Mediocre Pundit Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 The Rangers (for the money) or Ayr (for Marko) please. Pleased. Hope they bring a decent away support (despite it being midweek) and should be a decent game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ancipital Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 Ayr united, whose fans were moved out of morton 's wooden stand because they couldn't be trusted not to bring fireworks? Interesting... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twinny Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 Obviously we knew we were in the draw, but it is pretty daft that we're in this round and Dundee aren't. The Daily Record seem genuinely shocked to learn that we're in the draw at this stage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 Like that goalie that let in 4 at Hampden last season? Scary. We'll maybe get away with a second string in R1 that'd be as far as I'd go. I would like to think we can win the League Cup and would like our team selections to reflect that. Well worth another wee gander at that experimental starting eleven at Hampden, How many of them are likely to play a part in the game v Dundee Utd? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norgethistle Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 Ayr united, whose fans were moved out of morton 's wooden stand because they couldn't be trusted not to bring fireworks? Interesting... Eh?... Never heard this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoda-jag Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 (edited) Ayr united, whose fans were moved out of morton 's wooden stand because they couldn't be trusted not to bring fireworks? Interesting... If true, must mean they are Cuntic fans without a bus fare. Happy with home v ayr, be good to give The Hoor a warm welcome, and send his team home out the cup on the back of a high goal scoring doing. (cue, lose 1-0 to a scrappy easily preventable goal in either first or last few minutes, and our players performing as if they had never met one another before or ever been introduced to a football) Edited July 12, 2013 by yoda-jag Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ancipital Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 (edited) Eh?... Never heard this Last time Ayr were in the same league as us (2011/12). They have or had one of these "ultra" groups who have previous for *****ing about with flares at away games, so they weren't allowed in the main stand at Cappielow & instead got half of Morton's cowshed. I haven't heard of them having to be moved anywhere since or even if they're still doing this but thought it would be an interesting point to raise re: earlier statements from the club. edit: better topic (if such a thing exists) from GMFC forum http://www.greenockm...showtopic=37588 Edited July 12, 2013 by Ancipital Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mediocre Pundit Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 They'll fit in the away section of the JH. The Main Stand will be closed for this game. No issues, nothing to see here... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ancipital Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 They'll fit in the away section of the JH. The Main Stand will be closed for this game. No issues, nothing to see here... but I thought the Police had told us we weren't allowed to have the away fans in that bit as it's dangerous because we're on both sides of them ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mediocre Pundit Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 but I thought the Police had told us we weren't allowed to have the away fans in that bit as it's dangerous because we're on both sides of them ;-) I think we can assume its only Celtic (and probably Sevco) fans that would be overly intimidated by that. Lambs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Jukebox Rebel Posted July 13, 2013 Author Report Share Posted July 13, 2013 Obviously we knew we were in the draw, but it is pretty daft that we're in this round and Dundee aren't. The Daily Record seem genuinely shocked to learn that we're in the draw at this stage. What the Daily Record say: "there was one very noticeable anomaly with newly-promoted Premier League side Partick Thistle in the draw, while First Division Dundee, relegated from the SPL last season, were not." Translation: "Chief Cockwomble and his merry band of fudpots continue to demonstrate their uncanny, and seemingly endless, knack for hapless ineptitude" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Jukebox Rebel Posted July 13, 2013 Author Report Share Posted July 13, 2013 Well worth another wee gander at that experimental starting eleven at Hampden, How many of them are likely to play a part in the game v Dundee Utd? Only Scully and McGuigan were fringe players in that 11, to be fair it does seem that we were set out to win. Re over 20s and competitive game time I think it's down to the manager to judge squad rotation, always a tricky matter. In my opinion though, a League Cup game is every bit as important, if not even more important, than an SPL game. At least we could conceivably WIN the League Cup. And surely that is the point? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Incognito Posted July 14, 2013 Report Share Posted July 14, 2013 It is a pity we didn't get Ayr Utd away. Call me strange, but I love Somerset Park. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H Wragg Posted July 16, 2013 Report Share Posted July 16, 2013 What the Daily Record say: "there was one very noticeable anomaly with newly-promoted Premier League side Partick Thistle in the draw, while First Division Dundee, relegated from the SPL last season, were not." Translation: "Chief Cockwomble and his merry band of fudpots continue to demonstrate their uncanny, and seemingly endless, knack for hapless ineptitude" So, why is this happening? Is the entry stage based purely on last season's final league positions, completely disregarding the fact that when this season starts we'll be in the league above Dundee? Amateur hour indeed if this is the case! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottymagoo Posted July 16, 2013 Report Share Posted July 16, 2013 An extra game equals extra money so they've did us a favour with their daft rules this time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Jukebox Rebel Posted July 16, 2013 Author Report Share Posted July 16, 2013 H, Yes all clubs are ranked 1-42 based on last years League finish. Nothing wrong with that per say, but when the logic defeats the purpose an exception clause is required. In this instance it would be to reverse positions 12 and 13 (Dundee and Thistle). However, this season that shouldn't even have been necessary. As I said previously, the current format is designed for 5 teams in Europe coming in to R3 and this season we only have 4. All they had to do was sit down with arithmetic and logic to rejig the format. I set out this season's solution in post 59. In England, no matter what, Premier League clubs enter at Round 2 and European QF's enter at Round 3. They look at the format each season on its merit, depending on how many have qualified for Europe. They then adjust things with arithmetic and logic in regards to number of ties and byes. It seems our lot are just too lazy to do that. At least I presume it's laziness. Surely it can't be stupidity? Ahem... I notice there's no sponsor for this season's tournament... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted July 16, 2013 Report Share Posted July 16, 2013 (edited) Only Scully and McGuigan were fringe players in that 11, to be fair it does seem that we were set out to win. Re over 20s and competitive game time I think it's down to the manager to judge squad rotation, always a tricky matter. In my opinion though, a League Cup game is every bit as important, if not even more important, than an SPL game. At least we could conceivably WIN the League Cup. And surely that is the point? My point really was that the team put out was at the time still thought to be a good bit 2nd string. Balatoni & Muirhead were in no way seen as our best centreback pairing (either one of them alongside Archie). Shug Murray gave way to Bannigan, who was the preferred left back at the time to Sinclair. Elliot & Craigen, players that would come good later in the season were most definitely fringe players. My only criticism of the team put out at Hampden was putting a near rookie keeper behind a largely untested centreback pairing. The goalie as always gets the general blame but in truth more errors came from Scully's defenders than himself. Putting that aside I would expect and understand if we play fringe players against Ayr, a game sandwiched between Dundee Utd and Hearts (perhaps a match as meaningful as we thought the Pars game last August would be). I know it comes across as Billy Big Boots when you play a "weakened" side against lower league opposition but I feel it's a gamble you're better to take. Edited July 16, 2013 by lady-isobel-barnett Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jags365 Posted July 16, 2013 Report Share Posted July 16, 2013 Ahem... I notice there's no sponsor for this season's tournament... Don't worry, I'm sure Neil Doncaster has it covered! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bunny Posted July 16, 2013 Report Share Posted July 16, 2013 I know it comes across as Billy Big Boots when you play a "weakened" side against lower league opposition but I feel it's a gamble you're better to take. If we are to run with a squad to survive in the SPL it should have enough depth to allow us to play a few guys not in the usual 1st eleven without weakening us too much for a game against a lower division team. Although saying that, as the LC game comes quite early it may be worth playing close to what we hope is our best team - they may need an extra game or two to 'gel' together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Jukebox Rebel Posted July 16, 2013 Author Report Share Posted July 16, 2013 My point really was that the team put out was at the time still thought to be a good bit 2nd string. Balatoni & Muirhead were in no way seen as our best centreback pairing (either one of them alongside Archie). Shug Murray gave way to Bannigan, who was the preferred left back at the time to Sinclair. Elliot & Craigen, players that would come good later in the season were most definitely fringe players. My only criticism of the team put out at Hampden was putting a near rookie keeper behind a largely untested centreback pairing. The goalie as always gets the general blame but in truth more errors came from Scully's defenders than himself. Putting that aside I would expect and understand if we play fringe players against Ayr, a game sandwiched between Dundee Utd and Hearts (perhaps a match as meaningful as we thought the Pars game last August would be). I know it comes across as Billy Big Boots when you play a "weakened" side against lower league opposition but I feel it's a gamble you're better to take. I think it's a case of "each game on it's merits". We might get away with it at home to Ayr, but I'd think that'd be as far as it goes in the League Cup for the likes of ourselves. Your typical R2 fixture is "Hamilton away". R3 we are unseeded and would certainly face SPL opposition (barring 5 "giant" killings in R2). In these cases, we'd really need to be at full strength. That is, if we have ambition to succeed. St.Mirren are my League Cup role models... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H Wragg Posted July 16, 2013 Report Share Posted July 16, 2013 If we field a weakened team to any club in the League Cup and go out as a result I'd be pissed off. We are never going to win the top flight title and any qualification for the Europa League is likely to mean one qualifying tie against a club hardly anyone's heard of, so winning the League Cup or Scottish Cup should be the height of our realistic ambitions. I would honestly take a League Cup or Scottish Cup victory and relegation the same season over no silverware and another relegation fight the following year. Perhaps an old school outlook in the days when folk go on about an extra league place meaning x more pounds in prize money or clubs celebrating finishing 4th in the EPL like they've actually won the league. For a club of our stature it should be silverware first. Even a major cup final would be a start. Read the list of all those who have been there since we were last, and weep. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garscube Road End Posted July 16, 2013 Report Share Posted July 16, 2013 I would take SPL survival before any of the cups. The league is our bread and butter and we can only keep progressing financially through the greater riches of the SPL, and hence on the field. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H Wragg Posted July 16, 2013 Report Share Posted July 16, 2013 I see what you're saying but this season will be the 4th spell I've seen us in the top flight. I want to tick off at least a major cup final appearance before I snuff it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougie T Posted July 16, 2013 Report Share Posted July 16, 2013 I would take winning the League Cup or Scottish Cup over staying up in Premier League, would love to see us win a major trophy. Having said that, if we managed to stay in Premier and build the club through a long term top flight presence that may help towards us eventually winning a cup. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Jukebox Rebel Posted July 18, 2013 Author Report Share Posted July 18, 2013 I would take SPL survival before any of the cups. The league is our bread and butter and we can only keep progressing financially through the greater riches of the SPL, and hence on the field. Consider these facts Garscube: * We have succesfully maintained top flight status in 73 out of 80 attempts (1 of the failed attempts being an "artificial" relegation due to reconstruction). * We have won the Scottish Cup once in 121 attempts. * We have won the League Cup once in 67 attempts. Who looks back to a season and thinks "oh, do you remember that glorious season in 2003 when we finished 10th". I think it would be fair to say we've been there, done that and will continue to do that regularly for the decades to come. Where's the thrill, where's the joy? Compare that with how the hearts and minds of Thistle fans react when they think back to 1971... It's about time we were prioritising these national trophies as the main goal in our charter. Raith Rovers won the League Cup in the 1990s. Livingston, Kilmarnock and St.Mirren have all won it in the last decade. I can see no reason why we can't do it. A few good wins is all it takes. And I don't need to remind you that our sole League Cup success to date came just a few months after our exciting new young team had just won promotion... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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