Third Lanark Posted October 5, 2023 Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 15 minutes ago, Garscube Road End 2 said: The club now have a new investor. David McLymont and others to the tune of £5000,000 . Good news. As a result of this PTFC Trust holding is diluted from 75% to 67%. Excellent news - can i be greedy and ask that some of this investment is used to towards new deals for Jack McMillan, stevie Lawless Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted October 5, 2023 Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 I've read the TJF e mail and this new investment appears both satisfactory and most welcome. In any case my idea of fan ownership has always been along the lines of the "German model", so I should be pleased to see minority investment. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted October 5, 2023 Author Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 Just now, lady-isobel-barnett said: I've read the TJF e mail and this new investment appears both satisfactory and most welcome. In any case my idea of fan ownership has always been along the lines of the "German model", so I should be pleased to see minority investment. As long as you’re happy they get a veto on certain decisions …. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garscube Road End 2 Posted October 5, 2023 Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 15 minutes ago, QXBoy said: Please clarify - 5 thousand or 5 million? Oops! £500,000. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted October 5, 2023 Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 (edited) 21 minutes ago, javeajag said: As long as you’re happy they get a veto on certain decisions …. Well that's why I phrased it "should be pleased". Looking from any outside investors point of view I suppose they're bound to (or wise to) want some control of their investment. The proof of the pudding is of course what "certain decisions" they hold a veto on. Off the top of my head I can think of a good few "certain decisions" that would've no or very minimal affect to concern us. I would presume for instance they wouldn't want further investment from a company with rival intent. As sure as likely they won't want to see their investment used to the extent we run down our reserves to an alarming extent.. Guess all this will largely remain conjecture on our part as confidentiality will no doubt play a big part in all this. Edited October 5, 2023 by lady-isobel-barnett Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordanhill Jag Posted October 5, 2023 Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 26 minutes ago, javeajag said: And you should add in: get seats on the board get a veto on certain decisions get their money back first And No Guarantee that Tranche 2 is for another 10% of the Shares - if we need the Cash - they could demand a larger % for the second half on the Money - and lets not forget the 10% of the Weirs Shares that are "out there somewhere " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandy Posted October 5, 2023 Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 Still no comment from TJF on the ousting of the Club Chairman. The email today focuses exclusively on the new investment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted October 5, 2023 Author Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 3 minutes ago, lady-isobel-barnett said: Well that's why I phrased it "should be pleased". Looking from any outside investors point of view I suppose they're bound to (or wise to) want some control of their investment. The proof of the pudding is of course what "certain decisions" they hold a veto on. Off the top of my head I can think of a good few "certain decisions" that would've no or very minimal affect to concern us. I would presume for instance they wouldn't want further investment from a company with rival intent. As sure as likely they won't want to see their investment used to the extent we run down our reserves to an alarming extent.. Guess all this will largely remain conjecture on our part as confidentiality will no doubt play a big part in all this. My main point would be this general approach, the dilution of fan ownership below 75% and potentially reducing the fan shareholding to 51% and adopting the German model has never actually been discussed with the fans who apparently own the club……yes I know it’s never possible to do so …..funny that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted October 5, 2023 Author Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 1 minute ago, sandy said: Still no comment from TJF on the ousting of the Club Chairman. The email today focuses exclusively on the new investment. Apparently rumour goes he was against the proposal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted October 5, 2023 Author Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 I have sent this email to the TJF, if fan ownership means anything in reality this proposal should have been consulted on. Ok guys…..I’m just registering my disapproval at today’s announcement. This has nothing to do with the ‘what’ but the ‘ how’. To reduce the overall fan shareholding, to accept a veto on certain decisions from 3 people, to signal fan ownership may go down to 51% and to say we are now in favour of the German Model are significant changes of strategy and approach. And news to me and probably everybody else. If they are not issues fans should be engaged and canvassed on then pretty much nothing is, and maybe that’s where we are heading. It has now become a pattern of behaviour that there is always a reason ( or excuse ) why fans can’t be consulted or involved about issues. This is extremely concerning. Personally as a shareholder, Trust member and TJF member I don’t feel any more involved in the running of the club than under Jacqui Lowe and that should be a red light for everyone ! 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lenziejag Posted October 5, 2023 Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 1 hour ago, javeajag said: My main point would be this general approach, the dilution of fan ownership below 75% and potentially reducing the fan shareholding to 51% and adopting the German model has never actually been discussed with the fans who apparently own the club……yes I know it’s never possible to do so …..funny that In principle, I am not against it, but it is probably the most important thing that should get the agreement of the majority of the fan ownership group. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiThistle Posted October 5, 2023 Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 My reading is that this was an anomaly that was time-sensitive, and the benefit of circumventing the fans was outweighed by the benefit of the investment. As shareholders, we probably should file this one under “times the fans weren’t consulted” and keep tabs on the frequency of any future instances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Col Posted October 5, 2023 Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 And to think that those of us who warned about going down the road of fan ownership were openly mocked. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yellow & Redneck Posted October 5, 2023 Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 Communication and transparency from the entire board has been utterly crap. No material difference from previous boards. Other than some Programme Notes, there has been little to no upfront communication about the current state of club finances, and what the next 12-18months is actually going to look like. Always been very sceptical about fan ownership (since most of our fans are utter zoomers...including me), and my worries certainly have not be alleviated. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yellow & Redneck Posted October 5, 2023 Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 31 minutes ago, Big Col said: And to think that those of us who warned about going down the road of fan ownership were openly mocked. Absolutely! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenski Posted October 5, 2023 Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 I don't see the connection? Has fan ownership now failed because of board changes and new investment? Did anyone expect it to be plain sailing from day one? I didn't. IMO it will take time. Everyone actively involved and passively looking on, is developing understanding of what mature fan ownership means. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fawlty Towers Posted October 5, 2023 Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 Looks from this that we are in for a period of "he said, she said" https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=7444376185590033&set=p.7444376185590033&type=3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted October 5, 2023 Author Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 6 minutes ago, Fawlty Towers said: Looks from this that we are in for a period of "he said, she said" https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=7444376185590033&set=p.7444376185590033&type=3 He is right to say the fans as ultimate owners of the club should be presented with the facts. what a shambles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mulguy jag Posted October 5, 2023 Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 21 minutes ago, javeajag said: He is right to say the fans as ultimate owners of the club should be presented with the facts. what a shambles. Alistair Creevy has also stated on Facebook that a £500000 investment was refused by the board and no reason given. The offer from McClymont and two other investors will total £1million with a fresh injection to follow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dl1971 Posted October 5, 2023 Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 51 minutes ago, Fawlty Towers said: Looks from this that we are in for a period of "he said, she said" https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=7444376185590033&set=p.7444376185590033&type=3 Sounds like an unholy mess. Boardroom shenanigans of the highest order it appears. Ultimately not clear why mccreevy was removed, but I guess we'll get the truth very soon. Clearly TJF seem pleased with the investment and I can only hope for the right reasons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laukat Posted October 5, 2023 Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 TJF statement is not really commentating on Alistair Creevy leaving and is really only welcoming extra funding. Leaves the impression that the Trust are running the show and TJF are still just observing or reacting to the Trust's decisions I've lost sight of who's running the Trust these days but it has the feeling that some on the Trust were happy to throw Alister under the bus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CotterJag Posted October 5, 2023 Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 I see they are Thistle fans and are probably doing what I'd do if I won the lottery. The exception being that I wouldn't want any shares but I understand theirs is a business proposition for the team they support. How will they benefit from the shares? Will they receive financial recompense or will they get a say in the boardroom? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted October 5, 2023 Author Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 2 minutes ago, CotterJag said: I see they are Thistle fans and are probably doing what I'd do if I won the lottery. The exception being that I wouldn't want any shares but I understand theirs is a business proposition for the team they support. How will they benefit from the shares? Will they receive financial recompense or will they get a say in the boardroom? They get 10% of the clubs shares as preference shares, they seats on the board, the get a veto in some some decisions and if we have £2m in the bank they can start to get their money back. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fawlty Towers Posted October 5, 2023 Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 5 hours ago, lady-isobel-barnett said: I've read the TJF e mail and this new investment appears both satisfactory and most welcome. In any case my idea of fan ownership has always been along the lines of the "German model", so I should be pleased to see minority investment. You are a better person than me then as when someone says "German model" I am thinking about Claudia Schiffer not the ownership of a football club! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted October 5, 2023 Author Report Share Posted October 5, 2023 Alister Creevy on Facebook Stevie Hollinsworth Steve the truth will come out and happy to answer any questions The board and trustees are culpable and need to be held to account Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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