January Transfer Window

[Jimmy McD]

5 hours ago, Fawlty Towers said:

Brian Graham signs a contract extension:

https://ptfc.co.uk/ptfc-news/brian-graham-signs-contract-extension-until-2026/

Great Christmas present for us Jags fan's... Santa is real...

[exiledjag]

Great news about  Graham's contract extension. I particularly like the references to developing his role in coaching and continuing his work with the Ladies team. These references suggest that the decision makers in the Club see a long term role for him at PTFC beyond his playing days.

On the wider front Doolan's comment abouts planning being well advanced for the January transfer window is encouraging.

I wonder if Turner and/or Tiffoney would be loan targets as neither are setting the heather on fire at Ross County and Dundee. However would we want them back?

[CotterJag]

20 minutes ago, exiledjag said:

Great news about  Graham's contract extension. I particularly like the references to developing his role in coaching and continuing his work with the Ladies team. These references suggest that the decision makers in the Club see a long term role for him at PTFC beyond his playing days.

On the wider front Doolan's comment abouts planning being well advanced for the January transfer window is encouraging.

I wonder if Turner and/or Tiffoney would be loan targets as neither are setting the heather on fire at Ross County and Dundee. However would we want them back?

It's a tough one re. Turner and Tiffoney.

Whilst we shouldn't want to cut our noses off to spite our face, I wasn't happy with either of them last season towards the end.

If I recall correctly, both signed PCA's with their respective new clubs, at a time when we were clearly pushing for promotion and likely to play Ross County in Turners' case.

This lack of respect for Thistle impacted, I believe, Tiffs performances in particular and I think he struggled with the burden.

Their decisions may have cost us promotion, so I'd be in the camp of leave them where they are and look for a couple of other players.

The Dundee's are great at nicking our best players but I can't recall it working out too well for them.  

[Lenziejag]

26 minutes ago, exiledjag said:

Great news about  Graham's contract extension. I particularly like the references to developing his role in coaching and continuing his work with the Ladies team. These references suggest that the decision makers in the Club see a long term role for him at PTFC beyond his playing days.

On the wider front Doolan's comment abouts planning being well advanced for the January transfer window is encouraging.

I wonder if Turner and/or Tiffoney would be loan targets as neither are setting the heather on fire at Ross County and Dundee. However would we want them back?

It seems to me that both were influential in our success last season and both would be upgrades on our current squad. However, our main need is for somebody to be able to win the ball in midfield.

[lady-isobel-barnett]

15 minutes ago, CotterJag said:

It's a tough one re. Turner and Tiffoney.

Whilst we shouldn't want to cut our noses off to spite our face, I wasn't happy with either of them last season towards the end.

If I recall correctly, both signed PCA's with their respective new clubs, at a time when we were clearly pushing for promotion and likely to play Ross County in Turners' case.

This lack of respect for Thistle impacted, I believe, Tiffs performances in particular and I think he struggled with the burden.

Their decisions may have cost us promotion, so I'd be in the camp of leave them where they are and look for a couple of other players.

The Dundee's are great at nicking our best players but I can't recall it working out too well for them.  

As I understand it Tiffoney had signed a pre contract with Dundee sometime before the play offs. Turner on the other hand would've (could've) stayed had the £500K short term loan been in place a day or so earlier. As it was he turned down an offer on reduced terms after the play offs. 

Much as I like both Turner and Tiffoney I feel we'd be creating an overload in the midfield/attacking positions they play in. Always assuming defensive midfield is sorted we're then going to have one regular starter benched as it is. 

 

 

[Duke Gekantawa]

1 hour ago, CotterJag said:

It's a tough one re. Turner and Tiffoney.

Whilst we shouldn't want to cut our noses off to spite our face, I wasn't happy with either of them last season towards the end.

If I recall correctly, both signed PCA's with their respective new clubs, at a time when we were clearly pushing for promotion and likely to play Ross County in Turners' case.

This lack of respect for Thistle impacted, I believe, Tiffs performances in particular and I think he struggled with the burden.

Their decisions may have cost us promotion, so I'd be in the camp of leave them where they are and look for a couple of other players.

The Dundee's are great at nicking our best players but I can't recall it working out too well for them.  

Tiff always blew hot and cold. I really didn’t see any obvious lack of professionalism at the tail end of the season.

I remember in the recent L1 season it was an open secret when Williamson signed a pre-contract with Falkirk when it looked a shoo-in that they would win while we were starting to look wearily at the other end of the table. Still, when it came to the decider v. Falkirk (which if they had won, would have put them very much back in the mix), we started him- and it was he who put in the perfect cross to hand the opener to Rudden on a plate. Erskine was always professional after he’d signed for DU (Paton was injured for much of the tail end of that season. 

[Third Lanark]

2 hours ago, CotterJag said:

It's a tough one re. Turner and Tiffoney.

Whilst we shouldn't want to cut our noses off to spite our face, I wasn't happy with either of them last season towards the end.

If I recall correctly, both signed PCA's with their respective new clubs, at a time when we were clearly pushing for promotion and likely to play Ross County in Turners' case.

This lack of respect for Thistle impacted, I believe, Tiffs performances in particular and I think he struggled with the burden.

Their decisions may have cost us promotion, so I'd be in the camp of leave them where they are and look for a couple of other players.

The Dundee's are great at nicking our best players but I can't recall it working out too well for them.  

Absolute nonsense re Turner he only joined Ross County after they survived in the premier league and because they were able to offer him 3 times what we could afford and a chance to play in the premier league.  Honestly I thought you better than to listen to tittle tattle

While Tiffoney did sign a PCA he gave his all throughout the playoffs.  Again Dundee could afford far higher wages than us

As for your lack of respect comments ? Have a word with yourself.

Seriously neither have had nothing but kind words about Partick Thistle and had respect for the club which you would expect from them. If as expected Ashford signs then it will be in no small part to Tiffoney who has been recommending us.

we didn’t even sit down and offer them new contracts on less money I might add until it was far far too late.  Though we know now that the club had no money 

Shoukd we accuse Lawless, Erskine, Paton, Lindsay etc because they all left for more money.’

Edited December 26, 2023 by Third Lanark

[Third Lanark]

2 hours ago, exiledjag said:

Great news about  Graham's contract extension. I particularly like the references to developing his role in coaching and continuing his work with the Ladies team. These references suggest that the decision makers in the Club see a long term role for him at PTFC beyond his playing days.

On the wider front Doolan's comment abouts planning being well advanced for the January transfer window is encouraging.

I wonder if Turner and/or Tiffoney would be loan targets as neither are setting the heather on fire at Ross County and Dundee. However would we want them back?

We should be taking them back in a heartbeat if of course either is available 

[partickthedog]

50 minutes ago, Third Lanark said:

Absolute nonsense re Turner he only joined Ross County after they survived in the premier league and because they were able to offer him 3 times what we could afford and a chance to play in the premier league.  Honestly I thought you better than to listen to tittle tattle

While Tiffoney did sign a PCA he gave his all throughout the playoffs.  Again Dundee could afford far higher wages than us

As for your lack of respect comments ? Have a word with yourself.

Seriously neither have had nothing but kind words about Partick Thistle and had respect for the club which you would expect from them. If as expected Ashford signs then it will be in no small part to Tiffoney who has been recommending us.

we didn’t even sit down and offer them new contracts on less money I might add until it was far far too late.  Though we know now that the club had no money 

Shoukd we accuse Lawless, Erskine, Paton, Lindsay etc because they all left for more money.’

Who is Ashford? Am I missing a rumour somewhere? I am assuming that this is not Marcus R Ashford. He could perhaps do with a loan spell, though would not be a regular starter with Fitzy and Lawless being in good form.

[Lambies Lost Doo]

Football is a short career.  Every player has every right to go elsewhere and earn more money do they can provide for themselves and their family 

During the play off's Tiffoney and Turner gave their all.  Total professionals on the pitch.

[partickthedog]

2 hours ago, lady-isobel-barnett said:

As I understand it Tiffoney had signed a pre contract with Dundee sometime before the play offs. Turner on the other hand would've (could've) stayed had the £500K short term loan been in place a day or so earlier. As it was he turned down an offer on reduced terms after the play offs. 

Much as I like both Turner and Tiffoney I feel we'd be creating an overload in the midfield/attacking positions they play in. Always assuming defensive midfield is sorted we're then going to have one regular starter benched as it is. 

 

 

I suspect that this is an academic discussion. If not, while I agree that Turner would be an overload on existing options, I would tend to argue that Tiffoney would be a huge asset in giving us 3 effective attacking wide player possibilities. Currently if either Fitzy or Lawless is injured, suspended, off form or tiring during a game, there is no effective replacement (apart from a formation change or involving players like Zander Mackenzie who have slightly different qualities). Wes MacDonald should have been that person, but it looks like he has not risen to the required expectation level.

You could imagine Fitzy, Lawless and Tiff fighting for 2 of 3 places and whoever was left out, especially if it were Fitzy or Tiff, coming on after an hour and terrorising the opposition defence, and perhaps giving us a genuine attacking threat if camped in defending a lead in the latter stages. Of course the 1 out of the 3 not starting wide would also be a serious competitor for the Number 10 role (where admittedly we do have other options, but none with Tiff or Fitzy's pace). 

[Third Lanark]

48 minutes ago, partickthedog said:

Who is Ashford? Am I missing a rumour somewhere? I am assuming that this is not Marcus R Ashford. He could perhaps do with a loan spell, though would not be a regular starter with Fitzy and Lawless being in good form.

Sorry mate Lee Ashcroft 😉

[Lenziejag]

1 hour ago, partickthedog said:

I suspect that this is an academic discussion. If not, while I agree that Turner would be an overload on existing options, I would tend to argue that Tiffoney would be a huge asset in giving us 3 effective attacking wide player possibilities. Currently if either Fitzy or Lawless is injured, suspended, off form or tiring during a game, there is no effective replacement (apart from a formation change or involving players like Zander Mackenzie who have slightly different qualities). Wes MacDonald should have been that person, but it looks like he has not risen to the required expectation level.

You could imagine Fitzy, Lawless and Tiff fighting for 2 of 3 places and whoever was left out, especially if it were Fitzy or Tiff, coming on after an hour and terrorising the opposition defence, and perhaps giving us a genuine attacking threat if camped in defending a lead in the latter stages. Of course the 1 out of the 3 not starting wide would also be a serious competitor for the Number 10 role (where admittedly we do have other options, but none with Tiff or Fitzy's pace). 

I might be mistaken, but I am sure all 3(Fitzpatrick, Tiffoney and Lawless) were starting at the end of the season. Turner would also be a cert to start.

[CotterJag]

4 hours ago, Third Lanark said:

Absolute nonsense re Turner he only joined Ross County after they survived in the premier league and because they were able to offer him 3 times what we could afford and a chance to play in the premier league.  Honestly I thought you better than to listen to tittle tattle

While Tiffoney did sign a PCA he gave his all throughout the playoffs.  Again Dundee could afford far higher wages than us

As for your lack of respect comments ? Have a word with yourself.

Seriously neither have had nothing but kind words about Partick Thistle and had respect for the club which you would expect from them. If as expected Ashford signs then it will be in no small part to Tiffoney who has been recommending us.

we didn’t even sit down and offer them new contracts on less money I might add until it was far far too late.  Though we know now that the club had no money 

Shoukd we accuse Lawless, Erskine, Paton, Lindsay etc because they all left for more money.’

I'll stand corrected re. Turner, if there was no PCA, at least until after the play-offs. I certainly wasn't listening to any tittle tattle and was going from memory, which hasn't served me too well it seems.

For the record, I think they are both fine players and done a great job for Thistle overall.

I find PCA's entirely disrespectful, due to the emotional impact they have on the player.

I believe Tiff was affected at times and I remember having discussions at the time about some of his decision making towards the end of the play-offs.

I might not like it but I'll never criticise a player for leaving when more money is involved.

Cheque book loyalty is all we are left with unfortunately.

 

[partickthedog]

2 hours ago, Lenziejag said:

I might be mistaken, but I am sure all 3(Fitzpatrick, Tiffoney and Lawless) were starting at the end of the season. Turner would also be a cert to start.

Exactly. I agree that all 4 could start with Fitzy and Lawless wide, Tiffoney Number 10 and Turner playing deeper midfield (though of course he could also play Number 10). What I was trying to say (also agreeing with LIB's original post) is that we do already have plenty of other reasonable starting options in deeper midfield and Number 10, and therefore it is not a priority. To me the additional wide option is more of a priority as this would help us both as regards direct attacking and also assisting the defence in providing more of a counter-attacking goal threat later in the game (a department in which we are currently deficient). 

Still, to go back to where I started, this is almost certainly an academic debate as neither Tiff nor Turner is likely to return on loan in January, although depending on lots of other factors, I could see either or both of them returning to Firhill in years to come.

[Fearchar]

If Mitchell, for whatever reason, isn't up to scratch between the sticks, then the priority has to be a reliable goalkeer. A defence can be built to cope with a poor goalkeeper, but not an inconsistent one. Sneddon's slips eat at any confidence among defenders.

[exiledjag]

I raised the question about Tiffoney and Turner bring possible loan acquisitions solely because they were very good players for us under Doolan and are not certain starters at their clubs. I also asked would we want them back not because of anything to do with the manner of their leaving or doubts about their commitment but solely because of the squad we have and whether their return would create and overload of midfield and wide players.

I agree a defensive midfielder is a priority but I would have Tiffoney and Turner (and Holt, not sure about Docherty) back in a jiffy!!

[Jaggernaut]

9 minutes ago, Fearchar said:

If Mitchell, for whatever reason, isn't up to scratch between the sticks, then the priority has to be a reliable goalkeer. A defence can be built to cope with a poor goalkeeper, but not an inconsistent one. Sneddon's slips eat at any confidence among defenders.

Aw naw, you've reminded me of last night's nightmare: I was listening to the upcoming game at Tannadice, we were 1-0 with 10 minutes to go, then Sneddon make some kind of almost unbelievable blunder for their equalizer. And then..... yep, they got a second with 2 minutes to go.

But I don't believe in premonitory dream stuff, so hope that Jamie will have next to nothing to do, and what he does have to do he'll do well!

[Barney Rubble]

1 hour ago, exiledjag said:

I raised the question about Tiffoney and Turner bring possible loan acquisitions solely because they were very good players for us under Doolan and are not certain starters at their clubs. I also asked would we want them back not because of anything to do with the manner of their leaving or doubts about their commitment but solely because of the squad we have and whether their return would create and overload of midfield and wide players.

I agree a defensive midfielder is a priority but I would have Tiffoney and Turner (and Holt, not sure about Docherty) back in a jiffy!!

Docherty's been the biggest loss out of the four of them.

Many are now beginning to realise that his dirty work on the ball, and more importantly the cover he provided off the ball has been a glaring omission from our play this season.

Edited December 27, 2023 by Barney Rubble

[Dick Dastardly]

6 hours ago, exiledjag said:

I raised the question about Tiffoney and Turner bring possible loan acquisitions solely because they were very good players for us under Doolan and are not certain starters at their clubs. I also asked would we want them back not because of anything to do with the manner of their leaving or doubts about their commitment but solely because of the squad we have and whether their return would create and overload of midfield and wide players.

I agree a defensive midfielder is a priority but I would have Tiffoney and Turner (and Holt, not sure about Docherty) back in a jiffy!!

Why do we have to go back to former players ? There are others. Move on.

Turner and Tiffoney we don’t need. They are not positions where we have a problem. Scoring and creating goals is not our issue. We need players at the other end.

[Lenziejag]

6 hours ago, exiledjag said:

I raised the question about Tiffoney and Turner bring possible loan acquisitions solely because they were very good players for us under Doolan and are not certain starters at their clubs. I also asked would we want them back not because of anything to do with the manner of their leaving or doubts about their commitment but solely because of the squad we have and whether their return would create and overload of midfield and wide players.

I agree a defensive midfielder is a priority but I would have Tiffoney and Turner (and Holt, not sure about Docherty) back in a jiffy!!

If you saw Dundee Utd stats with and without Docherty playing, I think you might change your mind. 

[Third Lanark]

2 hours ago, Dick Dastardly said:

Why do we have to go back to former players ? There are others. Move on.

Turner and Tiffoney we don’t need. They are not positions where we have a problem. Scoring and creating goals is not our issue. We need players at the other end.

If they are very useful former players then we can certainly do with them back.  Far from certain likes of Robinson, McDonald etc are good enough or can remian injury free enough.  Keven Ker McInroy blows very hot and cold in games and i am not convinced is a step up from Turner

[partickthedog]

Very surprised that Cammy Smith is not in this conversation.

[BowenBoys]

3 hours ago, Lenziejag said:

If you saw Dundee Utd stats with and without Docherty playing, I think you might change your mind. 

Indeed. A DU fan posted on P&B; 25/27 points with Docherty; 9/21 without.

[laukat]

We definitely miss Docherty so a CDM is a must. Not keen on the idea of Neilson playing as CDM as whilst he's a good player and strong tackler he's not the organiser or leader we need in front of the defence.

Chic Charnley was at the hospitality on Saturday and he reckoned Turner was our best player and the one he would have kept. As Turner can pretty much play anywhere in midfield perhaps he might be more of a leader in midfield and the most able to fill Docherty's shoes?

The other thing we miss is pace. Last season when we had Tiffoney and Fitzpatrick on the park in the playoffs we had pace that scared most teams supplemented with guile in Lawless.

If Tiffoney was available I would have him back in a heartbeat. If he's not available we need to try and find another quick winger/forward as McDonald clearly is not the answer.