick with the manager.

 

Im no fan of BoD (far from it) but when the manager is bringing in one player to replace another in same position within 6 weeks because the first player isn't the type of player required to play system he wants then you can't say he's not been supported. Even the signing of Edwards & Whiteside this week.

 

Quality or quantity again?

 

We all know the system he's going to play before turning up on Saturday & if we know then surely opposition know also. We're too predictable.

 

The DU fans have been complaining about the same thing under McNamara. He's gone because of that despite having better results than us over past few seasons.

 

I know there were other issues such as his contract but ultimately results cost him his job.

 

Welsh,Bannigan & Osman together doesn't work but he persists with it. Changes usually occur reactively (when we're behind or the usual 67th minute change of one striker for another).

 

Crowds are dwindling. Hospitality is not being sold. The football we were playing has been replaced with playing in front of the opposition.

 

Cup runs non existent. Transfer dealings on the whole have been poor- the Taylor episode last Summer & more so the Summer before, no replacement for Sinclair despite him saying the year before he was off. We had numerical trialists in that Summer also but ended up going with McMillan - a good defender but again not the player for the system he persists in playing.

 

As for his replacement. Advertise it, see who applies. I'm sure there would be plenty interest. Lomas & Pressley have both been mentioned previously. Jeez, why not go for Rudi Vata considering he's getting us most of our players these days.

 

We stick with the manager & we're down. 87 points to play for or not, 3 goals by October playing a system that's predictable to the opposition.

 

Couple of occasions yesterday (again) that Doolan has done well in a wide position to get a ball in the box only to find that no one in there.

 

Like I said, predictable.

 

& as I said previously, financially we can't afford to buck the trend. He's costing us money in transfers, no cup run money being brought in, ST sales down, hospitality half full.

 

Why? Are the supporters the vociferous minority rather than the silent majority (many it seems are voting with their feet).

 

Personally I'd say go now but give him one more game. No win vs DU then it's definitely time to go.

 

If he was doing well & someone came along with a better offer then no doubt about it, he'd be off. (& why not?) but when he's doing badly we've to buck the trend? Not for me.

Edited September 27, 2015 by Bleeding Gums Murphy

[La Scimmia Rossa]

 

 

There is always a new manager for every club....no point in speculating imo

The question at the moment is whether Archie can turn it round and his long he should be given to do that

 

He should be given to the end of the season. If football fans demand loyalty( McNamara, Higgy, Conrad, Erskine, Paton). They should show loyalty, especially to someone like Archie. He's proven he can turn it around twice before when the Forum F#nnies wanted him sacked.

 

So who is this new manager? If you are going to rip up the best part of four years work, i think we deserve some thought through suggestions. So let's hear it? I'll start you off. Calderwood, Williamson, Alan Johnson, Gary Teale, Ian McCall, Danny Lennon? No? Jim Duffy? Stuart McCall? No? So lets have some names? Or is it the usual clueless ****wittery that litters this place?

Edited September 27, 2015 by La Scimmia Rossa

[potty trained]

 

 

Im no fan of BoD (far from it) but when the manager is bringing in one player to replace another in same position within 6 weeks because the first player isn't the type of player required to play system he wants then you can't say he's not been supported. Even the signing of Edwards & Whiteside this week.

 

Quality or quantity again?

 

We all know the system he's going to play before turning up on Saturday & if we know then surely opposition know also. We're too predictable.

 

The DU fans have been complaining about the same thing under McNamara. He's gone because of that despite having better results than us over past few seasons.

 

I know there were other issues such as his contract but ultimately results cost him his job.

 

Welsh,Bannigan & Osman together doesn't work but he persists with it. Changes usually occur reactively (when we're behind or the usual 67th minute change of one striker for another).

 

Crowds are dwindling. Hospitality is not being sold. The football we were playing has been replaced with playing in front of the opposition.

 

Cup runs non existent. Transfer dealings on the whole have been poor- the Taylor episode last Summer & more so the Summer before, no replacement for Sinclair despite him saying the year before he was off. We had numerical trialists in that Summer also but ended up going with McMillan - a good defender but again not the player for the system he persists in playing.

 

As for his replacement. Advertise it, see who applies. I'm sure there would be plenty interest. Lomas & Pressley have both been mentioned previously. Jeez, why not go for Rudi Vata considering he's getting us most of our players these days.

 

We stick with the manager & we're down. 87 points to play for or not, 3 goals by October playing a system that's predictable to the opposition.

 

Couple of occasions yesterday (again) that Doolan has done well in a wide position to get a ball in the box only to find that no one in there.

 

Like I said, predictable.

 

& as I said previously, financially we can't afford to buck the trend. He's costing us money in transfers, no cup run money being brought in, ST sales down, hospitality half full.

 

Why? Are the supporters the vociferous minority rather than the silent majority (many it seems are voting with their feet).

 

Personally I'd say go now but give him one more game. No win vs DU then it's definitely time to go.

 

If he was doing well & someone came along with a better offer then no doubt about it, he'd be off. (& why not?) but when he's doing badly we've to buck the trend? Not for me.

 

Some really good points BGM. Some valid stuff.

 

However, when you beef your post up with nonsense, it detracts from the validity of your post as a whole.

[Big Col]

It's the mutual respect that everyone shows that makes this forum what it is.

[La Scimmia Rossa]

It's the mutual respect that everyone shows that makes this forum what it is.

 

Mutual respect? Respect someone who wants a person sacked from their job less than a quarter into a season? Without having suggested a suitable replacement or even hinted who that might be?

 

Hypocrites that would want to apply completely different rules to the them in the workplace?

 

It's simple. Give the guy until the end of the season or until he decides he can't turn it around. Back him. If it doesn't work out, at least you'll feel like you gave him a chance. That you are different to the baying morons that litter Scottish football.

Edited September 27, 2015 by La Scimmia Rossa

[Big Col]

So if someone's opinion doesn't match yours, that opinion is wrong is it? How arrogant.

 

You want the current manager to stay, I don't. It's a differing opinion.

 

And as I've said before, you don't know who will apply for the job when (if) there's a vacancy.