Is The Bing Forever?

[Lambies Lost Doo]

Ideally we would have a reformatted current stadium.  The seats in JHS are to small.  Need to get new seats with better leg room and reduce the number of seats.

Safe standing in JLS.

And a brand new Main Stand!

[lady-isobel-barnett]

2 hours ago, allyo said:

Genuinely I do think that there must be scope to massively improve the look of the area without any huge amount of cash. Could make a nice community project. 

Also... Fir Hill

Being genuine here myself. Anything that can be done to improve football on the park should be welcome. One natural element that's sure to spoil a game is wind. Put another way no game is the better for blustery conditions. Trees would be fine by me. Golfers will know what I mean.

[Lenziejag]

25 minutes ago, lady-isobel-barnett said:

Being genuine here myself. Anything that can be done to improve football on the park should be welcome. One natural element that's sure to spoil a game is wind. Put another way no game is the better for blustery conditions. Trees would be fine by me. Golfers will know what I mean.

When I played golf and it was windy my golf balls always ended up in the trees. Mind you they ended up there when it wasn’t windy too.

[Garscube Road End 2]

My golf balls loved sand and water. Weird!

[lady-isobel-barnett]

2 hours ago, Lenziejag said:

When I played golf and it was windy my golf balls always ended up in the trees. Mind you they ended up there when it wasn’t windy too.

Aye, I should've said golfers who don't slice or hook will know what I mean. 

[laukat]

I agree its pointless building a 4th stand but perhaps the club could still earn some income from the Bing?

During covid fans could pay to get cardboard cut outs put in the stand to show their support when they could only attend virtually. Perhaps the Bing could allow fans to pay for something similar either on a seasonal basis or for something more permanent? 

Perhaps we could install advertising boards? As its behind the goal it must be an attractive advertising position as its more likely to be shown on camera during TV games.

One slightly darker thought - I'm not sure how many of us have given a thought where we want to go after our time is up but perhaps the Bing could be a place for ashes to be spread or urns to be located? You could have an eternity of heavenly bliss at Firhill to compensate for every other Saturday feeling like purgatory?

[eljaggo]

18 hours ago, Woodstock Jag said:

I think his point is that groundsharing with Queen's Park was disastrous for the playing surface.

There are plenty of reasons why Thistle and Queen's Park don't (permanently) share a ground, even if some of them wouldn't apply in the event a conscious choice was made to pursue such a solution.

One is timing: Queen's Park only relatively recently left Hampden, an asset that was very profitable for them while they owned it, but which would have been manifestly unsuitable for a club like Thistle.

One is the circumstances of their ceasing to own Hampden: the reason they sold is was part of a package proposal that would see Lesser Hampden redeveloped. Millions have been spent on that stadium, it's not even finished, and it would be wholly unsuited to Thistle's needs given our fanbase size.

One is geography: yes we are in the same city, but Queen's Park is a South Side team and we are fundamentally a North West Glasgow one. Moving Thistle far from North Glasgow would, IMO, kill the Club.

One is the Scottish climate and practicalities of ground-sharing (especially at Firhill): our pitch took an absolute battering with weekly football on it, leading to the Club having to spend money on remedial work, lessening the financial benefit of having a tenant.

One is the implications of switching to an artificial pitch: several points here - one is cultural aversion to synthetic surfaces, another is up-front financial cost (including if you change your mind later on).

We aren't like the Milan or Rome Clubs, where a purpose-built facility serves two clubs of roughly equal size, and of a much bigger size than ourselves. In their case they benefit from economies of scale; in our case the gains are much less significant. They also benefit from much warmer and dryer climate, making the maintaining of a grass pitch much more viable.

I would be very surprised if Thistle and Queen's Park end up ground-sharing again in any long-term capacity any time soon. It would be indicative of distress at one or both Clubs, not a proactive plan.

Don't understand some of your points.

Can't understand your first point - would the two clubs unconciously ground share?

Not sure what proportion of fans live in NW Glasgow, and what proportion of them would refuse to travel 5 miles or so to the southside if faced with that or no Club..

You seem to be saying that there was some financial benefit from sharing Firhill even after increased pitch maintenance.

Some of are valid points, but don't add up to addressing the fundamental problem - an ageing, oversized stadium with a declining fanbase, and no wealthy owner to bankroll the Club.  What do you suggest?  I suspect that unless promoted within the next 2 or 3 years, some more fundamental choices will have to be made than the choice of playing surface.

[allyo]

Er, isn't it covered by massive advertising boards?

[scotty]

10 minutes ago, allyo said:

Er, isn't it covered by massive advertising boards?

Don't show this thread to any advertisers. If fans don't even know the hoardings are there, are they going to notice what's being advertised?

[laukat]

19 minutes ago, allyo said:

Er, isn't it covered by massive advertising boards?

Yes I should have phrased it better to say to put in more. To me there are still large sections of the Bing that is just unused grass. 

I'd always assumed that the scaffolding that currently supports the advertising boards was put in for other purposes than advertising (i.e. I think it was at one stage for a TV gantry?) and as such doesn't allow for maximum density of advertising.

 

[JeanieD]

On the subject of Lesser Hampden - it looks very neat and tidy and will, undoubtedly, be an asset for QP once finished but capacity (especially if they get to the top division) is a real drawback. In truth I am a bit surprised that QP didn't think of going back to Cathkin Park - the basic structure still stands and the footprint could provide for a decent sized ground capacity wise. In a similar vein I am also surprised that Clyde, as far as I am aware, didn't consider Cathkin and are apparently looking at Crownpoint. Cost will have been an issue for both clubs I imagine. 

 

Sorry to veer off topic ................................................... back to the Bing

[Woodstock Jag]

1 hour ago, eljaggo said:

Don't understand some of your points.

Can't understand your first point - would the two clubs unconciously ground share?

I mean them doing it because they want to, as part of a plan, rather than one Club being forced to ask for help because they haven't got somewhere to play their games.

1 hour ago, eljaggo said:

Not sure what proportion of fans live in NW Glasgow, and what proportion of them would refuse to travel 5 miles or so to the southside if faced with that or no Club.

Enough to severely depress attendances, would be my guess. Look at what happened to Clyde when they were up-rooted from their home to (really) not that far away.

1 hour ago, eljaggo said:

You seem to be saying that there was some financial benefit from sharing Firhill even after increased pitch maintenance.

Yes, but it was outweighed, in the eyes of many, by playing on a potato field, even with the extra pitch maintenance.

1 hour ago, eljaggo said:

Some of are valid points, but don't add up to addressing the fundamental problem - an ageing, oversized stadium with a declining fanbase, and no wealthy owner to bankroll the Club.

I think you've missed the point of my post. I was providing an explanation, not a justification. It requires more than just the kernel of an idea for it to be delivered. There are lots of situational, cultural and financial reasons why it hasn't been done, and why it's not likely to happen, whatever its objective or subjective merits.

1 hour ago, eljaggo said:

What do you suggest?  I suspect that unless promoted within the next 2 or 3 years, some more fundamental choices will have to be made than the choice of playing surface.

Personally? I would stop using the Main Stand on match-days as a place for spectators, and house away fans in the North end of the Jackie Husband Stand for most games. My instinct is that we should concentrate the resources we have on making the Jackie Husband Stand and North Stand fit for purpose, because they are more than enough for the primary purposes of the stadium. Whether the Main Stand and Bing are mothballed or redeveloped comes down entirely to whether anyone is able and willing to redevelop them. But neither should be a priority for the Club. As Stuart has said anything else is a vanity project or not credible.

[allyo]

2 hours ago, laukat said:

Yes I should have phrased it better to say to put in more. To me there are still large sections of the Bing that is just unused grass. 

I'd always assumed that the scaffolding that currently supports the advertising boards was put in for other purposes than advertising (i.e. I think it was at one stage for a TV gantry?) and as such doesn't allow for maximum density of advertising.

 

Yeah I agree actually. Either way it could be used better. There's no reason why a football ground end without a stand can't be an attractive and well used space.

[lady-isobel-barnett]

4 hours ago, laukat said:

Yes I should have phrased it better to say to put in more. To me there are still large sections of the Bing that is just unused grass. 

I'd always assumed that the scaffolding that currently supports the advertising boards was put in for other purposes than advertising (i.e. I think it was at one stage for a TV gantry?) and as such doesn't allow for maximum density of advertising.

That's true. Tho' I've been involved many moons ago in advertising/marketing I'm not sure how lucrative large board advertising at a football ground will be these days. For long shot it doesn't help that TV cameras are situated that end of the park. Also the more advertising sold thru dilution in no way equates with income derived from advertising. That said any incremental income has to be welcome. I just doubt it would bring in much more than marginal extra income.

[Fawlty Towers]

Looking back to the Board statement on the 5th of January:

"We are actively looking at alternative options to develop the old south terracing."

We need, in my opinion, an open meeting at the end of the season where this, amongst other issues, is discussed in a full and frank manner. We are all Thistle fans after all moving along the road to fan ownership so some openness now is required.

[avie-man]

Club need to be actively looking, and I'd like to think as cited above its been ongoing. Something of more substance to plug the holes as opposed to begging for supporters to dig deeper yet again.

Planning permission last lodged (and granted) in 2015 (https://publicaccess.glasgow.gov.uk/online-applications/applicationDetails.do?keyVal=NFR8NBEXW4000&activeTab=summary) for the firhill developments iteration. No willing developer at the time. I'd say the state of play around the stadium has considerably changed since then. 

That canalside land is not the derelict and abandoned ex foundry land it was in years gone by. Massive regeneration has gone into the canal from Port Dundas all the way up to Firhill in the last few years and isn't stopping, including even away from the close proximity of the canal down to the likes of the new bike lanes on Garscube rd.

 

 

 

[Auld Jag]

I remember a few years back we had Firhill sponsored, Energy check stadium at Firhill IIRC. Morton seem to have got a fair sum by having a sponsor for their ground. Is this a road we could go down again ?

[West of Scotland]

Facts need to be faced, Firhill is an absolute riot and actively drives potential attendees away. The Jackie Husband stand is decrepit, never mind the Main stand. Just check out the toilets for fecks' sake.

A forward-thinking person/board would have looked into buying up some Clyde riverside property in the vicinity of the Kelvin twenty years ago, when it was worthless. Unfortunately it's too late now but the opportunity to be part of an area of the city that's only going to grow in value and population over the next generation with a new bridge and transport links into the city centre would have guaranteed new fans attracted to a stadium that has 21st Century amenities and not 19th.

Sadly, yet appropriately, the club is stuck forever with a decrepit and decaying stadium already hemmed in on every side, redevelopment an impossibility. Hopefully the next lottery winner will invest where it matters and not in fantasy training grounds.

[buchanio]

We missed the boat with the bing last time in premiership it we did not own it then so hypothetical. The best hope commercially is to maximise old firm and hearts dollar like clubs like Motherwell and give them a decent allocation that does not piss everyone off. This is not attractive to me personally but brings in cash and we don’t sink or swim on these results anyway. Converting the bing into a safe standing lightweight stand would take 2000+. We would need a sustained period in top flight to cover it however. And to add a decent digital screen not that stupid scoreboard that’s the most pointless addition to the ground in modern times.

[G13 jag]

31 minutes ago, buchanio said:

We missed the boat with the bing last time in premiership it we did not own it then so hypothetical. The best hope commercially is to maximise old firm and hearts dollar like clubs like Motherwell and give them a decent allocation that does not piss everyone off. This is not attractive to me personally but brings in cash and we don’t sink or swim on these results anyway. Converting the bing into a safe standing lightweight stand would take 2000+. We would need a sustained period in top flight to cover it however. And to add a decent digital screen not that stupid scoreboard that’s the most pointless addition to the ground in modern times.

The best way to ensure sustainability for thistle is to increase our own fan base.  I like the way St Mirren have restricted the OF numbers, and this has not only encouraged more of their own fans to go to those games, but it has helped with results.  
we are seeing the results of the kids go free initiative, and the work jags for good do will hopefully ensure we have new fans coming to games.  

[Lenziejag]

20 minutes ago, G13 jag said:

The best way to ensure sustainability for thistle is to increase our own fan base.  I like the way St Mirren have restricted the OF numbers, and this has not only encouraged more of their own fans to go to those games, but it has helped with results.  
we are seeing the results of the kids go free initiative, and the work jags for good do will hopefully ensure we have new fans coming to games.  

This is more than likely a problem for another season. Although, if we do happen to draw either in the cups at Firhill, and our fans are turning out like they have done in the past couple of months, they can be restricted to the Colin Weir Stand.