Bleeding Gums Murphy Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 Or to expect a guy who's playing in a new country with new team mates, who hasn't had a pre season, to click with the team after 4 games. Who are we talking about here? I haven't criticised any player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
potty trained Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 (edited) I didn't say you had criticised any player... We've now brought in an attacking full back to replace SOD... So... If (& already said big IF) it doesn't click in next 3 games against teams that you would think are around us, then something else has to change. Edited September 13, 2015 by potty trained Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Gums Murphy Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 Ahhh, good old selective quoting but I still don't see a criticism or a player/players. What was the context of that whole post? If I didn't make it clear, I'll explain it again. Archibald's inability to change/play any system other than the one we've used over past few seasons. The same thing his master being criticised for at DU. Teams have sussed us & when plan A not working we don't have a plan B. Example yesterday when Hartley brought on the boy down their left probably to attempt to stop Dumbaya getting forward as much as he was. Then he puts on a second striker taking off a midfielder. Meanwhile, we use our subs & system stays same. Come on, be honest. When Dundee scored yesterday, you weren't confident that we'd get something from it? You don't expect to go down with a whimper again though. So... Which of my expectations were to high? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stillresigned Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 @STVSport: Paul Hartley confesses Dundee were 'lucky' to win at Partick Thistle http://t.co/T8FD3IDYkL Amazing how many teams are lucky against us! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cup Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 As soon as we get detached by 3 points Archie has to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
potty trained Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 Ahhh, good old selective quoting but I still don't see a criticism or a player/players. What was the context of that whole post? If I didn't make it clear, I'll explain it again. Archibald's inability to change/play any system other than the one we've used over past few seasons. The same thing his master being criticised for at DU. Teams have sussed us & when plan A not working we don't have a plan B. Example yesterday when Hartley brought on the boy down their left probably to attempt to stop Dumbaya getting forward as much as he was. Then he puts on a second striker taking off a midfielder. Meanwhile, we use our subs & system stays same. Come on, be honest. When Dundee scored yesterday, you weren't confident that we'd get something from it? You don't expect to go down with a whimper again though. So... Which of my expectations were to high? The bits I quoted was relevant and in context with each other. I removed the stuff irrelevant to my point. Again for clarity, at no point did I say you criticised a player. However, I think it's unfair to expect him to have clicked within a handful of games. But, if he hasn't it's the managers fault. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stillresigned Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 You wouldn't have to be a footballing or tactical genius to forecast that we were likely to struggle this season. Unfortunately, due to personal mishap I Was unable to make it along yesterday. Nonetheless, in the brief interludes between Chick Dung's orgasms over Sevco's brilliance on the radio yesterday I was able to discern the all too familiar pattern taking shape! What can we as supporters do about it, aside from taking the huff and not going very little directly I'm afraid.Should we sack the manager, the BoDs or even the groundsman-see absolutely no point in that. Unfortunately, as followers of PartickThistle all we can do is support the team and hope for the best. Not a particularly optimistic outlook. I grant you, but if there are any miracle workers out there please feel free to step up to the plate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Gums Murphy Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 The bits I quoted was relevant and in context with each other. I removed the stuff irrelevant to my point. Again for clarity, at no point did I say you criticised a player. However, I think it's unfair to expect him to have clicked within a handful of games. But, if he hasn't it's the managers fault. You still haven't said which of my expectations are to high? As for it not being the manager's fault? Whose fault is it then? I actually agree that it's unfair to expect him to click straight away BUT if the manager wants to play the same system where our fullbacks provide width & crosses then why sign Gary Miller? Hes s good solid defensive right back but ask any St Johnstone fan & they'll tell you his game is that, not getting up & down the park all day long. That's not a criticism either by the way. He's a victim of the system the manager persists in wanting to play. So whose fault is it we signed a right back only to decide he's not what's needed a month into the season? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
potty trained Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 You still haven't said which of my expectations are to high? As for it not being the manager's fault? Whose fault is it then? I actually agree that it's unfair to expect him to click straight away BUT if the manager wants to play the same system where our fullbacks provide width & crosses then why sign Gary Miller? Hes s good solid defensive right back but ask any St Johnstone fan & they'll tell you his game is that, not getting up & down the park all day long. That's not a criticism either by the way. He's a victim of the system the manager persists in wanting to play. So whose fault is it we signed a right back only to decide he's not what's needed a month into the season? Maybe he's brought in two right backs who have different attributes, and therefore are more suited to different games. Thus allowing him to have a plan B? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Gums Murphy Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 Maybe he's brought in two right backs who have different attributes, and therefore are more suited to different games. Thus allowing him to have a plan B? Do you honestly believe that? Our plan B will revolve around a defensive right back? & which of my expectations are to high? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Passenger Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 (edited) F**k me, I'm finding myself in agreement with BGM (on some points, at least). The difference between Hartley and AA was laid bare yesterday. The former's changes appeared tactically shrewd and altered the shape of his side while dulling the effectiveness of ours. AA's substitutions seemes to be the last resort, with players simply slotting into the positions vacated by those they replaced. We needed something other than fresh legs, especially when Dundee scored. We didn't get it. Edited September 13, 2015 by Dark Passenger 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Gums Murphy Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 F**k me, I'm finding myself in agreement with BGM (on some points, at least). The difference between Hartley and AA was laid bare yesterday. The former's changes appeared tactically shrewd and altered the shape of his side while dulling the effectiveness of ours. AA's substitutions seemes to be the last resort, with players simply slotting into the positions vacated by those they replaced. We needed something other than a simple freshing of legs, especially when Dundee scored. We didn't get it. You know what DP? It was the same things I was saying Feb/March. I realise Archibald can still be classed as a relatively inexperienced manager but same could be said for Hartley. I just don't think he's learning. When the opposition have sussed your system, changing one player for another in same position isn't going to have a high percentage of success. He's done tremendously well on a tight budget to keep us in the top league over the past couple of seasons but other teams have sussed us out &, as yet (over 2 & bit seasons in SPL), Archibald has shown an inability to change things. That's why I think the next 3 games are crucial. Nothing changes in terms of results/performances then ultimately we may have to look at changing the manager. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoda-jag Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 F**k me, I'm finding myself in agreement with BGM (on some points, at least). The difference between Hartley and AA was laid bare yesterday. The former's changes appeared tactically shrewd and altered the shape of his side while dulling the effectiveness of ours. AA's substitutions seemes to be the last resort, with players simply slotting into the positions vacated by those they replaced. We needed something other than fresh legs, especially when Dundee scored. We didn't get it. add me to that list dp. scary. i'm also gripped by the suspense pt is creating, by his nifty footwork repeatedly sidestepping bgm's query of which of his expectations are too high. or blatantly ignoring the question with deflection, can't decide which of the two it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim slavin's lunchbox Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 I think BGM makes a some very good points on this thread and for the record I'm also not sure that any of your expectations are too high (I don't think you are going to get an answer from PT). Sadly, when you want to post some constructive criticism on this forum you are tarnished as a troll/ knicker wetter/ some other childish remark. Frankly there are some who are obsessed with it. So thank you for raising legitimate concerns about our team that I'm sure the honest among us would have been thinking for some time now. It is my opinion (and has been since before the season started) that if we continue for the rest of the season with this team in place ( inc management) that we will be playing championship football next season. AA has been doing a really good job with ltd resource and I'm not so sure that anyone else would make a difference but at some point it may be worth considering.......I hear there is a promising young manager currently in Dundee who may become available soon. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 I think it's fair to say all our expectations will be different. Just as fair then to say it's something that's difficult to be objective about. Some of us believe that we were unlucky not to get something out of a game where we hit the woodwork three times. Others believe we don't deserve anything for missing the goal and hitting the woodwork. Kind of a which side are you on situation that's arguable till the cows come home. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Gums Murphy Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 No. I don't think he's going to answer either... I agree m'lady that everyone's expectations different but it was PT who said mine were to high without even knowing what they were. Having said what they were, I'd have thought he'd at least have told me which he thought were to high. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Hosie Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 Only scoring in 1 game and having an average of less than 1 shot a goal per game quickly drains any optimism. The story of Thistle under AA is "unlucky". We must be the unluckiest club in the world. Other teams work on their game. We're happy to blame fantasy and say it'll be better next week. I'll settle for a Thistle manager being as 'unlucky' as Alan Archibald. Unlucky to take us to promotion. Unlucky to keep us in the top flight, on a limited budget, twice. Every job he has asked to do as Thistle manager he has done. Unlucky. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cup Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 I'll settle for a Thistle manager being as 'unlucky' as Alan Archibald. Unlucky to take us to promotion. Unlucky to keep us in the top flight, on a limited budget, twice. Every job he has asked to do as Thistle manager he has done. Unlucky. I wasn't saying he was unlucky. I was saying he's shite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaf Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 We weren't unlucky yesterday. We squandered two great chances, chances you have to take to win football matches. Dundee were lucky because we didn't take the chances we created. That does not automatically mean we were unlucky. Our best corners this season have been bannigan in swingers. Why did we therefore revert to Stevenson passing corners to their keeper (from both sides) and then getting all histrionic by the corner flag whilst the opposition were breaking up the park? We have been unlucky in some games. Yesterday was not one. Hitting the post or bar is not a goal. It's a miss. It's not unlucky. having said all of that I still think we can pick up points in these next three games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Peebles Tackle Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 It's been a tough start to the season, but it is only the start. Archie deserves our support - he's done a tremendous job & had us playing the best football I've seen in my 35 years. He's not perfect, but he really cares and I honestly cannot think of anybody who I'd rather see in the dugout. We're going to 'click' very soon (I hope!) and give someone a real doing. Onwards & upwards! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChewinGumMacaroonBaaaz Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 (edited) Don't accept "excuses", poor run of results means we must think about sacking the manager. .... Where the f**k is your plan b? We've had an unsettled start due to injuries and suspensions, played the top three, and got draws with everyone else except dundee against whom we hit the woodwork... what 3 times? Yes, we need to start scoring goals and winning games. You guys should be on Sportscene with such in depth analyisis. Archie's job is a c**t of a tough gig ... cuntomara walked away at the first opportunity, I don't think any top flight gaffer would want to swap places.... and I doubt if any of the top half "championship" gaffers would jump at the opportunity. So we're looking for an unemployed coach who would probably want more dough to than the guy who's kept us up for 2 seasons? Support the team .... support Archie. I accept he's no immune to criticism absolutely..... but leave out the "bin him" stuff....... it's so f**kin predictable. eta Edited September 13, 2015 by ChewinGumMacaroonBaaaz 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary Peebles Tackle Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 I wasn't saying he was unlucky. I was saying he's shite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Passenger Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 It's a bit more than a 'poor run' CGMB, hence why you have 'moderates' beginning to question what the hell is going on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougie247 Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 (edited) I really think that all AA has done is kept to the blue print that was left for him after JM left.. Now this is his "team" (after loosing so many key parts) its completely fallen apart.. a manager should be evaluating his teams strengths and weakness all the time and then adapting the game to fit our players. he is still trying to use the same system that JM left behind. Square pegs in round holes.. Can anyone point to a tactical initiative that he has made that is his own? apart from having Stevenson as striker Edited September 13, 2015 by dougie247 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fearchar Posted September 13, 2015 Report Share Posted September 13, 2015 How many hard luck stories does it take to reveal a systematic error? For what it's worth, I think that AA has done a great job, but the performances are showing that his thinking is inflexible, to the extent that the players are being told to play with a system that hampers them, instead of adapting or changing the system to take advantage of their abilities. Partick Thistle is not Bayern München, able to go out and buy the best players from the opposition. The option is to change the strategy to suit the players and the tactics to suit the matches. If, instead of acknowledging there's a reason for the consistently poor results, AA continues to insist that the results are all due to "hard luck", then we're headed for the Championship. Seeing inferior teams draw with ours or win against us due to our own inability to absorb the lessons is destroying the pleasure of watching, but I've paid for my season ticket. These consistently unsuccessful games will affect the PATG income. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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