PaleGreySky Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 It seems there's a lot of debate on Firhill again. The merits of staying and dealing with what we've got, relative to moving to a purpose built ground, seem to change frequently. I thought it seemed like a good time to recap and see exactly what the consensus is right now. I have definitely changed my mind in the last wee while. I'm now for selling up Firhill as a whole, and moving out of town to the north to a new stadium something along the lines of Falkirk, Hamilton or St Mirren. I think a smaller number of seats, spread round the ground, would be good. Enough for us to be able to grow if we have a better spell, but not so much that the ground is less than half full all the time. I think we'd need around 5000-5500 seats. That way, the ground will seem full on slightly bigger, yet still run of the mill, games like Morton home (3,400 odd this season). It would also be able to benefit us should we get a good cup draw. A cup game against most SPL sides would see a sell out, and therefore probably a good atmosphere. We wouldn't have to be turning people away very often. Also, should we have a poor spell and play to only 2000 for a few years, we wouldn't have wasted money on massive stands. Only the club will know the costs of this. I'd like to think the Firhill land is worth a decent amount, and that a new build stadium would be covered by this. I don't mind letting Firhill go now, as it's not the same anymore and the benefits of moving seem to outweigh the negatives. Thoughts please? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 The "out of town" part worries me. It's got to be easily reached through public transport. Firhill is easy to get to from the city centre, even on foot. Is yon bit of land across the canal still available? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven H Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 Sadly I doubt the remainder of Firhill that belongs to the Club would be worth anywhere near enough to build a new stadium...even if someone wanted to buy it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uberteeb Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 Depends entirely on where it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twinny Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 I'm also for moving, I just feel Firhill is becoming a burden. I voted for over 7000 but I wouldn't want far above that. I'd want 6,000 seated to fit the silly SPL criteria, with two terraced ends - like a more balanced version of Firhill before the North Stand was built. As said above, I'd be worried about an out of city location, but where is there in the city that is available? Who would buy Firhill for that matter? As Steven H says, we wouldn't be able to generate the funds to build a new stadium. That moderately sized Pirelli Stadium I linked to in the other thread (six or seven thousand cpacity, only two thousand seated) cost 6.5 million to build. Our crappy North Stand cost more than a million didn't it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lindau Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 I have said for the last few years that we should move however in tonights Times it looks as if the board is looking at installing an all weather pitch to generate money to compensate for The Warriors moving. If thats the case, we aint going nowhere!! http://www.eveningtimes.co.uk/sport/beattie-is-backing-a-change-to-drinks-law-1.1138833 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lennythistle Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 I mentioned last weekend, I had a very good and indeed interesting chat with David Beattie on Saturday. Now moving didn't get brought up during the conversation but the loss of revenue brought about by the Warriors leaving did. As he's mentioned before this is a serious issue for the club and one where a number of options are being looked at. Did anyone watch the sky sports special report on Monday about teams playing on astro turf? Well the Firhill complex has recently had a new one installed and by all accounts it's a very good surface. This is an option being considered for Firhill itself. It would cost a lot of money to install but it could in the longer term generate additional funds for the club. The type of pitches being installed now are far superior to the ones in the 80's and 90's. It just might be worth a try. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChewinGumMacaroonBaaaz Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 The arguement for moving appears to be that Firhill is in a poor condition, costly to maintain, has no atmosphere and is too big. Why do we need to move to tackle these issues? The propco deal has been done to attract what investment we can in order to develope Firhill. One might assume that this is partly due to the situation being that relocation has been investigated and is financially unviable. Most other Scottish clubs who have moved to new stadiums have done so on the back of lucritve deals from the sale of thier old grounds which have arisen from their location being suitable to commercial developments such as supermarkets or retail parks : St. Johnstone - Asda ( with the added bonus of the land for the new stadium being donated by local farmer Bruce McDairmid!), St Mirren - Tesco ( cash and new stadium built buck shee, i presume as a sweetner to the coulcil to gain planning permission for their proposed hyper market on the old love street land) Hamilton - Sainsbury's, Falkirk - Morrisons ( falkirk had to share with Stenny for a season and are now only tennants in their new home), Aidrie - Safeway ( they proceeded to share with the other gypos for about 4 years, moved into their shiny new hom then about 4 years after that went tits up! ) Stirling Albion rented Annfield from the council for 20 odd years and were made to play on artificial turf long before 5g pitches appeared, before the local authority kindly built forthbank. The huge new Tesco 10 minutes stroll from Queens Cross would suggest we are unlikely to attract such a wealthy company to buy Firhill. I see potential in the propco deal to gain income for the club and its joint investors. I disagree almost entirely with the current development plans. Why demolish a main stand with hospitality accomodation, office facilities, changing rooms and over 2000 seats, that must have past safety regulations when the north stand was built, when clearly it is the JHS that is at least twice the size that we require? If the club can make additional income from devlopement of the ground it already owns and is currently, for large periods of the year, redundent, Then hopefully that money will be used to improve facilities elswhere in the stadium. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChewinGumMacaroonBaaaz Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 And so what if the old stand is partly wooden... Isn't Motherwell's, Dunfermline's, Heart's, Kilmarnock's, Aberdeen's Raith's, Quenn of the south's, Dundee's, Morton's... I could be wrong on some of them, I know, however the point is it is still useable ( Celtic pre-season ) and improvements could be made in the future as and when income improves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChewinGumMacaroonBaaaz Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 I have said for the last few years that we should move however in tonights Times it looks as if the board is looking at installing an all weather pitch to generate money to compensate for The Warriors moving. If thats the case, we aint going nowhere!! http://www.eveningtimes.co.uk/sport/beattie-is-backing-a-change-to-drinks-law-1.1138833 I haven't read the article but surly artificial turf is a no brainer. I'm all for grass, but we simply can't afford it's upkeep. I've gotten used to the turf at firhill being a little on the long side at the start of the season, made excuses about rugby being played when visiting fans slag it off when it turns into a tattie field late season, but the truth is it's never been great at Firhill. It was a sand pit in the eighties, we spent fortunes on drainage and undersoil heating in the nineties and it's still hardly worth the effort. You gotta feel for the groundsman. I guess the fact we got the baisin hanging over us doesn't help matters. I visited Old Trafford and Eastlands last year... the surface these guys play on is like a f***in billiard table. Took my breath away. What's the point in even trying to get a decent playing surface when it's such a science to get right that on our budget we are never going to succeed. It might be expensive this new fangled astro turf but all reports are good. It might just be our best investment to date.... we could even invite Elton John along to play a gig for the opening!... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChewinGumMacaroonBaaaz Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 (edited) ... Dumbarton - Sold Boghead to Strathclyde Homes in a deal which saw the old site used for housing developement and the new sponsors contribute to the cost of the new stadium. looks like it has been a mutually beneficial arrangement. ... Livingston/Ferranti Thistle/Meadowbank w***,w***,*ank! - Do I need to point out the flaws with this shower of .... ahem... "Partick Thistle Football Club" That's MY team. Relocation and rebranding would just be too much for any self respecting Jag, surely? East Fife - Seems to have worked out for them. But for us to do the same would mean all ticket just about every week. Bayview Stadium - capacity 2000 all seated. Plans to erect a covered standing terrace were shelved in 2009 due to cost. Edited December 8, 2011 by ChewinGumMacaroonBaaaz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Incognito Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 I voted to stay at Firhill and that is where I firmly believe we should remain. However, if we were to move then I think it is vital for the soul of the club that we remain in the north west Glasgow area. The thought of moving out of town appals me. The much mooted 'bit of land over the other side of the canal' would be an acceptable location, in a c.6,000 capacity stadium (I doubt we would get more people through the gates even if we were promoted to the SPL). Better yet, a return to Partick itself. There is a big plot of land near the river that is currently lying empty and is quite close to Partick train station. However, given its location it is likely to be quite an expensive bit of land to purchase, plus vacating the Firhill area would leave the whole of north Glasgow without a team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Third Lanark Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 I vote to stay but there keeps coming up an error message everytime so my vote doesnt appear to be registered I recall there was a guy a couple of years back who said we should move to a new town like East Kilbride (not to sure if he was at the wind up or not) but for me a move out of Glasgow kills part of the club. Partick Thistle are a Glasgow team and if played in say East Kilbride, Cumbernauld, East Renfrewshire etc etc to me that would be a part of the club killed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagfox Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 Asda have been looking to move out of Summerston for years. Not sure if they would be interested. Still leaves a problem of where we go? If we got a 5g pitch would we look for a tenant or co-owner, Maryhill juniors or something? I feel at the moment we have no way to afford a move, so we just need to maximise what we have. I would look at ticket pricing. £15 and concessions should include unemployed. MAybe a tenner a game? Season ticket prices should be frozen to allow for the games with special offer prices. Maybe a free or reduced guet ticket for cup game? According to budget figures we are just about breaking even. However the playing squad budget is unsustainable if we lose £200k due to the Warriors leaving imo. Is there no way to find some common ground with them? Their fans enjoy Firhill for the matchday experience. I can't see car parking being the reason they have chosen to leave. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cup Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 Go, Firhill is an oversized dump. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duntocher jag Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 I voted to go sadly, think firhill is becoming to big for us, we get average crowds of 2500 and have a staduim of over 10,000. I have just started a blogsite and my latest blog was on this subject as well. go to http://firhillshedboy.blogspot.com/ and have a wee read, feedback is welcome good or bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaleGreySky Posted December 8, 2011 Author Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 I would look at ticket pricing. £15 and concessions should include unemployed. MAybe a tenner a game? Season ticket prices should be frozen to allow for the games with special offer prices. Maybe a free or reduced guet ticket for cup game? How does this save us money? That costs the club money unless crowds increase, which they probably wouldnt with such small changes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joejag Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 I voted to go sadly, think firhill is becoming to big for us, we get average crowds of 2500 and have a staduim of over 10,000. I have just started a blogsite and my latest blog was on this subject as well. go to http://firhillshedboy.blogspot.com/ and have a wee read, feedback is welcome good or bad. Agree, Looked at your blogsite. Not bad!!! I love your panoramic picture of Firhill!!! Happy Days!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicofan Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 Firhill holds a lot of special memories for me and I;m sure for the majority of our remaining support, However nostalgia aside....i don't know weather to laugh or cry when i walk up to firhill these days....its a fckn eyesore not one bit of it makes me smile anymore. This might sound harsh but i feel firhill has become an embarassment. I would personally love to see us move to a nice new fit for purpose stadium which is accessible but in reality this aint gonna happen...its saddens me to watch the once great Firhill rotting away Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChewinGumMacaroonBaaaz Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 Asda have been looking to move out of Summerston for years. Not sure if they would be interested. Still leaves a problem of where we go? Asda bought the danish supermarket chain Netto UK in 2010 for £778m. They have spent a year rebranding those stores. They are currently trying to compete with the trend for smaller stores like Tesco Express and Sainsbury's Local. An major investment in a large store project would appear unlikely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mediocre Pundit Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 I've thought for a while now, if I won the lottery I would build a stand identical to the North Stand on the bing and - just like that - we would have one of the best stadiums in Scotland. Over time I'd rebuild the main stand to be a smaller stand, holding hospitality and the family area, with better office space. Eventually, should a suitable canal regenration plan be mooted, we could look at reducing the size of the JH. But even with a 12,000 seater stadium and 3,000 fans, a completed stadium with options to sit in at least three of the sides would bring the atmosphere back. All it needs is someone with a spare couple of million quid... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChewinGumMacaroonBaaaz Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 Firhill holds a lot of special memories for me and I;m sure for the majority of our remaining support, However nostalgia aside....i don't know weather to laugh or cry when i walk up to firhill these days....its a fckn eyesore not one bit of it makes me smile anymore. This might sound harsh but i feel firhill has become an embarassment. I would personally love to see us move to a nice new fit for purpose stadium which is accessible but in reality this aint gonna happen...its saddens me to watch the once great Firhill rotting away Doubting whether it's "worth it" is part in parcel of being a Jag. It's got eff all to do with the ground. I don't recall too many Jags fans gleefully striding up Firhill road on a wet and windy night to watch Brechin or Forfar or East Fife or Albion Rovers or other no away fans teams even when the shed was still there. The stadium is gettin it just now but if we were top of the league we wouldn't give a f*** if we had to watch the games with a Lidl's polly bag to keep the rain aff our heids, stand on the bing cause the JHS was condemmed and pee yersel just to keep yer legs warm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChewinGumMacaroonBaaaz Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 Eventually, should a suitable canal regenration plan be mooted, we could look at reducing the size of the JH. Ay? The JHS is TOO big now and will probably be too big for 90odd% of our games in the next ten to twenty years. The old stand has 2000 useable seats. How about putting the home fans in it for a season while The JHS is reduced to a manageable size, the extra space released being used for sales, letting or improved hospitality? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mediocre Pundit Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 Ay? The JHS is TOO big now and will probably be too big for 90odd% of our games in the next ten to twenty years. The old stand has 2000 useable seats. How about putting the home fans in it for a season while The JHS is reduced to a manageable size, the extra space released being used for sales, letting or improved hospitality? Because the JH isn't a problem right now when compared to a grassy hill or an out-of-date, expensive-to-steward main stand. I agree it's too big, but of the four sides of our ground it would be my third priority. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted December 8, 2011 Report Share Posted December 8, 2011 Ay? The JHS is TOO big now and will probably be too big for 90odd% of our games in the next ten to twenty years. The old stand has 2000 useable seats. How about putting the home fans in it for a season while The JHS is reduced to a manageable size, the extra space released being used for sales, letting or improved hospitality? Pie in the sky, I'm afraid. How exactly do you reduce the JH stand (which is actually one of the most impressive stands in any ground in Scotland)? Presumably you mean lop off the top half? Imagine the engineering and construction work that would involve, including lowering the ground outside, so that everything could be knocked down and re-built, including the road outside. The amount of land freed up by doing that would be tiny, and useless for developers. The cost of the whole thing would probably be more than building an entire stadium somewhere else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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