Norgethistle Posted May 5, 2013 Report Share Posted May 5, 2013 For now anyway! Using this argument could lead to to the loss of the home nations special status, which of course is another historical anomaly And if Scotland gets its independence then that would fully close the door on any club leaving, otherwise you could have Milan and PSG playing in Spain cause it suits Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
One t in Scotland Posted May 5, 2013 Report Share Posted May 5, 2013 Ground criteria for the Northern Premier League states: It must be possible for spectators to view the match, either standing or seated, for the full length of at least 3 sides of the playing area. In theory a bit of work at Firhill required even for that level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaphod Beeblebrox Posted May 5, 2013 Report Share Posted May 5, 2013 Ground criteria for the Northern Premier League states: It must be possible for spectators to view the match, either standing or seated, for the full length of at least 3 sides of the playing area. In theory a bit of work at Firhill required even for that level. Eh, the jh stand, main stand & the shed. I make that 3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stillresigned Posted May 5, 2013 Report Share Posted May 5, 2013 I'm not going to get hot under the collar about the prospect of Thistle moving to the English league, besides the myriad emotional and legal objections, quite frankly it is a silly idea and has absolutely no chance of happening. Perhaps, some people are just getting a bit carried away following our title win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peagreenboy Posted May 5, 2013 Report Share Posted May 5, 2013 (edited) for the full length of at least 3 sides Eh, the main stand Have another wee think about it ... Edited May 5, 2013 by peagreenboy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zaphod Beeblebrox Posted May 5, 2013 Report Share Posted May 5, 2013 (edited) Have another wee think about it ... yeah and...... I believe the offices are part of the stand and in that area are the changing rooms! You wanna have another wee think about that. Edited May 5, 2013 by Zaphod Beeblebrox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Collins Out! Posted May 5, 2013 Report Share Posted May 5, 2013 There's some restricted view seats in the main stand that aren't used. But it is still a stand that runs the length of the pitch. All this talk of England is completely preposterous stuff of nonsense anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bunny Posted May 5, 2013 Report Share Posted May 5, 2013 (edited) yeah and...... I believe the offices are part of the stand and in that area are the changing rooms! You wanna have another wee think about that. I think we need to see moves in the transfer market ... lack of news is leading to nonsense in the forum (possibly from me too sometimes). Come on Archie let's have some team-building news to get us really going here. Edit: ZB I don't know why I quoted you there, just more nonsense from me I suppose. Edited May 5, 2013 by Mr Bunny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrD Posted May 5, 2013 Report Share Posted May 5, 2013 (edited) Not really for joining the English leagues but if they changed the set up and we stayed in the second tier then am all for it. Reckon we could get to the conference north in no time. Might be slightly tougher after that. Where would our place be tho, think we would struggling in league one area as there are a lot decent size clubs there. Money even at that level tho would be ridiculous. Probably offer more money to players than most spl teams and potential greater interest and sponsorship in the club. Doubt it will happen but one can dream of getting Man U at firhill in the fa cup would be awesome. Judging by crowd sizes at existing level to projected level on other threads for what wed be getting in SPL (4500) we'd be in the same bracket as middle level League 1. And as rightly noted as the only glasgow club (scotland club if we were to do it first), we'd probably be in a good position to attract sponsorship to grow ourselves quite nicely as a set up. Bearing in mind also that in the current cultral climate ' the great glasgow alternative' is not partick thistle for those who don't want to go towards the old firm, its x premiership club and it has been that way for a good 15 years plus. If we were to go down to england we could again fill that category in the growing market for those who want football but dont want old firm pish... Still Resigned .... Yes, its a bit 'blue sky thinking' but is it really worthy of the word 'silly' in comparison to what normally gets posited as 'possible ideas for change' in the scottish football set up? That is the usual variations of 50/50 split gates; 16/14/18/nth team top divisions/ change of structure of football governance/more media coverage of non-old firm clubs (never minding the fact that its interest in old firm that drives paper sales and so on)/colt teams/no colt teams/pyramid leagues/ and so on and so on and so on..... Now regarding the proposition of one club, namely us making an application to join the English set up, there are a number of 'ifs' to be overcome to get there but it is one set of ifs in a singular process facing a singular entity (namely our club) Lets look at the myriad of scottish situations. Firstly, we have to disentangle which propostion we are moving towards. Then we have to get collective agreement between different agents that may have differing agendas - so lets look at this more closely at what that would entail: 42 clubs (excluding juniour, highland, east of scotland league obviously) (with differing amounts of clout), 42 sets of fans, different bodies of governance; different methods of voting systems to get assent between bodies; sponsorship interests, media interests - i think you get the picture. We are at an impasse, there is a general agreement that scottish football has some problems to overcome, but such variation of ideas and incommensurable interests a corresponding lack of agreement on a programme of action, means that this impasse aint going to get anywhere close to being resolved. Ever. And as one small club in that set of variables we have very little power in determining our future in such a situation, it is probably no exagerration to say that we have next to zero power when it comes to altering the general conditions that would suit a small club like us in the shadow of the old firm hegemony. In conclusion then, scottish choice = an infinititude of possible choices to be decided upon by an infinitiude of conflicting interests. English choice = one choice with some legal barriers for one club. Now if people think as they are entitled to do so that they kinda like our wee twee provincial set up, with our national team that will probably never get into the finals of the world cup or eurpean cup again (and even in our glory days never got past round 1 of the world cup) then thats fine. But at least be honest that it is romanticism that is guiding such a judgement, because as has been set up above, one cannot say that reason stands in the side of sticking to the status quo. As for romanticisim, i much prefer the roy of the rovers scenario, you know where the wee small team can with a bit of graft and forward thinking grow itself into winning the FA cup - or in this present day context getting into the preimership, europe, or being more realisitic having that FA cup fixture against liverpool due to a fluky draw. Give me that any day over an attachment to an outmoded football set up that only exists to keep the old firm going. Edited May 5, 2013 by mrD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrD Posted May 5, 2013 Report Share Posted May 5, 2013 (edited) Interesting proposition i.e. joining English pyramid. We have competed in the EFA cup ourselves I'm sure. There are 6 Welsh clubs in the English system. Swansea, c*rd*ff, Newporty County, Wrexham, Colwyn Bay and another that escapes my mind at the moment. However below the Conference nearly every team is part-time. Crowds are pretty poor and even getting to the EFL means a land of milk and honey. Aldershot AFC have gone to the wall again recently and many teams play in crowds lower than at Firhill such as Morecombe and Fleetwood. Obviously being from a large city with a decent catchment area we may fair better but I doubt it will happen unless there is a complete collapse of the league system up here. I'm happy making a bit of cash out of the SPL for now. We are growing again as a club, whereas Sevco Scotland are dying again, whilst Celtic are reaping the benefits of CL money. Both are struggling to keep existing fans for league and domestic cup competitions so as businesses I can see why they may consider moving, although I will doubt it will happen anytime soon. nearly every team in the first division is about to go part time so yeah that pretty much means that the first division is going to be commensurate with the divisions below the conference. Crowds in the conference itself seems a bit healthier, average attendance at the moment stands at 1,922, with luton town at the top having an average crowd of 5,914 and the next four or five down having crowds akin to the top teams of DIV 1/ bottom teams of SPL. http://espnfc.com/st...lish-conference But yeah, there is no denying that there would be financial barriers to consider following the even more difficult legal barriers. But, that could probably get offset with our own fanbase, being attractive to media coverage and sponsorship as Glasgows sole representative in the FA that could generate cash flow. Its been done by AFC wimbledon, so there are definately models of practice for us to investigate. Edited May 5, 2013 by mrD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twinny Posted May 5, 2013 Report Share Posted May 5, 2013 There's an interesting thread on P&B just now, with somebody suggesting that all the SFL clubs need to do is agree that none of them will accept promotion to the SPL. The idea is that without any threat of relegation and promotion from and to the SPL it would soon die a death, even if they invited the defunctos back. It would cease to be even less of a true competition than it is in its current form. So, in fact the SFL clubs, if they had the balls and a bit of negotiating nous, could have the SPL eating out of their hands. Nonsense. The SPL would remain no more or no less credible than it is currently in those circumstances. Why would any decent SFL1 club agree to playing meaningless games season after season. yeah and...... I believe the offices are part of the stand and in that area are the changing rooms! You wanna have another wee think about that. It must be possible for spectators to view the match, either standing or seated, for the full length of at least 3 sides of the playing area. I wasn't aware that fans could be admitted to the office area. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrD Posted May 5, 2013 Report Share Posted May 5, 2013 i doubt our stadium would be one of the barriers getting into that level. and if it was minor modifications could be made to do that which wouldnt cost much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted May 5, 2013 Report Share Posted May 5, 2013 Ground criteria for the Northern Premier League states: It must be possible for spectators to view the match, either standing or seated, for the full length of at least 3 sides of the playing area. Wow, three sides, that's a bit strict. You only need two faces for the SPL, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted May 6, 2013 Report Share Posted May 6, 2013 Nonsense. The SPL would remain no more or no less credible than it is currently in those circumstances. Why would any decent SFL1 club agree to playing meaningless games season after season. That's the whole point. Apart from the top one or two clubs trying to get into Europe, every other team in the SPL would also be playing meaningless games season after season, as it would be a dead league. Who would support that, and who would sponsor it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twinny Posted May 6, 2013 Report Share Posted May 6, 2013 That's the whole point. Apart from the top one or two clubs trying to get into Europe, every other team in the SPL would also be playing meaningless games season after season, as it would be a dead league. Who would support that, and who would sponsor it? It wouldn't really be any different to this season, would it? We knew Dundee were going to go down all season long, and even though there was a wee bit of hope for them recently we knew it was inevitable. At the moment, sponsorship comes down to Celtic, TV companies and potential sponsors won't be interested in a relegation race. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted May 6, 2013 Report Share Posted May 6, 2013 It wouldn't really be any different to this season, would it? We knew Dundee were going to go down all season long, and even though there was a wee bit of hope for them recently we knew it was inevitable. At the moment, sponsorship comes down to Celtic, TV companies and potential sponsors won't be interested in a relegation race. That's right to a large extent. But SPL with no prospect of relegation ever, from the very start of the season, would soon see much of the interest by other teams' supporters disappear. They can't get into Europe, there's nothing, absolutely nothing to play for. I'm not at all sure that TV would be willing to sponsor such a non-competition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redandyellowallover Posted May 7, 2013 Report Share Posted May 7, 2013 Just announced that there will be 1 league body, redistrubution of wealth, and playoffs as of next season with a 12-10-10-10 format Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peagreenboy Posted May 7, 2013 Report Share Posted May 7, 2013 Just announced that there will be 1 league body, redistrubution of wealth, and playoffs as of next season with a 12-10-10-10 format Where? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twinny Posted May 7, 2013 Report Share Posted May 7, 2013 Just announced that there will be 1 league body, redistrubution of wealth, and playoffs as of next season with a 12-10-10-10 format Fantastic for now. That was probably the best we were going to get out of the current 'conversation'. No split created with SFL1 clubs leaving to join the SPL in an SPL2, but everyone under one body. If the new distribution of finances looks the same as was mooted months ago, this is great progress. No stupid 8-4 split playoffs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagsman411971 Posted May 7, 2013 Report Share Posted May 7, 2013 sky sports news Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twinny Posted May 7, 2013 Report Share Posted May 7, 2013 (edited) Where? On BBC Sportsday. Just updated to say: The new proposals for Scottish football will be put before a vote of the SPLclubs later this month. The proposal suggests maintaining the 12-10-10-10 divisional structure, an all-through distribution model involving substantial redistribution to the second tier and play-offs involving team 11 in the SPL and teams two, three and four in the division below So not as great as the initial announcement sounds, but as this has been thought of as the last chance for any change this season it could go through. Edited May 7, 2013 by twinny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagsman411971 Posted May 7, 2013 Report Share Posted May 7, 2013 Story here; http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22438732 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted May 7, 2013 Report Share Posted May 7, 2013 (edited) So, one play-off between 2nd bottom of the SPL and 2nd top of Div. 1, and that's it? Err, that's exactly what we had back in 95-96, when we got relegated and Dundee Utd went up. And then what happened? They immediately got rid of the play-offs after they'd got rid of us. If they're really looking to increase the interest in the bottom half of the table there should be 2-up 2-down, and a play-off between 3rd bottom and 3rd top. ETA: I've just seen that 2nd-4th teams in Div. 1 will get into the play-off mini-tournament. Not great for a team that finishes 2nd way out in front of 3rd and 4th, but who might find themselves hit by injuries and suspensions at the end of the season. Edited May 7, 2013 by Jaggernaut Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cup Posted May 7, 2013 Author Report Share Posted May 7, 2013 A decent proposal. Much better than the 8-8-8 shite. Although more chance of Thistle being relegated with the playoffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagsman411971 Posted May 7, 2013 Report Share Posted May 7, 2013 At least if we do go back down, we will have much more money to spend. Relegated teams are having to cut their costs by at least 50% if they want to stay solvent (if they want to). If these proposals go through it would make it a lot easier to balance the books. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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