Jaggernaut Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 I just did one of these saddo stats searches and found out that this time last season we had 13 points. It took us to the 28th December to reach 15. I know you can never tell what will happen in football but looking at our upcoming fixtures (ignoring Celtic games) we have Aberdeen, Inverness, Kilmarnock, Dundee and Motherwell - the last on the 27th December. You would think we could get 8 or 9 points from these games. Even if we only average 1 point a game that will take us to 20 points. Though I'd prefer to be on 23 or 24 - Hibs were on 21 points the same date. I think we're becoming fairly solid but we need more goalscorers. If we can get a good forward in January we should be fine. I'd say that we already have a good forward and a goalscorer: Chris Doolan. But too often he just doesn't get the service that would allow him to score more often. Agreed, though: another accomplished goalscorer would be a useful addition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meister Jag Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 It's all about opinions, I suppose, but I thought our best passage of play was just BEFORE Doolan came on. Not that I think Stevenson is better, it's just that we were doing well when we started to move the ball about more and I'm not convinced Doolan being on the pitch was what made the difference. We did seem to be relying on the 'route one' approach in the first half - presumably Archie thought that, given the conditions and Goodwin being out, this would pay off, but we're definitely at our best when we try to play football. (Doubtless he'll be criticised for this by the same folk who complain he never changes his tactics!) And to be clear about Stevenson - he should be punted at the first opportunity. He hasn't added anything to the team in any of the games he's featured in, whatever position he's played. And he SHOULD be able to play up front as that's where he's played for a lot of his career. Looks like someone who's on a good wage and is happy to lift it without making much of a contribution. Agree totally with the above. Lovely report in yesterday's Herald that suggested that the first half was the worst ever in the history of association football! Bit brutal but possibly true. Some of the distribution was rank!! (Love to say that that was also in the article in question; but it wasn't.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G SUS Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 (edited) I just did one of these saddo stats searches and found out that this time last season we had 13 points. It took us to the 28th December to reach 15. The 15 points Thistle have after 12 games is the best start to a top flight campaign, after 12 games, since 1992/93 when we would have had 16(obviously at this stage it was 2pts for a win so I've changed it into the current 3pts for a win format) I think we're becoming fairly solid but we need more goalscorers. 10 different players have scored for Thistle in the league this season. At this stage last season we had only 5 league goalscorers, so I'm not really sure we need more goalscorers. Edited November 10, 2014 by G SUS 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graemei Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 So happy to get 3 points today in a game which was a real shocker for 45 minutes. Today's Positives: Frans, Osman, Doolan, McDaid, Kello, pie. Today's negatives: Fox distribution in 1st half, the entire first half, the St Midden fans constantly moaning about everything, the chap near me with rancid wind. Agree with all of that. Particularly the chap with rancid wind! God knows what he had for breakfast! I think this guy was near us on the train on the way home, full carriage looked disgusted. Definitely a low point of the day. But great to get 3 points. I think the young St Mirren side eager to fight for everything and the sh!tey weather stiffled our usual decent passing game. As everyone has been saying, wish Stevenson would stop being played out of position. Frustrating to watch, can imagine must be frustrating for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
potty trained Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 I think what we need is someone who we can bring in and who will score goals upfront. Easier said than done, and looks like an obvious statement when read out, but, In the last two seasons we have got the best out of Doolan when he has had direct competition for his place, namely in Stephen Craig and Lyle Taylor. With the greatest of respect to Eccleston, I don't think he has that. I'd love to be proved wrong, however. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allyo Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 The 15 points Thistle have after 12 games is the best start to a top flight campaign, after 12 games, since 1992/93 when we would have had 16 Archie must go! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jag Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 I think the first half on Saturday was the worst we have played since being back in the top flight. Dreadful performance. I don't think I could sit and watch that every week. We obviously played a bit better in the second half and got a couple of breaks with the goal and then St Mirren hitting the bar late on. However, it was great to see us coming away with the three points and I'm hoping we can pick things up and get back to playing football against Aberdeen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAGSMAN1968 Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 "I think the first half on Saturday was the worst we have played since being back in the top flight. Dreadful performance. I don't think I could sit and watch that every week." you obviously weren't at Rugby Park earlier then!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sinistar Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 The first half on Saturday was bad, but Rugby Park was definitely worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allyo Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 Having suffered so many "creditable" defeats, the fact that we can play half a game against premier opposition so poorly, and still win, is a very encouraging sign. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 I think the first half on Saturday was the worst we have played since being back in the top flight. Dreadful performance. I don't think I could sit and watch that every week. Won't remember anything about the first half in a week or two. it'll be totally erased from my (albeit limited) memory bank. So while that 45 mins is still stale in my mind I'll disagree with above. Either half at Rugby Pk and the 2nd half at Pittodrie were easily worse. I happen to believe Celtic took their collective feet off the gas rather than us getting our act together and they still managed to score FIVE in 20 mins. That's just this season alone (Motherwell at Firhil last Dec?). I don't like the term "winning ugly", and besides our performance that first half on Saturday wasn't even worthy of that expression, but we still competed. So unispiring as it was we've most definitely played a lot worse. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jag Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 (edited) Won't remember anything about the first half in a week or two. it'll be totally erased from my (albeit limited) memory bank. So while that 45 mins is still stale in my mind I'll disagree with above. Either half at Rugby Pk and the 2nd half at Pittodrie were easily worse. I happen to believe Celtic took their collective feet off the gas rather than us getting our act together and they still managed to score FIVE in 20 mins. That's just this season alone (Motherwell at Firhil last Dec?). I don't like the term "winning ugly", and besides our performance that first half on Saturday wasn't even worthy of that expression, but we still competed. So unispiring as it was we've most definitely played a lot worse. I'm happy to erase the first half from my memory to be honest. The only game I thought could come close to first half on Saturday was the 3-0 Aberdeen defeat last September. I think in the games you mentioned we at least tried to pass the ball to each other. Yes, we competed, but I think that was partly aided by playing an extremely poor St Mirren side. I actually didn't get to the Celtic game but understand we competed in the first half and the collapsed in second after Bannigan's red card. Anyway, as I said, it was great to get the three points. And, as Allyo says above, it makes a change from a creditable defeat. Edited to add: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/25482620 Report from the Motherwell game you mention, where we had 13 attempts on goal. Edited November 10, 2014 by Jag Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jag Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 "I think the first half on Saturday was the worst we have played since being back in the top flight. Dreadful performance. I don't think I could sit and watch that every week." you obviously weren't at Rugby Park earlier then!!! Yes, I was. I thought the first half on Saturday was worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veejag Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 Please keep in mind those back to back games against Gretna and St. Johnstone... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Third Lanark Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 Please keep in mind those back to back games against Gretna and St. Johnstone... did we not get an away win against Ross county or Hamilton in the middle of those horror shows? Or perhaps my memory is playing trucks again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
potty trained Posted November 10, 2014 Report Share Posted November 10, 2014 Looking back it was a bloody terrible first half to watch... But it was successful. People claim Archie can't change tactics. With hindsight he clearly can. Our tactic no matter how painful to watch was to play the yardage game. St Mirren are famous this season for setting out with a very high line compressing the attack into the midfield. We played a second attacking midfielder and pumped long high balls for Stevenson to win against the centre halfs or chase into the corners. Under pressure St Mirren just get it out of play. The easiest way for us to push St Mirren back. It might have been bloody horrid to watch, but we went in at half time without conceding and watching the highlights it could be argued that Stevenson had a suvkccessful first half based on those tactics. With 30 minutes to go St Mirren open up as they tire, exactly as McNanara had predicted the week before in their game against St Mirren. As the centre halfs tire, we bring on our first choice fresh legged striker. In retaliation to us bringing on Doolan, they bring in a wean to replace Marwood, their best player, and move the tiring Tesselar to left back. We put mcdaid on Tesselar and the rest is history. On reflection, awful on the eye, but the most tactically astute game Archie has had? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
read'n'yell Posted November 11, 2014 Report Share Posted November 11, 2014 Looking back it was a bloody terrible first half to watch... But it was successful. People claim Archie can't change tactics. With hindsight he clearly can. Our tactic no matter how painful to watch was to play the yardage game. St Mirren are famous this season for setting out with a very high line compressing the attack into the midfield. We played a second attacking midfielder and pumped long high balls for Stevenson to win against the centre halfs or chase into the corners. Under pressure St Mirren just get it out of play. The easiest way for us to push St Mirren back. It might have been bloody horrid to watch, but we went in at half time without conceding and watching the highlights it could be argued that Stevenson had a suvkccessful first half based on those tactics. With 30 minutes to go St Mirren open up as they tire, exactly as McNanara had predicted the week before in their game against St Mirren. As the centre halfs tire, we bring on our first choice fresh legged striker. In retaliation to us bringing on Doolan, they bring in a wean to replace Marwood, their best player, and move the tiring Tesselar to left back. We put mcdaid on Tesselar and the rest is history. On reflection, awful on the eye, but the most tactically astute game Archie has had? I think you've read a bit too much into it. Archie made his standard swapping striker after 60/70 mins sub, followed by swapping winger soon after. He does this every game. Our goal was extremely lucky, from McDaid almost falling over to the potential hand ball (accidental but referees have given fouls for less in the past), a cross that their defence should of stopped, dropping to Elliot who was allowed a donkey of a first touch and then a shot their keeper really should of saved (thought it was hit hard). This game should of ended 0-0 and neither side could complain. Our problem is the players behind the striker not doing enough. Defensively we are solid enough, Frans Seaborne McMillan and O'Donnell are good. Our holding mids work well. Its just that three behind whatever striker that has been the problem recently. I think Stevenson should be in the Craigen role, Higgy back into the Elliot role and Lawless staying where he is. Behind either Dools or Eccie. Elliott and Craigen just don't have the ball retention skills needed in that area of the pitch. It's all about holding off the opposition and making forward passes. How many times do we see it go to Elliott in a good position only for a layoff back to McMillan who passes to centre half then out to Osman/Bannigan/Fraser - almost everytime and it completely knocks the wind our our sails while letting the opposition get back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
potty trained Posted November 11, 2014 Report Share Posted November 11, 2014 (edited) I think you've read a bit too much into it. Archie made his standard swapping striker after 60/70 mins sub, followed by swapping winger soon after. He does this every game. Our goal was extremely lucky, from McDaid almost falling over to the potential hand ball (accidental but referees have given fouls for less in the past), a cross that their defence should of stopped, dropping to Elliot who was allowed a donkey of a first touch and then a shot their keeper really should of saved (thought it was hit hard). This game should of ended 0-0 and neither side could complain. Our problem is the players behind the striker not doing enough. Defensively we are solid enough, Frans Seaborne McMillan and O'Donnell are good. Our holding mids work well. Its just that three behind whatever striker that has been the problem recently. I think Stevenson should be in the Craigen role, Higgy back into the Elliot role and Lawless staying where he is. Behind either Dools or Eccie. Elliott and Craigen just don't have the ball retention skills needed in that area of the pitch. It's all about holding off the opposition and making forward passes. How many times do we see it go to Elliott in a good position only for a layoff back to McMillan who passes to centre half then out to Osman/Bannigan/Fraser - almost everytime and it completely knocks the wind our our sails while letting the opposition get back. Another post where you slate Craigan and Elliott? Who'd have guessed. Incidentally, that donkey of a first touch from Elliott for his goal? Is that the same one a former Scotland international was complimenting as a great first touch last night? Why would he say that? Maybe because it allowed him to step onto it and get a full powerful strike on the ball whilst taking it into the middle if the goal, as opposed to closely controlling it and it getting stuck under his feet? With the greatest of respect, I'll go with McManus on this one. By the way, their keeper didn't save it as it took a deflection off McAusland who was standing about 4 feet infront of Kello. Incidentally your first paragraph is nonsense. And just demonstrates you have a clouded judgement on matters. Edited November 11, 2014 by potty trained 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted November 11, 2014 Report Share Posted November 11, 2014 From the highlights I saw one great cross from Craigen in the second half. He runs and creates chances, as we saw so many times last season. He's a good player, who should be scoring more. Surprised that nobody has mentioned the great piece of ball retention and dribbling by O'Donnell to finally shake off a defender and get in a brilliant cross, which Christie should have buried with a free header. Thankfully the big guy made up for it later. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allyo Posted November 11, 2014 Report Share Posted November 11, 2014 Looking back it was a bloody terrible first half to watch... But it was successful. People claim Archie can't change tactics. With hindsight he clearly can. Our tactic no matter how painful to watch was to play the yardage game. St Mirren are famous this season for setting out with a very high line compressing the attack into the midfield. We played a second attacking midfielder and pumped long high balls for Stevenson to win against the centre halfs or chase into the corners. Under pressure St Mirren just get it out of play. The easiest way for us to push St Mirren back. It might have been bloody horrid to watch, but we went in at half time without conceding and watching the highlights it could be argued that Stevenson had a suvkccessful first half based on those tactics. With 30 minutes to go St Mirren open up as they tire, exactly as McNanara had predicted the week before in their game against St Mirren. As the centre halfs tire, we bring on our first choice fresh legged striker. In retaliation to us bringing on Doolan, they bring in a wean to replace Marwood, their best player, and move the tiring Tesselar to left back. We put mcdaid on Tesselar and the rest is history. On reflection, awful on the eye, but the most tactically astute game Archie has had? I'm a big Archie supporter, but I don't think even he himself would dare to put such a positive spin on Saturday's game. However, given the ridiculous nature of some of the criticism on here, a bit of exaggerated praise is maybe justified. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
read'n'yell Posted November 11, 2014 Report Share Posted November 11, 2014 From the highlights I saw one great cross from Craigen in the second half. He runs and creates chances, as we saw so many times last season. He's a good player, who should be scoring more. Surprised that nobody has mentioned the great piece of ball retention and dribbling by O'Donnell to finally shake off a defender and get in a brilliant cross, which Christie should have buried with a free header. Thankfully the big guy made up for it later. We're not allowed to speak poorly of our grafter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fearchar Posted November 11, 2014 Report Share Posted November 11, 2014 IIRC Christie got into good positions to score three times and scored once. That's not an unreasonable strike rate, although he really should have got above the ball to score from the header too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albert's Ghost Posted November 11, 2014 Report Share Posted November 11, 2014 That looked like a pretty dreadful miss! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebiglemon Posted November 11, 2014 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2014 IIRC Christie got into good positions to score three times and scored once. That's not an unreasonable strike rate, although he really should have got above the ball to score from the header too. It looked bad but he was moving to his left sideways which didn't help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veejag Posted November 11, 2014 Report Share Posted November 11, 2014 People used to cream themselves over Liam Buchanan and he required at least 5 efforts on goal before scoring then suffering yet another injury... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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