Killie vs. Jags

[Dick Dastardly]

29 minutes ago, Lenziejag said:

This is what I mean. You pick out a stay that shows us dropping down to suit your narrative.  A late run, is that all it was.

No. I pick out facts to counter your narrative that McCall was brilliant in the January window that season. (By implication that it had been missed by a previous poster). I was pointing out that we actually took a backwards step.

My recollection is that it was an injury to Brownley (possibly O’Ware) that forced him to move Bell as a defender that changed the form. It was not some miracle transfer business. (And before you say it, Bell was brought in as a midfielder)

[Emsca]

Is McKenna any good as a centre back ?

 

[dl1971]

4 minutes ago, Dick Dastardly said:

No. I pick out facts to counter your narrative that McCall was brilliant in the January window that season. (By implication that it had been missed by a previous poster). I was pointing out that we actually took a backwards step.

My recollection is that it was an injury to Brownley (possibly O’Ware) that forced him to move Bell as a defender that changed the form. It was not some miracle transfer business. (And before you say it, Bell was brought in as a midfielder)

So if thinks go well it's luck. When it goes badly it's mccall s fault. We get the picture. 

 

[dl1971]

1 minute ago, Emsca said:

Is McKenna any good as a centre back ?

 

In my opinion yes. But I'm now struggling to remember as it's ages since he played there. 

[dl1971]

1 hour ago, Thistle88 said:

Who ever let that Rudden deal go aheead has alot to answer for. He’s a lot more of a miss than some people thought he would be.

What’s happening with McAllister is he injured ? What a waste of a signing he’s been. 
Crawford is far too similar to what we already have,  Jakubiak has been alright. His injury came at a bad time because I thought he was starting to come on to a game.

Allegra doesn’t do much, I don’t know what to think of him because our service to him has been awful. Decent touch on him but certainly not up to seed with Scottish football yet.

I’d be recalling the boys we put out on loan at this point, we need as many fit players as possible Gordon, Mciver and Lyon’s could make some sort of impact at least from the bench. I miss Gordon he was always capable of grabbing a goal !

Yep. Can we get Gordon back now? I'm assuming at best if we make play offs. That if is getting bigger.  

[Dick Dastardly]

3 minutes ago, dl1971 said:

So if thinks go well it's luck. When it goes badly it's mccall s fault. We get the picture. 

 

Jesus. I’m not arguing with anyone. I’m just saying what happened in the transfer window that someone else said was missing. No argument going on. People can draw their own conclusions 

[Thistle88]

21 minutes ago, Emsca said:

Is McKenna any good as a centre back ?

 

Not sure I thought he was a centre back when we signed him, he’s not a bad player. He just doesn’t have the legs to play as an attacking full back.

[Dick Dastardly]

1 hour ago, laukat said:

If we somehow scrape into the playoffs and a still struggling for a striker and Dundee are already automatically relegated before the playoffs start could we not recall and play Rudden?

I get Rudden wanted the move to Dundee probably in the hope of premier league football and a higher wage but he will still be our player at that time and the playoffs would be more of a shop window than potentially the remaining meaningless Dundee fixtures 

Can't see much value in recalling Niang as we're not short of midfielders or centrebacks at the moment. Also can't much value in Maciver as he's struggling to get a game at Alloa and he doesn't really add a goal threat.

But would he come back to play for his previous Thistle wages, or would he demand his Dundee wages which we can’t afford.

Forget about Rudden. He is gone and had no hesitation in dumping Thistle for the first better offer that came along. He has no interest in us.

[jlsarmy]

49 minutes ago, Dick Dastardly said:

But would he come back to play for his previous Thistle wages, or would he demand his Dundee wages which we can’t afford.

Forget about Rudden. He is gone and had no hesitation in dumping Thistle for the first better offer that came along. He has no interest in us.

You’ll find most players haven’t got an interest in the Clubs they play for , only in the Wages they can get.
It’s a short career and players have got to maximise it .

Re Zak Rudden, it was a ridiculous deal for Partick Thistle, doesn’t make any difference whether he was leaving at the end of the season , he was our player and under contract and Dundee didn’t want to pay the fee to secure the deal .

So we contrived to do a “ loan deal “ with no obvious goalscoring replacement.

Who’s to blame McCall or Britton?

We didn’t have anybody to replace him and that has been the catalyst for our poor form since January which may cost us a play off place.

 

 

 

[lady-isobel-barnett]

2 hours ago, Dick Dastardly said:

No. I pick out facts to counter your narrative that McCall was brilliant in the January window that season. (By implication that it had been missed by a previous poster). I was pointing out that we actually took a backwards step.

My recollection is that it was an injury to Brownley (possibly O’Ware) that forced him to move Bell as a defender that changed the form. It was not some miracle transfer business. (And before you say it, Bell was brought in as a midfielder)

I think you may be confusing Bell with Geggan.  Bell had been a  midfielder earlier in his career but by and large had been playing as a defender for some time. 

[G SUS]

4 hours ago, Dick Dastardly said:

No. I pick out facts to counter your narrative that McCall was brilliant in the January window that season. (By implication that it had been missed by a previous poster). I was pointing out that we actually took a backwards step.

My recollection is that it was an injury to Brownley (possibly O’Ware) that forced him to move Bell as a defender that changed the form. It was not some miracle transfer business. (And before you say it, Bell was brought in as a midfielder)

Funny way to be brought in as a midfielder - to be announced as a ‘versatile defender’.

Source: https://ptfc.co.uk/ptfc-news/loan-news-steven-bell-and-chris-erskine-join-on-loan/

[Emsca]

9 hours ago, Thistle88 said:

Not sure I thought he was a centre back when we signed him, he’s not a bad player. He just doesn’t have the legs to play as an attacking full back.

I  agree he is not a bad player - but he is not a full back .

He is clearly low in confidence at the moment and rarely takes a player on - this might be on instruction from management . He certainly does not have the speed to knock it past an opposing full back and get to the bye line . Also his crossing is poor. 
I think he can defend but in my view needs to be more aggressive in the challenge . 

[Lenziejag]

9 hours ago, Dick Dastardly said:

I’m not arguing anything. I am just saying who was signed in response to the previous post that mentioned squidy. No point was being made.

Really ? You said there was no transfer window in 2021 implying no changes were made, when in fact the players that came in were instrumental in us being promoted.

[Lenziejag]

9 hours ago, Dick Dastardly said:

No. I pick out facts to counter your narrative that McCall was brilliant in the January window that season. (By implication that it had been missed by a previous poster). I was pointing out that we actually took a backwards step.

My recollection is that it was an injury to Brownley (possibly O’Ware) that forced him to move Bell as a defender that changed the form. It was not some miracle transfer business. (And before you say it, Bell was brought in as a midfielder)

I didn’t say any transfer window was brilliant. I was only pointing out that you pick stats that fit your argument as you have done again here with with Bell. 

Maybe a step back initially in 2021, but eventually won the league. Extrapolating that to 2020 ? 

[Lenziejag]

8 hours ago, jlsarmy said:

You’ll find most players haven’t got an interest in the Clubs they play for , only in the Wages they can get.
It’s a short career and players have got to maximise it .

Re Zak Rudden, it was a ridiculous deal for Partick Thistle, doesn’t make any difference whether he was leaving at the end of the season , he was our player and under contract and Dundee didn’t want to pay the fee to secure the deal .

So we contrived to do a “ loan deal “ with no obvious goalscoring replacement.

Who’s to blame McCall or Britton?

We didn’t have anybody to replace him and that has been the catalyst for our poor form since January which may cost us a play off place.

 

 

 

At the time I didn’t think we would miss Rudden and who knows whether he would have made any difference to the way things have gone, but I am starting to think he has been a big miss.

[Dick Dastardly]

25 minutes ago, Lenziejag said:

Really ? You said there was no transfer window in 2021 implying no changes were made, when in fact the players that came in were instrumental in us being promoted.

I said there was no January window because there wasn’t as such. Due to Covid clubs were free to sign players all the way through the season. The 5 mentioned were signed in March.

And please, I am not trying to make any argument about anything. I’m just pissed of about losing 4 in a row. We may not have lost by as many as predicted but we still lost and play-off hopes are hanging by a thread.  Please tell me I’m allowed to be pissed off.

[jlsarmy]

17 minutes ago, Lenziejag said:

At the time I didn’t think we would miss Rudden and who knows whether he would have made any difference to the way things have gone, but I am starting to think he has been a big miss.

Because we had nobody to replace him , it was a ridiculous decision.

Our whole style of play has now changed , Rudden played on the shoulder of the last man , so we could use his pace to get behind teams .

We’re now playing much narrower with is easier to defend against with everything in front of the opposition’s defenders.

Crazy Decision

[Dick Dastardly]

8 hours ago, jlsarmy said:

You’ll find most players haven’t got an interest in the Clubs they play for , only in the Wages they can get.
It’s a short career and players have got to maximise it .

Re Zak Rudden, it was a ridiculous deal for Partick Thistle, doesn’t make any difference whether he was leaving at the end of the season , he was our player and under contract and Dundee didn’t want to pay the fee to secure the deal .

So we contrived to do a “ loan deal “ with no obvious goalscoring replacement.

Who’s to blame McCall or Britton?

We didn’t have anybody to replace him and that has been the catalyst for our poor form since January which may cost us a play off place.

 

 

 

I have no insight as to whether this actually happened, but it is not inconceivable. Rudden tells the club he wants a transfer now to get his bigger wage and that he has no interest in playing for us anymore. McCall and Britton decide that they can free up a wage and set up the loan (they didn’t have much choice as Rudden was effectively gone anyway). They didn’t manage to bring in the player that they wanted.

[Dick Dastardly]

5 hours ago, G SUS said:

Funny way to be brought in as a midfielder - to be announced as a ‘versatile defender’.

Source: https://ptfc.co.uk/ptfc-news/loan-news-steven-bell-and-chris-erskine-join-on-loan/

Thanks. I did say it was a recollection. Pretty sure that it was him coming into the central defence that steadied the ship and that was the result of an injury.

Love to know what happened at half time at East Fife when we were 2-0 down and getting thumped.

[jlsarmy]

18 minutes ago, Dick Dastardly said:

I have no insight as to whether this actually happened, but it is not inconceivable. Rudden tells the club he wants a transfer now to get his bigger wage and that he has no interest in playing for us anymore. McCall and Britton decide that they can free up a wage and set up the loan (they didn’t have much choice as Rudden was effectively gone anyway). They didn’t manage to bring in the player that they wanted.

Don’t think he’ll be on bigger wages yet as he’s not officially a Dundee player , obviously Dundee will be paying his PTFC wages and the chances are Dundee will be relegated so Zak Rudden will be back to Championship Wages which will probably not be much more than we were paying him.

The deal should never have been done regardless of Zak Rudden’s thinking as Dundee wouldn’t pay the transfer fee , IMO it has totally derailed our season.

Edited March 27, 2022 by jlsarmy

[a f kincaid]

It may just have been an oversight but I noticed the SFA Twitter feed listing the players and their clubs for the U21 match against Turkey indicated the players who were on loan from a parent club. Mayo was one of them but Rudden simply said "Dundee". Do they know something we don't?

[jlsarmy]

6 minutes ago, a f kincaid said:

It may just have been an oversight but I noticed the SFA Twitter feed listing the players and their clubs for the U21 match against Turkey indicated the players who were on loan from a parent club. Mayo was one of them but Rudden simply said "Dundee". Do they know something we don't?

Both Dundee and PTFC have said it’s a loan deal 

[fifexile]

41 minutes ago, Dick Dastardly said:

I have no insight as to whether this actually happened, but it is not inconceivable. Rudden tells the club he wants a transfer now to get his bigger wage and that he has no interest in playing for us anymore. McCall and Britton decide that they can free up a wage and set up the loan (they didn’t have much choice as Rudden was effectively gone anyway). They didn’t manage to bring in the player that they wanted.

This was mentioned several times before. The rumour (and it is only a rumour) was the loan deal was done because Rudden effectively threatened to 'down tools' if he didn't get the move to Dundee in January. It suited Dundee to loan us  back a player who wasn't going to get game time with them.

The only people who know the truth of what went on are those involved and we can only guess how we would have fared with Rudden in the team. I suspect if he had a couple of bad games or missed a couple of chances there would have been posts on here saying he wasn't interested in playing for Thistle with a 3 year contact with Dundee signed and sealed.

[Lenziejag]

1 hour ago, Dick Dastardly said:

I said there was no January window because there wasn’t as such. Due to Covid clubs were free to sign players all the way through the season. The 5 mentioned were signed in March.

And please, I am not trying to make any argument about anything. I’m just pissed of about losing 4 in a row. We may not have lost by as many as predicted but we still lost and play-off hopes are hanging by a thread.  Please tell me I’m allowed to be pissed off.

You are - but what’s 2020 got to do with now ?

[Garscube Road End 2]

It is relative to the the dreadful windows that McCall had and the deterioration of our perfomances. Relegation in 2020, now when we should really have had top 4 wrapped up we are hanging on by our fingernails and our goal difference has taken a hammering too. Ayr fans on P and B have commented on this is a McCall trait. His teams tail off in the last quarter of the season.