Dizzytheegg Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 What time does the meeting start at and does anyone know when the results are announced? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWM Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 (edited) Unless I've missed it, the following clubs are still "on the fence" and haven't indicated how they likely plan to use their vote. Alloa - Seems Alloa will now vote no. Forfar Hamilton Accies Montrose Queen of the South Queens Park And, ourselves. I'm the vote is secret, but if it emerged about Kilmarnock abstaining I'm sure someone will find how each team voted. Edited July 12, 2012 by MWM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandy Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 I believe it is an 11am start preceded by a possible fans demo at 10:30. In terms of when results reported, depends on how things go. Mid-afternoon? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dizzytheegg Posted July 12, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 I've just joined Twitter, anyone know who's best to follow for updates? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daxington preamble Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 I've thought about this a lot - and I'm not bothered about tomorrow. If Rangers are in Div 3 then that's cool - sporting integrity is served (and people seem to think that's proper important) but if I'm honest i just kind of like getting it up the Rangers fans who I went to school with. I kind of reckon that if I'd been serious about sporting integrity over TV money then maybe i should have walked away from Scottish football back when they started the SPL. Rangers in Div 1 then that's cool too - we get the league re-construction that we want, and which will hopefully create meaningful football for most years. Playing Rangersco as well - can't lie I do love that (surely we'll take something from them). Either way I've bought my season ticket and I'll be supporting the jags next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spam Valley Jag Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 Unless I've missed it, the following clubs are still "on the fence" and haven't indicated how they likely plan to use their vote. Alloa - Seems Alloa will now vote no. Forfar Hamilton Accies Montrose Queen of the South Queens Park And, ourselves. Here is a good breakdown of how the clubs are expected to vote tomorrow: Third Division Clubs Position 09/07/2012 0 Comments Annan Athletic Status: No Chairman Henry McLelland said: “Why should things be treated differently because it’s one of the big two clubs in the country? The argument can’t be moulded to suit one club over another. Rangers should go into Division Three.The alternative is they go nowhere.." Contact: through the website at http://www.annanathleticfc. com/contactus.asp Berwick Rangers Status: No Berwick Rangers Board tonight agreed unanimously that should the new Rangers FC be admitted to the SFL for the new season, that they would support a move directly into SFL Division Three. The Club has also taken on board the feelings of their Supporters Club, Supporters Trust and the countless individual fans who have contacted them directly. There will be no further statement from the club on this matter. Contact: by email at club@berwickrangersfc. co.uk Clyde Status: No It is worth mentioning that three years ago Clyde made huge cutbacks in order to avoid defaulting on debt, and accepted that it would make an impact on their on-field performance probably for some years to come. They have been among the strongest and most eloquent critics of the SPL / SFA proposals. "The overwhelming reality is that we are being asked to make one of the most important decisions for Scottish Football in a vacuum devoid of factual information, that vacuum having been filled with unhelpful rhetoric and scaremongering by the chief executives of the SFA and SPL. In summary, the complete absence of information on Sevco Scotland Ltd renders it impossible to vote with any logic in favour of any of the Resolutions. The default in these circumstances would unfortunately be to vote against. We hope and trust that this unacceptable situation will be resolved swiftly and will allow Clyde Football Club to support Resolution 1 from an informed position and will see Rangers Football Club playing in SFL3. We see Resolution 2 as a matter of trust and it would take a change of personnel and attitude for us to be confident that David Longmuir would be entering discussions with a group of people committed to a collaborative process in a spirit of genuine partnership.In the current circumstances our only decision could be to vote against Resolution 2. Subject to a satisfactory outcome on Resolution 1 we would support Resolution 3." Contact: email on [email protected] East Stirlingshire Status: Undeclared At least one news report has suggested that the Shire are in the No camp, but the club are yet to make any official statement. Contact: by email at fceaststirlingshire@gmail. com Elgin City Status: Undeclared Again, news reports have suggested that Elgin intend to vote No, but there has been no official statement. Contact: by email on [email protected] Montrose Status: Undeclared Another club who have not commented officially thus far. Contact: email on [email protected] Peterhead Status: No Statement 12th July "Although football clubs from all leagues rely heavily on media revenue and sponsorship to survive, it is the fans that are the heart of the club. Our fans have made their feelings very clear over this issue and we have listened and taken on board all comments. We hope that voting to admit a Newco team into Division 3 will unite fans to vote with their feet to support their local team and help preserve our Scottish game." Contact: by email at office@peterheadfc. co.uk Queen's Park Status: No Contact: by email on secretary@queensparkfc. co.uk Stirling Albion Status: Probable No Following a poll among their supporters, which favoured Newco going to the third division, the club announced this was the position they would take forward to the initial general meeting. It is anticipated, though not explicitly confirmed, that this will remain their position. Contact: by email on stirlingalbion@btconnect. com Stranraer Status: No Stranraer are another club who have had to make major cutbacks to avoid defaulting on debt, so it is not a surprise that they have made one of the strongest official statements criticising the proposals to allow Newco straight into a higher division. "We are not convinced at the emotive language currently being aired to describe the potential ramifications to our game should a NewCo not be given special case treatment and consider that the benefits that could be negotiated do not counter balance the damage that would be done to the credibility of the SFL as a governing body." Contact: email on [email protected] Add Comment Second Division Clubs Position 09/07/2012 0 Comments Airdrie United Status: Abstention Airdrie have already announced that they intend to abstain, as one of the clubs whose own divisional status would be affected by the decision of where to place Newco. This is consistent with their previous behaviour in similar circumstances in both 2008 and 2009. Contact: via the website at http://www.airdriefc. com/contact.html Albion Rovers Status: Yes maybe (I think) 12 July "Much has been said and written about sporting integrity. In normal circumstance we would have no hesitation in voting to place Newco Rangers in SFL Division3 but as a Board, we do now need to consider all of the implications before we make that call." . Contact: by email on [email protected] or through the website at http://albionroversfc. com/?page_id=125 Alloa Athletic Status: Undeclared The most recent statement from Chairman Mike Mulraney says "We would also like to assure our fans that we will not be bullied into a decision by any outside influences, but will act in the best interest of Alloa first and Scottish football second. Sporting integrity will of course weigh heavily in any decision we make." Contact: by email on fcadmin@alloaathletic. co.uk Arbroath Status: No Statement 12th July "After considerable and careful deliberation, that had also taken place over many previous meetings, the Club reached the decision that it cannot support a proposal for Rangers Newco to be directly admitted to Division 1 of the Scottish Football League and that sporting integrity must be upheld. We are however in support of entry to the Scottish Football League in Division 3 for next season. The Club is extremely grateful to the large number of stakeholders and supporters who took time to contact the Club and express their views, which we felt very important in assisting us to make an extremely difficult judgement." Contact: through the website at http://www.arbroathfc. co.uk/AFC%20Contact.shtml Ayr United Status: Probable No There has been no official statement from the club, but chairman Lachlan Cameron has made some strongly critical statements in the media. "The Third Division would be the perfect place for Rangers. There is pressure for them to go into the First by the SPL and SFA but I believe they should go intothe Third." Contact: email on info@ayrunitedfc. co.uk or through the site at http://www.ayrunitedfc. co.uk/contact.asp Brechin City Status: Yes Brechin released a statement before the July 3rd meeting saying they would be making no public comment prior to it. Nothin further has been heard and they are another unknown quantity at present. Contact: via the website at http://www.brechincity. com/bcfc/servlet/BCFCFrontControllerServlet? action=Feedback&category=6 East Fife Status: No Like the other Fife clubs, East Fife have issued a fairly emphatic No. "The board of directors of East Fife FC, however, is unanimous in its view that we shall not support any integrated plan that in our view compromises sporting integrity by involving the admission of any ‘Newco’ directly into Division One. Any "Newco" must follow the normal application route into the bottom tier." Contact: via the website at http://eastfifefc.info/ contact-us Forfar Status: Undeclared Another club from whom there has been no official comment thus far. Contact: through the website at http://www.forfarathletic. co.uk/index.php?option=com_contact&view=category& catid=29&Itemid=6 Queen of the South Status: Undeclared Statement "The club are unhappy at being dropped into this position and do not, yet, feel they are in posession of the full facts to allow them to make a final decision. The club are well aware of the strong opinion of the fans and have read all the comments, emails etc sent to the club and fans should rest assured that they are being listened to. The Club will continue to discuss the situation and make a further announcement when a final decision is confirmed and we ask the fans, in the meantime, to trust that we will make the best decision for Queen of the South FC. Contact: by email at [email protected] Stenhousemuir Status: Yes Stenhousemuir were the first club to put their heads above the parapet with an explicit Yes. Their reasoning seemed to be twofold: 1. That the SFL would lose the Settlement Agreement figure from the SPL; 2. That in the event of a No vote the same thing would be achieved via an SPL2 in any case. Contact: by email at info@stenhousemuirfc. com Add Comment First Division Clubs Poition 08/07/2012 2 Comments Cowdenbeath Status: No Cowdenbeath have issued a strongly worded statement indicating their opposition to the proposals. "The Board decided that it would support any application by "Rangers" to join the SFL but would vote against the present proposal which, amongst other matters, would admit "Rangers" directly into the First Division of the SFL." Contact: [email protected] or via http://www.cowdenbeathfc.com/ index.php?act=viewDoc&docId=2 Dumbarton Status: Yes Dumbarton have released a statement this week indicating that strongly implies they are intending to vote Yes: "After hearing arguments on both sides, a clear majority of those voting (55 to 28) reluctantly felt that admitting the Newco into the First Division would be the better option for Scottish football and smaller clubs as a whole" Contact: Chairman Alan Jardine at [email protected] or through the website athttp://www.dumbartonfootballclub. com/contact2/ Dundee Status: Abstention Dundee have released a statement indicating that they have been instructed to abstain from the process due to a believed conflict of interest. This may be challengeable, it is not clear why Dundee fans should thus be disenfranchised from such an important vote when other potentially conflicted clubs, such as Dunfermline and Stranraer are not. Contact: via the club's website at http://www.dundeefc. co.uk/contact/ Dunfermline Status: No Dunfermline have very clearly indicated that they will vote no to Newco in the first division. They have not commented officially on what stance they would take if invited to join an SPL2. Contact: [email protected] Falkirk Status: Possible No Falkirk's official statement has indicated they will vote No to the current proposals, but left it unclear as to whether they might be swayed should the league reconstruction proposals be altered or improved. Their manager Steven Pressley has been a strong and eloquent critic of the manner in which the footballing authorities have handled the situation. Contact: [email protected] Hamilton Accies Status: Possible No Hamilton Chairman Les Gray has indicated opposition to the plans, at least in isolation, but may have left the door open for an arrangement which included more favourable terms on reconstruction. "If our Governing bodies ever get round to tabling any firm proposal to vote on it is unlikely in our opinion that this proposal, in isolation, would be acceptable to the members." Contact: [email protected] or via the club's website at http://www.acciesfc.co.uk/ index.php?option=com_contact&view=contact& id=2&Itemid=221 Livingston Status: Possible No Livingston have made no official statement of their position, but their Chairman Gordon McDougall (who is also an SFL board member) has made public comments expressing considerable scepticism, particularly in the light of the League's handling of Livingston's own case in 2009. Contact: [email protected] or use the contact form here: http://www.livingstonfc. co.uk/club/club_contact.php Morton Status: No Chairman Douglas Rae has been strongly critical of the plans and has indicated a clear intention to vote No. Again, there has been no mention of their position should they be invited to join an SPL2. "Under the current SFL rules, any Club making an application for membership should be admitted to the 3rd Division. I personally see no reason to make any exception to that at this time and would therefore vote accordingly." Contact: general enquiries on [email protected] Partick Thistle Status: Possible No As with some other clubs, Partick's last statement was on the face of it a clear No, but it is not altogether clear that they might not be open to the idea if tied in to other . "On its own this proposal is clearly unacceptable, on a number of levels, and is something the Board of PTFC are not prepared to support." Contact: [email protected] Raith Rovers Status: No Raith have been firmly against the proposals from the outset, and their director Turnbull Hutton has been one of the most outspoken critics. Most recently they released a further statement querying the process for the forthcoming vote. Contact: general enquiries [email protected] Source: http://honestyinsport.weebly.com/voting-intentions-of-sfl-clubs.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spam Valley Jag Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 I've just joined Twitter, anyone know who's best to follow for updates? @BBCchrismclaug @OFFICIAL_SFL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gianlucatoni Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 Just seen that idiot Gordon Smith on Scotland Tonight. Had the cheek to call Sevco a fantastic institution. Also laid into the diddy SFL clubs and decried us for having 'no ambition' - for that read pay your creditors, tax and NI contributions and have a good business model where you take in more than you shell out. What an absolute clown - and former SFA head honcho no less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWM Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 (edited) Embarrassing to think he was Chief exec of the SFA considering his comments about smaller clubs. Archie McPherson was drastically out of touch, and the other guy could have been any journalist yes man. Thomson barely got a word in, but his final quote about Murdoch was good. Also feel any no vote from ourselves will be through gritted teeth sadly. Wouldn't surprise me if we jumped at the half-arsed corrupt SPL 2 when it is brought about. Edited July 12, 2012 by MWM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fellow Traveller Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 To flip it on its head, I think any no vote from us will be through gritted teeth and we'll vote yes if we can possibly get away with it. Personal opinion, just a hunch, delighted to be proved wrong etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trotter Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 (edited) A lot of rumour & counter rumour doing the rounds but I believe Alex Thomson has got his hands on another 'leaked' Regan email. Could be an interesting read! Smith a joke on that programme, Archie MacPherson should be put out to grass after that & the other journo boy was shot down in flames by Alex Thomson. I'm just surprised his last comment wasn't to ask if he fancied 'succulent lamb'. As for the vote, did anyone see the Facebook picture on the Thistle page tonight commenting on the bright sky above Firhill. Someone trying to tell us something? Edited July 12, 2012 by Trotter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWM Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 (edited) To flip it on its head, I think any no vote from us will be through gritted teeth and we'll vote yes if we can possibly get away with it. Personal opinion, just a hunch, delighted to be proved wrong etc. This summer I feel was a terrific opportunity for the club to push on. Club appeared to be getting its arse in gear off the pitch with better financial management, the birth of One Thistle, reasonable chance of a promotion push and some good young players in the team, initial impressions of new BoD very encouraging amongst fans compared to the previous lot, and as a result sense of positivity and enthusiasm about the fans. I feel a large part of the feel good factor has been pissed away due to the way we've handled it. Edited July 12, 2012 by MWM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milhouse Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 Newco should not be admitted to SFL3 nevermind Div1. If we had been liquidated we would have had to start from the Juniors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jags on tour Posted July 12, 2012 Report Share Posted July 12, 2012 I hope they are pumped to div3 but I dread whats going to happen if they are, our fixtures are already messed up as we dont know who's going up or coming down, the challenge cup would need to be changed and the league cup has already been postponed due to them and if they go ahead and create an SPL2 how long is that going to take? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dizzytheegg Posted July 13, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 13, 2012 I hope they are pumped to div3 but I dread whats going to happen if they are, our fixtures are already messed up as we dont know who's going up or coming down, the challenge cup would need to be changed and the league cup has already been postponed due to them and if they go ahead and create an SPL2 how long is that going to take? At this rate they can sort out all these issues out in about a day, and hail it as a blueprint. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dizzytheegg Posted July 13, 2012 Author Report Share Posted July 13, 2012 @BBCchrismclaug @OFFICIAL_SFL Cheers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Dastardly Posted July 13, 2012 Report Share Posted July 13, 2012 Does anyone know how the vote works ? What I mean is that we know it requires 50% of the vote to pass a resolution, but is that 50% of the members or 50% of the votes cast. Also, does it need to be 50% opposed to Sevco or 50% in favour. It does make a difference. If it is 50% of the members that need to vote Sevco in, then the abstentions effectively become NO votes (they are not voting them in) If it is 50%of the members that need to vote Sevco out, then the abstentions effectively become YES votes If it is 50% of votes cast then if we have an odd number of abstentions then they become either 1 YES or 1 NO depending on whether it is 50% in or out. It could be close, so it is important to clarify. There is another option (probably the most likely) that the rules will be drawn up after the votes are cast and counted so that the result will be whatever it is that the SFL board want. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoda-jag Posted July 13, 2012 Report Share Posted July 13, 2012 Does anyone know how the vote works ? What I mean is that we know it requires 50% of the vote to pass a resolution, but is that 50% of the members or 50% of the votes cast. Also, does it need to be 50% opposed to Sevco or 50% in favour. It does make a difference. If it is 50% of the members that need to vote Sevco in, then the abstentions effectively become NO votes (they are not voting them in) If it is 50%of the members that need to vote Sevco out, then the abstentions effectively become YES votes If it is 50% of votes cast then if we have an odd number of abstentions then they become either 1 YES or 1 NO depending on whether it is 50% in or out. It could be close, so it is important to clarify. There is another option (probably the most likely) that the rules will be drawn up after the votes are cast and counted so that the result will be whatever it is that the SFL board want. It's my understanding that it's 50% of the members, and that abstentions are counted as no votes (see recent SPL vote for instance, Killie abstained, but vote result was counted as 11-1). But as you conclude, there is the fear that rules will be rewritten after the vote to suit an outcome favourable to Hunswereus. If that happens, grounds will be even more devoid of paying customers than any club could have imagined. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trotter Posted July 13, 2012 Report Share Posted July 13, 2012 Dundee & Airdrie told at 5pm last night they have to vote. Airdrie have said they'll be voting no to SFL1, not sure about Dundee. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted July 13, 2012 Report Share Posted July 13, 2012 Dundee & Airdrie told at 5pm last night they have to vote. Airdrie have said they'll be voting no to SFL1, not sure about Dundee. Airdrie were abstaining but Ballantyne was asked en route to meeting which way he'd be voting and no commented. How would you feel if your club stood to get promoted on a no vote and your chairman voted yes? Ewan Cameron of Alloa is chairing the meeting. I trust he gets a vote as Alloa were a no vote. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bunny Posted July 13, 2012 Report Share Posted July 13, 2012 (edited) It's my understanding that it's 50% of the members, and that abstentions are counted as no votes I think it's more that abstention has the same effect - or close to it - as a NO vote since the YES's must get a majority, every abstention is one YES they didn't get. A lot of rumour & counter rumour doing the rounds but I believe Alex Thomson has got his hands on another 'leaked' Regan email. Could be an interesting read! http://blogs.channel...tale-world/2265 TrotterSmith a joke on that programme, Archie MacPherson should be put out to grass after that & the other journo boy was shot down in flames by Alex Thomson Some of these guys - like Traynor, etc. have slagged off AT as no more than a busybody who knows nothing about the game up here. AT, a guy who's risked his life reporting from places like Syria (where rebels tried to set him and his camera team up to be shot by the government forces) and who has more journalistic skill and integrity in his bum fluff than most of the succulent lamb munchers. They are beyond despicable. EDIT: did I go too far there? Edited July 13, 2012 by Mr Bunny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat Posted July 13, 2012 Report Share Posted July 13, 2012 Did meeting start at 11.00am and is there any news yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig-W Posted July 13, 2012 Report Share Posted July 13, 2012 Did meeting start at 11.00am and is there any news yet? It seems we could be waiting for some time for any news. It could go on late into the night, apparently. They've probably locked the doors and wont let anyone out until the vote goes their way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Passenger Posted July 13, 2012 Report Share Posted July 13, 2012 Confirmed that Airdrie are a no vote. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cleveland steamer Posted July 13, 2012 Report Share Posted July 13, 2012 Div 3 confirmed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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