Lenziejag Posted August 20, 2017 Report Share Posted August 20, 2017 Unfortunately, until the SPFL change their policy of replacing the relegated clubs fixtures with the promoted club we are always going to have a tough start. The only changes from last season is Hibs away instead of ICT home and the Celtic game moved. We just need to be patient until September, when we start playing teams expected to be in bottom 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted August 20, 2017 Report Share Posted August 20, 2017 Just three games into the season and it might be worth putting some money on St Johnstone, despite their turgid, dull football, qualifying for Europe yet again: nine points on board, thank you. Jags: null points on board. Anybody think we might overtake them in the league? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rid Skwerr Posted August 20, 2017 Report Share Posted August 20, 2017 (edited) Is it time to bench Mr "too cool for school" Barton? He has some wonderful touches and turns, and can play a pass, but he is so slow to move forward that he seems to me to kill off most attacks before they get started. We have a pair/trio of dependable centre backs and a classy goalkeeper, so maybe we should go with a less defensive-minded mid-field setup and see how that goes. Edited August 20, 2017 by Rid Skwerr 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted August 20, 2017 Report Share Posted August 20, 2017 Is it time to bench Mr "to cool for school" Barton? He has some wonderful touches and turns, and can play a pass, but he is so slow to move forward that he seems to me to kill off most attacks before they get started. We have a pair/trio of dependable centre backs and a classy goalkeeper, so maybe we should go with a less defensive-minded mid-field setup and see how that goes. I don't think we're far away and Archie will probably stick with the 4-2-3-1 but I agree any negative play stems from central midfield. Yesterday Osman and Barton often left too much distance between themselves and Edwards. That problem would've been less likely if a fully fit Bannigan or Welsh from last season was in midfield replacing Barton or Abdul. Put another way one of the back two midfielders should be more of a box to box player, which is more or less what you're saying in your last sentence. Our 4-2-3-1 formation is (more correctly, should be) a more attacking option than playing two up. That said if Booth is going to be out for a while then we might have to change. I've no idea how effective Milan is going forward. A problem still to arise, not totally unrelated, will be starting Spittal. One of Lawless, Erskine or Doolan will have to be benched as we'll certainly need the pace of Storey. Won't be much of a problem assuming Storey can play a number of positions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angry gaz Posted August 20, 2017 Report Share Posted August 20, 2017 (edited) Is it time to bench Mr "to cool for school" Barton? How about just giving him a severe boot in the baws instead? He's getting caught countless times on the ball at the moment but he does add a range of passes and vision that we don't have in anyone else. The problem for me at the moment is that the midfield isn't functioning in terms of balance or fitness.. Edited August 20, 2017 by angry gaz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Passenger Posted August 20, 2017 Report Share Posted August 20, 2017 Is it time to bench Mr "to cool for school" Barton? Yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paukea Posted August 20, 2017 Report Share Posted August 20, 2017 I am going to suggest something which I will probably get lambasted for but a forum is all about opinions I suppose..Drop Lawless and Erskine and play Storey and Spittal and also bin day dreamer Barton for Bannigan..I think Lawless and Erskine need to know they are not first names on team sheet anymore and I bet it will improve them both...Lawless gave away the ball everytime he got it yesterday and I honestly think he's a weak link..he has moments of sheer brilliance but totally inconsistent and gets bullied in my opinion..change system to 4-1-3-2 and play Sammom and Doolan up front 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knightswood Jag Posted August 20, 2017 Author Report Share Posted August 20, 2017 I am going to suggest something which I will probably get lambasted for but a forum is all about opinions I suppose..Drop Lawless and Erskine and play Storey and Spittal and also bin day dreamer Barton for Bannigan..I think Lawless and Erskine need to know they are not first names on team sheet anymore and I bet it will improve them both...Lawless gave away the ball everytime he got it yesterday and I honestly think he's a weak link..he has moments of sheer brilliance but totally inconsistent and gets bullied in my opinion..change system to 4-1-3-2 and play Sammom and Doolan up front So... Cerny Nitriansky Keown Turnbull Elliott Osman Spittal Bannigan Storey Sammon Doolan ??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted August 20, 2017 Report Share Posted August 20, 2017 I am going to suggest something which I will probably get lambasted for but a forum is all about opinions I suppose..Drop Lawless and Erskine and play Storey and Spittal and also bin day dreamer Barton for Bannigan..I think Lawless and Erskine need to know they are not first names on team sheet anymore and I bet it will improve them both...Lawless gave away the ball everytime he got it yesterday and I honestly think he's a weak link..he has moments of sheer brilliance but totally inconsistent and gets bullied in my opinion..change system to 4-1-3-2 and play Sammom and Doolan up front Don't see why you should get lambasted for all logical suggestions. Re Wee Stevie he's wasted playing out left. I can only go on seeing Spittal play wide right where he's done well. So yes, maybe bench Stevie if we couldn't play him in his favoured role behind the striker (where Erskine is usually preferred) or wide right (where Spittal is likely to be first choice). Bannigan would effectively play in the position Barton should be playing in, so it's kinda academic whether you consider that as one or two deep midfielders. Banzo won't be played in an advanced role but it's more likely he'd take the ball forward and be considerably more positive than Barton has been of late. Re your system, I'd question the value of playing a narrow formation but that's more a case of tweaking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paukea Posted August 20, 2017 Report Share Posted August 20, 2017 Don't see why you should get lambasted for all logical suggestions. Re Wee Stevie he's wasted playing out left. I can only go on seeing Spittal play wide right where he's done well. So yes, maybe bench Stevie if we couldn't play him in his favoured role behind the striker (where Erskine is usually preferred) or wide right (where Spittal is likely to be first choice). Bannigan would effectively play in the position Barton should be playing in, so it's kinda academic whether you consider that as one or two deep midfielders. Banzo won't be played in an advanced role but it's more likely he'd take the ball forward and be considerably more positive than Barton has been of late. Re your system, I'd question the value of playing a narrow formation but that's more a case of tweaking. Even though he's in the middle of the three I see him dropping deep to pick up the ball to make things happen as Bannigan does best..The post before you also mentioned Nitrianski instead of booth I would go with that as well to be fair as he looked decent yesterday and his distribution was excellent..Just a though to be fair but I don't think we are getting enough from Lawless and Erskine but it is very early I suppose Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eljaggo Posted August 20, 2017 Report Share Posted August 20, 2017 You should go up to training and offer your support. Its going to be a busy training ground, since I presume you are implying that anyone on here who suggests a team for the next game will want to avail themselves of the opportunity to put in their tuppenceworth. I see no difference in questioning the manager's tactical abilitites than in questioning his team selection. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney Rubble Posted August 20, 2017 Report Share Posted August 20, 2017 I am going to suggest something which I will probably get lambasted for but a forum is all about opinions I suppose..Drop Lawless and Erskine and play Storey and Spittal and also bin day dreamer Barton for Bannigan..I think Lawless and Erskine need to know they are not first names on team sheet anymore and I bet it will improve them both...Lawless gave away the ball everytime he got it yesterday and I honestly think he's a weak link..he has moments of sheer brilliance but totally inconsistent and gets bullied in my opinion..change system to 4-1-3-2 and play Sammom and Doolan up front Now that's the beauty of opinions. Without Stevie Lawless we lose fluency in the team - he's the water carrier between the midfield and the attack and he does a power of work that mostly goes unnoticed. We seem unbalanced when he isn't there. No surprise to me that yesterday we ended up with Dools, Sammon, Storey and Erskine in the latter part of the game and nothing to link midfield and attack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandy Posted August 20, 2017 Report Share Posted August 20, 2017 I think I agree Barney - we need Lawless & Erskine in the pitch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney Rubble Posted August 20, 2017 Report Share Posted August 20, 2017 I take it you watched the game yesterday PT ? , until Doolan came on we were totally ineffective , with Erskine , Lawless etc watching long balls getting lumped over their heads and put into channels. Cerny was kicking everything from hand, I know there are lots of different ways to win games but with the players we've got that wasn't it. Of course we needed back up to Doolan as we couldn't go all season with one striker and one untried striker in Kevin Nesbitt but why does our top goal scorer as always gets dumped on the bench as soon as someone new is signed( Lyle Taylor, Azeez, Pogba and now Storey) Surely if you want to accommodate Sammon for his strength in the air or Storey for his pace you play Doolan alongside them. Doolan will prove yet again this season that he is our best bet for scoring goals ,in my opinion Sammon and Storey should be used to enhance Doolan's goal scoring record and give us a better chance to win games. What did Ryan Stevenson do to be omitted from your otherwise comprehensive list? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlsarmy Posted August 20, 2017 Report Share Posted August 20, 2017 What did Ryan Stevenson do to be omitted from your otherwise comprehensive list? Same as he did when he played for us ....... nothing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney Rubble Posted August 20, 2017 Report Share Posted August 20, 2017 Same as he did when he played for us ....... nothing Oooh you're a harsh man, JLS. Thought Ryan had a fairly tidy half season for us after Archie finally realised he was never a lone striker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thru thin and thin Posted August 20, 2017 Report Share Posted August 20, 2017 Lawless is normally, all sugar or all keech! And he frustrates the hell out of me by being so one footed! He is not alone! Erskine put a peach of a pass onto his right peg running into the box in the first half and rather than pull the trigger, he opted to attempt to try and get the ball onto his good foot. Goal scoring opportunity gone! Admittedly he can be an important player, but pound for pound, Edwards gives the team more! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Col Posted August 20, 2017 Report Share Posted August 20, 2017 In your opinion, what does Edwards bring to the team, other than running about and looking busy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jags on tour Posted August 21, 2017 Report Share Posted August 21, 2017 In your opinion, what does Edwards bring to the team, other than running about and looking busy? Sheer handsomeness. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted August 21, 2017 Report Share Posted August 21, 2017 The selection of striker(s) is not the issue in my opinion. The problem stems from the midfield, and the defence minded approach to the team's set-up, which leads to an overly slow build-up and lack of a decent supply to the strikers. My recollection of the times when we have been exciting to watch (and successful) is when we have had attacking wing backs who by-pass our turgid central midfield. The squad, as has been poined out, is probably the strongest we have had for a long time, but unless a more attack minded approach is taken, then we will always be on the back foot, and struggle to remain in the top league. Now is the time for some boldness in selection and tactics - leaving until later in the season will give too many hostages to fortune. Archie agrees that the build-up was too slow and there was not enough supply to the strikers. Hopefully that will be remedied very soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eljaggo Posted August 21, 2017 Report Share Posted August 21, 2017 Why not now? He has the squad, why say soon? What does soon mean? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watties wallies Posted August 21, 2017 Report Share Posted August 21, 2017 memo to Archie be soon I say be soon best wishes Dame Hylda Baker 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fearchar Posted August 21, 2017 Report Share Posted August 21, 2017 It seemed to me that the many throw-ins we had almost all ended up giving possession to St Johnstone. Since the latter's long ball game encourages putting the ball out of touch, that did us no favours. Is that habitual weakness returning? As others have mentioned, the slow midfield combination of Osman and Barton contributed greatly to the result; I would have preferred to see Osman (and Lawless) hooked and Bannigan put on the park to give a more attacking profile to midfield - not to mention a quicker retreat to defence where necessary. The goal was scored after a St Johnstone player was allowed a clear run towards goal without any challenge in midfield. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted August 21, 2017 Report Share Posted August 21, 2017 Why not now? He has the squad, why say soon? What does soon mean? Next game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fearchar Posted August 21, 2017 Report Share Posted August 21, 2017 ...he does a power of work that mostly goes unnoticed... Presumably that's because he is one of those players that, dressed in RED and YELLOW on a GREEN pitch, manage to "hide". Fortunately, others make sure that they don't hide, though goodness knows where they would even if they wanted to! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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