Nice Little Earner?

[Lenziejag]

And neither can you assume that the majority of ST holders are opposed to moving for these games. In any case it is the non season ticket holders that we need to turn up for the games. I have said many times - if we won some of these games, more supporters would turn up for the next one.

[jaggy]

Hate moving out the JH but at the moment we have no choice with only approx 2000 of our own support turning up. Crap view in the NS, crap facilities in CW, plus listening to 90 minutes of ridiculous bigotry from both arse cheeks. Note to other Jags fans, none are better than the other!

 

However, it's better to get some money, and avoid the nonsense that went on in the JH the night Sellick won the league a couple years ago. At least on a Friday a few away 'supporters' in the NS that were rumbled got thrown out. If the club move us from the JH, then they must make sure the NS and CW are zero tolerance for away fans and have them ejected

Edited August 14, 2017 by jaggy

[Lambies Lost Doo]

I really don't care about moving from the JHS to Main Stand.

 

We don't have enough fans to fill the JHS. That is not the boards fault. We do not turn out in enough numbers,

 

The club needs the money.

[allyo]

 

What is under the wooden floor in the main stand? I'm guessing concrete,

 

I'm guessing that's not a particularly good guess

[lady-isobel-barnett]

I really don't care about moving from the JHS to Main Stand.

 

Neither do I. Like you I see the bigger picture. But my point being having to move three/four times isn't helpful when it comes to ST sales and renewals. Obviously we can argue that extra turnover helps us put a stronger side together and should, in theory at least, increase home attendance. However most ST holders buy a season ticket with a designated seat. To be unable to use that seat between 16-21% of the time is, to put it mildly, not a great selling tool.

I believe there's mileage in selling a variety of ST packages, such as add ons like hospitality packages, various discounts etc. Properly marketed a ST package sans ugly sister games could be attractive. It doesn't necessarily need to be a cheaper option if mixed with some sort of add ons to compensate.

[Lambies Lost Doo]

I rarely sit in my season ticket seat. I sit all over the JHS. There are no "prime spots" as the seats are too small for any real comfort. It's all the same.

 

Having a non-OF season ticket is just surrendering to the Old Firm.

 

Do I like their travelling fans? No. Do I think many of them are *****? Yes. But I can go to the game and avoid them as much as possible. I can accept songs will be sung but I ignore them and often I don't even follow them as I don'y know the songs.

 

We cannot give up the money. To accommodate supply v demand the JHS makes sense.

[MonehJags]

For league games I accept that we need to give up the JHS as currently we need the money. At the moment we have no chance of winning the league for the foreseeable future and our attendances could be better.

 

The cup game is an entirely different kettle of fish. A one off game with hampden for the winner. Even a half empty Firhill with them in the MS is better than turning it into mini-ibrox. Best chance we've had in years to make it to a semi-final. Can nobody see that? For anyone to say that doesn't matter is talking pish

[Knightswood Jag]

For league games I accept that we need to give up the JHS as currently we need the money. At the moment we have no chance of winning the league for the foreseeable future and our attendances could be better.

 

The cup game is an entirely different kettle of fish. A one off game with hampden for the winner. Even a half empty Firhill with them in the MS is better than turning it into mini-ibrox. Best chance we've had in years to make it to a semi-final. Can nobody see that? For anyone to say that doesn't matter is talking pish

I agree. I understand the club have budgeted for a certain amount of OF games and we have to do it in the league but the cup draw is extra money so there's no excuse for us to give them the whole Jackie Husband, well actually I tell a lie we can't put them in the Colin Weir as it's wooden and if we tried to put them in the North there would be uproar! So the only solution left is to give them at least part of the Jackie Husband. Actually I think I'll start a thread with a poll on this topic to get people's opinions on the best arrangement.

[MonehJags]

The main stand being wooden is not an excuse. As i have said, if Aberdeen fans can be accommodated in there then there is no reason why rangers cant. Motherwell fans set off a flare a few years ago, did they get banned? It was a convenient excuse, nothing more

[jaggy]

Bear in mind we only get half the gate money in the cup, so there might be less of a reason to give them the JH

[lithgaejag]

We need to take advantage of the home ADVANTAGE

[jagfox]

Bear in mind we only get half the gate money in the cup, so there might be less of a reason to give them the JH

 

65/35 split for SPFL League Cup.

[jaggy]

 

 

65/35 split for SPFL League Cup.

Ok, but still to deduct costs

[jagfox]

 

Ok, but still to deduct costs

 

That's to account for costs.

[Lambies Lost Doo]

We need to take advantage of the home ADVANTAGE

 

So Thistle fans need to turn up and stop mumping about the big bad Old Firm

[MonehJags]

Why dont we just play our 'home' games against the OF at their respective stadiums and coin in that way?

[scotty]

Why dont we just play our 'home' games against the OF at their respective stadiums and coin in that way?

As we often do better at their grounds might not be a bad idea!

[Roque]

At Celtic Park, we actually do seem to play well pretty much every time. Narrow defeats and then the 1-1 last year.

 

Different case at Ibrox, where we just seem to roll over and play dead. Plus it's a hateful cesspit, which is possibly why we seem to shite it there rather than in Parkhead, where the atmosphere for league games is often very flat and maybe plays into our hands a wee bit.

 

In conclusion, Celtic Park 4 times for the games vs Celtic and Firhill 4 times vs Rangers. Sorted.

[Norgethistle]

I may be in the minority, but I think the club passing up on a six-figure sum from the away support in a single game, just to appease a few people who want to sit in a specific seat when there are loads of others available, would be extremely short-sighted.

 

We don't make an extra 6 figure sum from OF games, our attendance goes up by 4500 = £103k max less vat, then the addition policing, clean up costs, stewarding costs etc

 

The additional costing for policing will be around £20k (£51 per police per hour at constable level rising to match commander level)

 

At best we'll make around £40k after our addition expenses, not a pittance but not enough to sell home advantage and alienate any of our core support.

 

We don't do it for Aberdeen, hits or hearts who bring good crowds, don't impact on our core support or increase our match day expense ten fold

Edited August 17, 2017 by Norgethistle

[Lenziejag]

 

 

We don't make an extra 6 figure sum from OF games, our attendance goes up by 4500 = £103k max less vat, then the addition policing, clean up costs, stewarding costs etc

 

The additional costing for policing will be around £20k (£51 per police per hour at constable level rising to match commander level)

 

At best we'll make around £40k after our addition expenses, not a pittance but not enough to sell home advantage and alienate any of our core support.

 

We don't do it for Aberdeen, hits or hearts who bring good crowds, don't impact on our core support or increase our match day expense ten fold

Norge, is the additional policing and stewarding costs dependent on the anticipated crowd, or would we have to fork out the extra irrespective of how many turn up - just because it is Celtic/Rangers ?

[lady-isobel-barnett]

So Thistle fans need to turn up and stop mumping about the big bad Old Firm

 

Sorry, LLD, I value your opinions. In fact we probably differ very little on most Jags related issues. But two of your previous posts kinda distance yourself from many other fans.

Firstly "I rarely sit in my season ticket seat. I sit all over the JHS. There are no "prime spots as the seats are too small for any real comfort. It's all the same." and secondly "I really don't care about moving from the JHS to Main Stand". In answer to these posts I imagine a very sizable proportion of ST holders sit in their designated seats as they're amongst their friends/family and/or associates forged over many years. Secondly bearing my first point it is of course a sacrifice for many ST holders to upsticks. Further, moving to a Stand where seats are not designated and where finding a seat that offers a similar view to their own in the JHS is problematic. Most likely that requires turning up at Firhill perhaps as much as twenty minutes earlier than they normally do.

Yes I agree, Jags fans need to turn up but given your previous posts I feel you should at least acknowledge that a considerable proportion of ST holders differ from you and thus they're making a considerable sacrifice. It then follows that the value of their ST is devalued.

Edited August 17, 2017 by lady-isobel-barnett

[Roque]

We don't make an extra 6 figure sum from OF games, our attendance goes up by 4500 = £103k max less vat, then the addition policing, clean up costs, stewarding costs etc

 

The additional costing for policing will be around £20k (£51 per police per hour at constable level rising to match commander level)

 

At best we'll make around £40k after our addition expenses, not a pittance but not enough to sell home advantage and alienate any of our core support.

 

We don't do it for Aberdeen, hits or hearts who bring good crowds, don't impact on our core support or increase our match day expense ten fold

 

I don't really understand what you mean about the attendance going up by 4500. Even if our average attendance for non-OF games is 3500 and with them it's 8000, that doesn't address what I said. My point was the amount of money we'll make from the away crowd in the one-off games against the OF is in the six-figure region - I didn't say the amount more that we'd make than when we play Motherwell, for example, so you can't just suddenly start subtracting the attendance of the away end like it's some sort of average scenario. We sell just under 6000 tickets to the OF dregs, not 4500. A second reason that logic doesn't work is that the average number of Thistle fans who attend games with the OF is substantially less than the average for all the other games. I don't have figures, but I've attended enough games in the past few years and have seen the crowds to know this is absolutely the case, so even if those average figures are logical, they aren't taking into account home fan reduction.

 

I really struggle to give any credence to those police costs, either. I've found an article stating policing for recent Old Firm games have ranged between the £37,000 and £50,000. Absolutely no chance the figures for a Thistle v Rangers game at Firhill come even close to half that total.

 

Additionally, and it's a small thing, but I'm pretty sure in the two games we played against Hibs at home in our first season back up, they brought less than St Mirren, Kilmarnock and Dundee United did. Admittedly with the feelgood factor around the club right now they'll probably double their last support at Firhill when they come to visit this season, but their travelling support is generally pretty poor in relation to their average home gate, so their relevance in a "big away supports" debate is questionable.

 

 

Tl;dr version: your post is wrong on numerous counts.

Edited August 17, 2017 by Roque

[Lenziejag]

 

 

Sorry, LLD, I value your opinions. In fact we probably differ very little on most Jags related issues. But two of your previous posts kinda distance yourself from many other fans.

Firstly "I rarely sit in my season ticket seat. I sit all over the JHS. There are no "prime spots as the seats are too small for any real comfort. It's all the same." and secondly "I really don't care about moving from the JHS to Main Stand". In answer to these posts I imagine a very sizable proportion of ST holders sit in their designated seats as they're amongst their friends/family and/or associates forged over many years. Secondly bearing my first point it is of course a sacrifice for many ST holders to upsticks. Further, moving to a Stand where seats are not designated and where finding a seat that offers a similar view to their own in the JHS is problematic. Most likely that requires turning up at Firhill perhaps as much as twenty minutes earlier than they normally do.

Yes I agree, Jags fans need to turn up but given your previous posts I feel you should at least acknowledge that a considerable proportion of ST holders differ from you and thus they're making a considerable sacrifice. It then follows that the value of their ST is devalued.

 

LIB,

I would be interested to see the evidence that ST holders are making a considerable sacrifice or feel that the additional income isn't worth moving to the Colin Weir stand. I think that a survey of ST holders would need to be done.

[lady-isobel-barnett]

LIB,

I would be interested to see the evidence that ST holders are making a considerable sacrifice or feel that the additional income isn't worth moving to the Colin Weir stand. I think that a survey of ST holders would need to be done.

 

It's not just the ST holders that require surveyed, it's the fanbase as a whole, which incidentally may well include potential ST purchasers put off by the moves. Nowhere have I been saying moving to the CW Stand is a price not worth paying and I guess there's few amongst us who don't understand the rationale.

 

As for ST holders in the JHS (and all JHS users for that matter) it is a sacrifice moving and thus the value of your ST is reduced. I've already made the reasons clear. What further "evidence" can anyone require? For all I know there may be Jags ST holders that appreciate having to get to the ground earlier or like not having a clear view of the entire pitch. They might relish having a break from their JHS friends & neighbours and enjoy spending most of half time queuing for the loo.

[MonehJags]

Why are we still discussing the League matches?? The real issue here is the Cup game!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!