Hearts Viaplay Cup - Sunday 20 August

[dl1971]

2 hours ago, laukat said:

I've often wondered how Bannigan's role in the team would be described when identifying a replacement. If we were recruiting for a normal job and looked to advertise the post would it look like the following?

'Partick Thistle have an exciting job opportunity to be a Scottish Championship professional footballer.

The role is a custom midfield role. We expect you not to be strong enough defensively to play as a traditional 6 nor do we expect you to be able to run beyond the opposition defence into their 18 yard box and play as an "8" .We also have no expectations of even a smidgen of creativity that would make you remotely able to play as a "10". We do expect you to run a lot, we need you to pick up the ball and break forward into promising attacking positions and then pick the safest pass possible.

We don't expect you to tackle and when you do we fully expect you will pick up a yellow card and the occasional red . We don't need the successful applicant to provide many goals or assists with the previous post holder contributed 1 goal and 6 assists in the previous 2 championship seasons.

The post offers an attractive salary and the long term security of a 2 year contract. There is also a testimonial season after 10 years seasons even if some of those seasons you are injured and unable to play'

 

So you would have not counted the years he was out injured with regard to a testimonial? Why not go further and not pay him while injured. 

[Lenziejag]

7 minutes ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

Because he is a "Thistle Legend" ?   

He has been a legend for 10 years ? That’s ridiculous.

[Lenziejag]

11 minutes ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

The sacking of McCall & his Two assistants was nothing to do with Cost Saving - they were paid there Contracts 

Whilst I get the Football Bit - to make sacking the Manager a priority over dealing with the Finances is shall we say odd - to rush back from Ibrox to do so - smacks of people with an agenda 

How do you know what they were paid ? Were you copied in all the correspondence ? 

[Fawlty Towers]

I have stayed away from posting on this thread but am starting to get rather annoyed now. The only saving grace is that a couple of wins will see the main protagonsist(s) disappear like snow off a dyke.

[ChiThistle]

Doom and gloom are our business, and business is booming!  😝

[Jordanhill Jag]

1 hour ago, Lenziejag said:

How do you know what they were paid ? Were you copied in all the correspondence ? 

I was told they were paid - and the Club obviously have to Honour there Contracts 

   

[Jordanhill Jag]

1 hour ago, Fawlty Towers said:

I have stayed away from posting on this thread but am starting to get rather annoyed now. The only saving grace is that a couple of wins will see the main protagonsist(s) disappear like snow off a dyke.

Why are you "annoyed" ? are we not allowed to discuss things at the Club on a Fans Forum - by all means disagree - but to be "annoyed" ? 

Have we all to fall into line with Four Legs Good Two Legs Bad ?  

[Jordanhill Jag]

2 hours ago, Lenziejag said:

He has been a legend for 10 years ? That’s ridiculous.

I honestly have no idea how he has continued to get Contracts for 10 Years - and then get a Contract for another Two Years 

I was being sarcastic ref the "Club Legend" - he has been at Thistle for 10 Years - thats it 

We kept him and got rid of Sean Welsh - No idea why 

[Lenziejag]

5 minutes ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

I honestly have no idea how he has continued to get Contracts for 10 Years - and then get a Contract for another Two Years 

I was being sarcastic ref the "Club Legend" - he has been at Thistle for 10 Years - thats it 

We kept him and got rid of Sean Welsh - No idea why 

That’s the thing, though. Probably 6 Thistle managers, not to mention one Aberdeen one, thought he was good enough to get contracts. 

[Fawlty Towers]

16 minutes ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

Why are you "annoyed" ? are we not allowed to discuss things at the Club on a Fans Forum - by all means disagree - but to be "annoyed" ? 

Have we all to fall into line with Four Legs Good Two Legs Bad ?  

My final contribution to this topic.

My annoyance comes from an individual arguing against himself - ruthlessness is required but not when it involves my pal but at the same time I am against cosiness and "jobs for the boys".

Stating the board had an agenda to sack McCall above sorting out the club's finances when they could have sacked him if that was their agenda as soon as they took over. The board having reviewed the finances telling McCall there were no funds available in January and only being able to extend Hodson's loan thanks to TJF. You yourself stating that it was the Chairman who put money in to pay wages - I would say these could be classed as dealing with finances.

Also, I have never said people should not be allowed to discuss things on here.

[Jordanhill Jag]

36 minutes ago, Lenziejag said:

That’s the thing, though. Probably 6 Thistle managers, not to mention one Aberdeen one, thought he was good enough to get contracts. 

And Clubs keep giving Caldwell a Managers Job - as the Late Jimmy Greaves would say " its a funny old game" 

When people at a Club become part of the Furniture - sometimes its difficult for New Managers to make change is my only thought   

[Third Lanark]

5 hours ago, Yellow & Redneck said:

Would the post holder be expected to score penalties? 

Hopefully an open goal like he missed at Dingwall 

[Jordanhill Jag]

15 minutes ago, Fawlty Towers said:

My final contribution to this topic.

My annoyance comes from an individual arguing against himself - ruthlessness is required but not when it involves my pal but at the same time I am against cosiness and "jobs for the boys".

Stating the board had an agenda to sack McCall above sorting out the club's finances when they could have sacked him if that was their agenda as soon as they took over. The board having reviewed the finances telling McCall there were no funds available in January and only being able to extend Hodson's loan thanks to TJF. You yourself stating that it was the Chairman who put money in to pay wages - I would say these could be classed as dealing with finances.

Also, I have never said people should not be allowed to discuss things on here.

Actually Im pointing out that the Club has double standards ref "ruthlessness " - we knew we had a £600K Black Hole at Xmas - any Club would have had wide ranging cost cuts across the board - we did not - so where you would expect "ruthlessness" to stay afloat - there was zero ?   

By luck we got Rangers in the Cup - rather than cutting costs to stay afloat as we still had a £300K shortfall  - we instead decided to dabble in "Football Stuff " - I have no issue with Managers being sacked - its Football - but the timing & prioritizing this over the finances was frankly ridiculous - the rushing back from Ibrox Directors Box to do it that night - why ? Dont you not think it odd behavior ? 

Not prioritizing the Finances & rushing back from Ibrox - seriously ? 

The Chairman putting cash in came after McCall was sacked when the Rangers Money ran out 

So Yes - I will question those involved - and Yes I will be looking for the same "ruthlessness " if we find ourselves out of contention by Xmas by three points 

Otherwise the logical conclusion was that McCall was sacked because he wasn't liked - and if that was the case then thats a major issue - you dont let personality get involved in decisions regards the Club 

[Third Lanark]

1 hour ago, Lenziejag said:

That’s the thing, though. Probably 6 Thistle managers, not to mention one Aberdeen one, thought he was good enough to get contracts. 

And those Thistle managers are all still here?  We’re some of them not sacked?

Maybe Bannigan was not as good as they thought 

[dl1971]

14 minutes ago, Third Lanark said:

And those Thistle managers are all still here?  We’re some of them not sacked?

Maybe Bannigan was not as good as they thought 

I'd suggest that the 6 thistle managers in question have a better idea of what constitutes a good player, rather than your good self. I will stand corrected if you are in fact Pep Guardiola. 

[CotterJag]

Feels like a win win situation for some.

Join in the fun if we win and get to be proved right if we lose.

There's probably a grain of truth in what most of you / us say but I listen to us in the same way I do pundits, with caution and for some entertainment.

 

[Lambies Lost Doo]

McCall was sacked by a board who have now all left the building.  So rightly or wrongly him leaving we are basically arguing amongst ourselves.  No one remains to be accountable for the decision.

I also don't think we should call out board members of TJF on here.  We have

1. A TJF board

2. A club board

Owned by the fans but not run exclusively by the fans partly to stop emotional decisions impacting club running.

[jlsarmy]

2 hours ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

Actually Im pointing out that the Club has double standards ref "ruthlessness " - we knew we had a £600K Black Hole at Xmas - any Club would have had wide ranging cost cuts across the board - we did not - so where you would expect "ruthlessness" to stay afloat - there was zero ?   

By luck we got Rangers in the Cup - rather than cutting costs to stay afloat as we still had a £300K shortfall  - we instead decided to dabble in "Football Stuff " - I have no issue with Managers being sacked - its Football - but the timing & prioritizing this over the finances was frankly ridiculous - the rushing back from Ibrox Directors Box to do it that night - why ? Dont you not think it odd behavior ? 

Not prioritizing the Finances & rushing back from Ibrox - seriously ? 

The Chairman putting cash in came after McCall was sacked when the Rangers Money ran out 

So Yes - I will question those involved - and Yes I will be looking for the same "ruthlessness " if we find ourselves out of contention by Xmas by three points 

Otherwise the logical conclusion was that McCall was sacked because he wasn't liked - and if that was the case then thats a major issue - you dont let personality get involved in decisions regards the Club 

JJ , I agree the timing was wrong , the decision was right.

McCall had 3 years to build something at the Club and didn’t 

I hope we offer Kris Doolan the same to build our Club even though Kris is not your friend .

Hopefully the youngsters like Stanway , McKenzie, Lyon develop through good coaching and first team football.

Would this have happened under Ian McCall ? 
i’m not so sure 

[Jordanhill Jag]

17 minutes ago, jlsarmy said:

JJ , I agree the timing was wrong , the decision was right.

McCall had 3 years to build something at the Club and didn’t 

I hope we offer Kris Doolan the same to build our Club even though Kris is not your friend .

Hopefully the youngsters like Stanway , McKenzie, Lyon develop through good coaching and first team football.

Would this have happened under Ian McCall ? 
i’m not so sure 

I have no issue with Football Decisions 

McCalls strength is in spotting a player and his contacts - if we had cut a deal he moved into this sort of role -I think he would have said Yes ( we are paying him for 12 Months -so we got something in return ) but certain people wanted him gone from the Club 

The desperation to rush back from Ibrox -in my opinion showed it was more than just Football-  which demeans the Club reputation in Football - anyone involved should be out on there arse ( in my opinion ) 

 

 

 

[Jordanhill Jag]

35 minutes ago, Lambies Lost Doo said:

McCall was sacked by a board who have now all left the building.  So rightly or wrongly him leaving we are basically arguing amongst ourselves.  No one remains to be accountable for the decision.

I also don't think we should call out board members of TJF on here.  We have

1. A TJF board

2. A club board

Owned by the fans but not run exclusively by the fans partly to stop emotional decisions impacting club running.

No they have not - so in my view anyone involved with the “ rush from Ibrox “ - should be gone 

[javeajag]

21 minutes ago, jlsarmy said:

JJ , I agree the timing was wrong , the decision was right.

McCall had 3 years to build something at the Club and didn’t 

I hope we offer Kris Doolan the same to build our Club even though Kris is not your friend .

Hopefully the youngsters like Stanway , McKenzie, Lyon develop through good coaching and first team football.

Would this have happened under Ian McCall ? 
i’m not so sure 

Im not sure you can compare the two … McCall came in when we were I free fall and got relegated , achieved promotion and had us in touch of the play off places.

Doolan took that forward and got us to the play off final ( and never much criticised for even though it was a disaster ) 

he has seen players leave and recruited as many but it’s a transition year so no matter what happens he gets a free pass ? 
 

No … if last season it was unacceptable not to be in the play off spot then the same applies this season 

[Jordanhill Jag]

1 minute ago, javeajag said:

Im not sure you can compare the two … McCall came in when we were I free fall and got relegated , achieved promotion and had us in touch of the play off places.

Doolan took that forward and got us to the play off final ( and never much criticised for even though it was a disaster ) 

he has seen players leave and recruited as many but it’s a transition year so no matter what happens he gets a free pass ? 
 

No … if last season it was unacceptable not to be in the play off spot then the same applies this season 

This 100% 

im now going to lie down having agreed with Javea Jag for the first time in History 

[Woodstock Jag]

The playing budget last season was already pre-committed by the time of the Rangers game. The transfer window had shut. In terms of money spent on the squad it was probably the second highest or highest in the league. I don't think it's unreasonable for a Club Board to expect results that deliver us a top 4 finish if that's what our playing budget is relative to the rest of the league.

It is reasonable to assume that this year's playing budget is (a) not as high as last year's and (b) premised on much more conservative and realistic assumptions about income and expenditure. This will in part be because of (c) the drastically reduced headroom on cashflow (caused by last year's losses) and (d) the knowledge that last year's original budgeting assumptions, which allowed a large playing budget to be committed, were a crock of shit.

If our budget is (say) the 5th highest in the league (I don't know if it is, but it would be a finger in the air guess) that comes with commensurately lower expectations about league performance.

Put another way, it is less reasonable to demand that a manager with the 5th largest budget in the league finishes in the top four than to demand it of a manager with the 2nd largest budget in the league.

[sabbath]

My Turn. 

I Said McCall should have been sacked after the comments he made after the Falkirk game. But in typical thistle style we waited until there was a mountain to climb before the penny dropped. I voiced doubts on Dools appointment after the one game, and it is little wonder that the best performance we had was without Bannigan. The squad we had last year was well good enough, if only we had had a proper manager. I give Bannigan pelters for not performing as he should in such a critical position. for at present its a waste of a shirt and akin to playing with ten men. Perhaps a real manager would further his career, because what he is doing in training is not being shown on the pitch, as i say for such a critical position its simply not good enough for this level of football.

I'm not convinced its truly Dools or Archibald back in a Tom Cruise mask, but nothing seems to change. The shutters open a few days before the season starts, we bring in players once the season begins and pray to John Lambie in the sky they hit the ground running, or they're half as good as the sales pitch from their agent. Crystal Palace went with a proven track record irrespective of his age. Perhaps this is the time we do the same and hunt for a proper manager. Sure was it not the Lambie him self who said "there is no room for sentiment in football"  

[Jag36]

1 hour ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

I have no issue with Football Decisions 

McCalls strength is in spotting a player and his contacts - if we had cut a deal he moved into this sort of role -I think he would have said Yes ( we are paying him for 12 Months -so we got something in return ) but certain people wanted him gone from the Club 

The desperation to rush back from Ibrox -in my opinion showed it was more than just Football-  which demeans the Club reputation in Football - anyone involved should be out on there arse ( in my opinion ) 

 

 

 

McCall would have been ideal as director of football/ head of recruitment. Probably still a possibility from McCalls point of view but don't see it happening

Doolan seems like he has loads of potential as a manger but his lack of experience is beginning to show