Reserved Kids' Seats £25

[ian_mac]

However I would not have charged a parent any more than £25. Meaning if you have more than one child you get them free.

Great suggestion.

[lady-isobel-barnett]

I'm a great believer once a kid has his first football top on then half the battle is done. Great chance that kid will always support the club. Obviously football tops are pricey but Jags T shirts or training tops less so. Not really addressing Colin's beef but getting something like that in return for the £25 outlay would go some way to appease. Even a scarf or a cap could be a clincher with the kid at least.

[La Scimmia Rossa]

Just to keep reminding everyone. The report from the meeting suggested that the system was being abused. That people were gaming the system. One or two of the reps specifically mentioned it in their posting on here after the meeting, Was that a lie? Where has that accusation gone? Aren't the reps who attended that meeting concerned that they were mislead ?

[1 John Lambie]

Just to keep reminding everyone. The report from the meeting suggested that the system was being abused. That people were gaming the system. One or two of the reps specifically mentioned it in their posting on here after the meeting, Was that a lie? Where has that accusation gone? Aren't the reps who attended that meeting concerned that they were mislead ?

 

People will abuse the system, that's quite obvious. Those that do, I doubt a £25 charge will put them off. Also, as it's still possible to get a season ticket without a reserved seat for free, it's still possible to abuse the system by not paying the £25 & using the ticket not for its intended recipient. Best way around any problems would be to have a dedicated turnstile for U16 ST's only, not sure if this is possible with the new card system though?

[stuartaytonspeaksfrench]

CONFIRMED - It was mentioned that parents were using U16 tickets on occasion. CONFIRMED - It was mentioned that the system was being abused by some. CONFIRMED - It was mentioned that people were gaming the system. CONFIRMED - People were simply posting what had happened, I see no reason reps would have been lied to. Not quite sure what you mean about where the accusation has gone? I don't believe we were misled.

[potty trained]

Just to keep reminding everyone. The report from the meeting suggested that the system was being abused. That people were gaming the system. One or two of the reps specifically mentioned it in their posting on here after the meeting, Was that a lie? Where has that accusation gone? Aren't the reps who attended that meeting concerned that they were mislead ?

 

Why do you believe the club misled the Federation? That's a hell of an accusation to suggest took place!

[read'n'yell]

I don't even think there's a debate here.

 

If you want/ need/ desire a seat for your kid you pay £25.

 

If you use that seat most of the season it is still very cheap.

 

If you don't use the seat much, then you obviously don't need it.

 

You can still get them in for free if money's tight.

 

JHS season ticket holders pay for their seat. So if they go to North Stand at least there isn't an empty seat that hasn't been paid for.

 

When I was under 16 I'm sure I paid 8/10 quid a game. I think it's terrible people are moaning at 25 for a season when if money is so tight they can still get in for free (btw it's half the price of a pie per game).

 

People wanting everything for nothing.

[La Scimmia Rossa]

So

• At the meeting, the club told everyone the system was being abused.
  
• They then told everyone they would need to make a charge to deter people from abusing the system.
  
• The Federation reps at this point are probably (rightly) reasonably sympathetic to the club's view.
  
• However the reps (rightly) counter that the £50 is too much and make a counter suggestion. £25 .
  

Then the club issue a statement to communicate the £25 charge for "reserved seats. However the statement makes no mention whatsoever that the system was being abused.Apparently the reason is now

 

"to dissuade those youngsters who take a season ticket and don’t then turn up for the club’s matches, which impacts negatively on the match day experience for others."

 

This, despite the fact that there are other, more straightforward solutions to that particular problem. Isn't it fairly obvious that something doesn't add up. I'm not accusing the club of misleading the reps, however if had been at that meeting and then read the statement, i'd be slightly confused.

Edited May 22, 2014 by La Scimmia Rossa

[La Scimmia Rossa]

Can i also point out that when an adult purchases a season ticket they don't pay to "reserve a seat". The season ticket money is basically you or I giving the club the money up front, for which we receive a discount.

 

There is absolutely no reason why the club can't bring in an unreserved season ticket with an administration fee to reserve a seat. Especially if people are buying seats for the JH and then going over to the North Stand.That according to the club, is ruining someone else's match day experience because the seat that you have purchased, can;t be used by anyone else.

 

 

If you agree with the principle that a reserved seat attracts a premium, then it's a slippery slope.

Edited May 22, 2014 by La Scimmia Rossa

[Lenziejag]

So

• At the meeting, the club told everyone the syatem was being abused.
  
• They then told everyone they would need to make a charge to deter people from abusing the system.
  
• The Federation reps at this point are probably (rightly) reasonably sympathetic to the club's view.
  
• However the reps (rightly) counter that the £50 is too much and make a counter suggestion. £25 .
  

Then the club issue a statement to communicate the £25 charge for "reserved seats. However the statement makes no mention whatsoever that the system was being abused.Instead they give at best part of the story. Apparently the reason is now

 

"to dissuade those youngsters who take a season ticket and don’t then turn up for the club’s matches, which impacts negatively on the match day experience for others."

 

This, despite the fact that there are other, more straightforward solutions to that particular problem. Isn't it fairly obvious that something doesn't add up.

 

If you are that upset about this issue, you should do what was done re the NS issue. Get people emailing the club and get a petition going. You(and the club) will soon find out what the feeling of the fans is.

 

I think it is irrelevant what the statement on its own says. Anybody that is interested will have followed the tweets from the meeting and links the two.

[La Scimmia Rossa]

Again with the, "you are on your own" chat. I've already emailed the club.

[potty trained]

So

• At the meeting, the club told everyone the system was being abused.
  
• They then told everyone they would need to make a charge to deter people from abusing the system.
  
• The Federation reps at this point are probably (rightly) reasonably sympathetic to the club's view.
  
• However the reps (rightly) counter that the £50 is too much and make a counter suggestion. £25 .
  

Then the club issue a statement to communicate the £25 charge for "reserved seats. However the statement makes no mention whatsoever that the system was being abused.Apparently the reason is now

 

"to dissuade those youngsters who take a season ticket and don’t then turn up for the club’s matches, which impacts negatively on the match day experience for others."

 

This, despite the fact that there are other, more straightforward solutions to that particular problem. Isn't it fairly obvious that something doesn't add up. I'm not accusing the club of misleading the reps, however if had been at that meeting and then read the statement, i'd be slightly confused.

 

Must say, i'm not confused by the statement.

 

You've forgotten that they also advised us that 150 childs reserved seats had been claimed for and still remain unclaimed in a drawer in the office. That in some instances (what i took from the discussion) that these reserved seats were being abused, in a way that allowed a parent to reserve a prime half way line seat (for example) under the name of his child. and his mate then pays at the gate and sits in the reserved seat.

 

"joe, you fancy going to see Thistle this Saturday, mate?"

 

"na, you sit at the half way line, its really busy there, i'd be sitting on my own down at the south end."

 

"Joe mate, i reserved a seat beside me under the wee man's name, he never goes, i never even collected his ticket. sit in that seat."

 

I think adding the 150 unclaimed seats issue to your post clears up the part of the statement you have quoted.

 

Did you contact Digger, with your concerns?

[gianlucatoni]

I can sympathise with those people who did not abuse the system and feel they are now being punished for other peoples actions.

 

However, as has been said, attacking those fans who attended the federation meeting will achieve nothing. It certainly won't earn you any support or increased representation.

 

Some people are talking as if those who attended the federation couldn't care less about this. When in actual fact the proposal would have been a lot worse had we simply said nothing.

 

I take on board that the deal still isn't acceptable to some. If that is the case then voice your concerns to the club and SF - don't start making pessimistic assumptions about how much we care about the issue.

 

Ian,

I wasn't being critical of you or the reps at the meeting and I do note that the fifty quid suggested by the suits was bartered down on your collective suggestion to 25 quid as a best case scenario - however what seems to have been discussed at the meeting (from what I've read in this post) is entirely contradictory to what appeared in a quite appallingly worded statement on the OS sticking the boot into the non-genuine kid fans and ergo their parents.

It appears that the reason for the increase was that certain folk were abusing the kids tickets and using them for adult access - my questions are:

• Is this a scurrilous rumour put up by the board to ease in the charge or is it actually based on hard facts? ... and secondly
  
• If this is indeed true, surely the club had access to the specific tickets being abused and could have shut them down/written to the parent to recall the ticket. As this patently was not done you have to ask 'why not'?
  

[Lenziejag]

Again with the, "you are on your own" chat. I've already emailed the club.

 

If that was directed at me - I didn't say you are on your own. I was suggesting you get others organised. The fact that there isn't the same level of thread traffic suggests that there isn't the same concern.

 

[sb1876]

 

Must say, i'm not confused by the statement.

 

You've forgotten that they also advised us that 150 childs reserved seats had been claimed for and still remain unclaimed in a drawer in the office. That in some instances (what i took from the discussion) that these reserved seats were being abused, in a way that allowed a parent to reserve a prime half way line seat (for example) under the name of his child. and his mate then pays at the gate and sits in the reserved seat.

 

"joe, you fancy going to see Thistle this Saturday, mate?"

 

"na, you sit at the half way line, its really busy there, i'd be sitting on my own down at the south end."

 

"Joe mate, i reserved a seat beside me under the wee man's name, he never goes, (......... I've even got his season book if you want to get in free, it flashes as a junior but time it right and Bob's your uncle) i never even collected his ticket. sit in that seat."

 

 

Seems like this (my comments above in red) may have been one of the many concerns of the club?

 

I don't currently have a season ticket as I only get to a handful of games at most, however will be buying one this season, I'll also ask for a junior one for my son too (free - which is excellent), I'm not that bothered about a seat for either me or him and will just find 2 together when we do manage to go. I appreciate the argument that reserving seats could be better but it must be frustrating when empty seats are everywhere (with reserved on them) and also when you do have a reserved seat and other folk sit in them.

 

As mentioned I'm not that bothered about where I sit although I do get the fact that others may want to sit as part of a larger group, if that was me I'd be happy enough to pay £25 for my son and still feel it's brilliant value. If you have more than one child or where finances are [pretty tough I can see this could be an issue (I wonder if those affected could speak with the club directly and if they would make an exception for specific cases where kids really do go every week and a specific seat is needed?)

 

We are all Thistle fans and I feel the reps did a good job representing fans when the original £50 to reserve a seat was mentioned (with no prior notice to them).

[mgow]

Given it will still be possible to get a free Kids ticket with an unreserved seat, the issue cannot (logically) be about adults using the tickets to get in.

 

The only possible issue the new approach will tackle is to limit the impact of "seat blocking". (empty seat reserved for your mate on their infrequent visits). The £25 will reduce the number of adults who will do that "just in case", but if you were an adult who managed 10 games a season (so Season Ticket is too costly), you are still likely to decide an extra £25 (equiv to £2.50 per game for you) might be worth it anyway.

 

Can I just ask some numbers: does anyone know how many Kids Season Tickets were collected?

 

I thought we had around 2,000 Season Tickets at most:

150 Kids never collected

350 in NS (many who still have a seat allocated in JHS)

 

I can't imagine that leaves any more that 500 collected Kids tickets (and only 1,000 paying tickets).

 

Therefore, this hullabaloo is about 650 seats at most, about 11% of the JHS or 6.5% of Firhill. A ground that was NEVER more than 80% full last season. I still suspect that there is at least a third take up rate at on the Kids tickets at every game, but it could be higher. Meanwhile, unless it is changing, all JHS season ticket holders can "seat block" up to 18 times a season in that stand by attending NS.

 

All the club have done is establish the principle that you need to pay to reserve a seat at Firhill. The most they will raise is £16K from this exercise, probably a lot less. How much does goodwill cost?

 

This begs the question: what happens to hundreds of Kids with unreserved seats for all ticket games? If the club were being honest, this is the only time the "seat blocking" becomes a major issue. But it is now going to cause them an even bigger admin headache. Or they just tell those Kids they can't come for those games.

[La Scimmia Rossa]

Did I miss the memo about prime seating at Firhill? Are they heated? Do I get a discount on my season ticket if a take a non prime seat?

Excellent post Mgow. Said what I've been trying to say in about 95% of the words.

Edited May 22, 2014 by La Scimmia Rossa

[Lionel J. Botch]

This begs the question: what happens to hundreds of Kids with unreserved seats for all ticket games? If the club were being honest, this is the only time the "seat blocking" becomes a major issue. But it is now going to cause them an even bigger admin headache. Or they just tell those Kids they can't come for those games.

 

This is the point I have tried to make in previous posts. Assuming many people take the non reserved option, where do you put the kids for an all ticket match? I find it amazing that you can issue a ticket that gets you into a stadium without allocating a seat for an all ticket match. If there are 200 non reserved tickets, that is an admin headache to contact those ticket holders, or the guardians, to tell them where their seat is for a ticket game. Now you need to allocate a seat next to that for the adult to move to as well.

 

As I have mentioned in an earlier post, this affects 1 game. Much easier to issue a kids go free season ticket with no access to the Celtic game. Several weeks before this game, you can purchase your ticket for a concession fee. Anyone not interested can then have the seat sold for the game by the club.

 

The way to stop adults entering into the stadium on the kids ticket can be looked at. A kids only gate (obviously next to an adult one) for example that a steward / rep stands at.

 

 

 

[BowenBoys]

I think this issue is yet another badly thought out move by the club. It will be interesting to see the terms and conditions when they finally get round to working them out. I'm not sure what I will do this season. I don't get to enough games to make a season ticket financially worthwhile but want to renew in order to support the club. Will decide when the club announce officially what arrangements will be.

[La Scimmia Rossa]

To follow on from Lionel 's point.

 

I go to games with a combination of friends and my son. My son will attend 90% of the games i attend. Now my father in law wants an oap ticket next to us. I don't want to pay the 25 quid for my son so i'll take an unallocated kids ticket. That means when my son wants to go, the three of us take up seats in the family section but the reserved adult and oap seat lie empty?

 

What happens if it 's a decent non Celtic match and the family section is busy? Do i get a special prize for ruining the match experience in the family section AND my own section of the JH ?

 

Also i missed games last season and will next year. Like BB i felt i was helping the club out. It would be much more convenient( and cheaper) not to renew and just take out the free kids ticket and take my chances on a Saturday by PATG.

 

It's a fiasco.

Edited May 22, 2014 by La Scimmia Rossa

[jaggy]

Also i missed games last season and will next year. Like BB i felt i was helping the club out. It would be much more convenient( and cheaper) not to renew and just take out the free kids ticket and take my chances on a Saturday by PATG.

 

It's a fiasco.

why don't you just do that instead of boring the arse off everybody else with about a million posts about 'me, me, me'?

 

more posts by you in the last few days than in the last few years Red Monkey eh!!

Edited May 22, 2014 by jaggy

[ClydebankJag]

If the issue here is reserved seats going unused, and thereby impacting on the matchday experience, then won't this proposal just exacerbate the issue? It's now a real possibility that a parent will have their seat reserved but will sit elsewhere so that their kids can sit alongside them. The problem of fans not knowing whether a reserved seat is actually free will still continue.

[G SUS]

To follow on from Lionel 's point.

 

I go to games with a combination of friends and my son. My son will attend 90% of the games i attend. Now my father in law wants an oap ticket next to us. I don't want to pay the 25 quid for my son so i'll take an unallocated kids ticket. That means when my son wants to go, the three of us take up seats in the family section but the reserved adult and oap seat lie empty?

 

What happens if it 's a decent non Celtic match and the family section is busy? Do i get a special prize for ruining the match experience in the family section AND my own section of the JH ?

 

Also i missed games last season and will next year. Like BB i felt i was helping the club out. It would be much more convenient( and cheaper) not to renew and just take out the free kids ticket and take my chances on a Saturday by PATG.

 

It's a fiasco.

 

I may have missed something, so apologies if I have.

 

At the meeting on Friday it has been reported that free Under 16s ST's had to be taken in the Family Section. The club statement on Wednesday says nothing of the sort, which suggests a U-Turn. It states that for a reserved seat you pay £25. My interpretation of the statement is that you could sit with your kids in unreserved seats anywhere in the JH stand, just that you might move week on week if someone else has occupied an unreserved seat before you.

 

If this is the case, and please feel free to point out where it says you must be in the family section if I've missed it, then I'd say the club has, again, listened to feedback from the meeting and acted accordingly.

[Jaggernaut]

why don't you just do that instead of boring the arse off everybody else with about a million posts about 'me, me, me'?

 

more posts by you in the last few days than in the last few years Red Monkey eh!!

 

This.

[La Scimmia Rossa]

It's been a while, but I assume technology still allows you to ignore threads you don't want to read? Cheers.