lady-isobel-barnett Posted June 22, 2023 Report Share Posted June 22, 2023 We'll so much for everyone getting behind Kris Doolan. Clearly some folk appear to be thinking he's lost the plot. Squandering his first player budget evidently? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunnikierjag Posted June 22, 2023 Report Share Posted June 22, 2023 4 minutes ago, lady-isobel-barnett said: We'll so much for everyone getting behind Kris Doolan. Clearly some folk appear to be thinking he's lost the plot. Squandering his first player budget evidently? Who said that, are we not allowed to question what is going on. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Third Lanark Posted June 22, 2023 Report Share Posted June 22, 2023 1 hour ago, Garscube Road End 2 said: As rumoured, that these players were offered lesser terms from their old contract, then it is obvious they would turn it down. We have to face the fact that the previous board left us in a financial mess and we now have to within our means, which quite frankly are not big. If Bannigan and Sneddon were offered higher wages (don’t know if they were mind you) but to still offer reduced wages to the others would have been shocking Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Third Lanark Posted June 22, 2023 Report Share Posted June 22, 2023 18 minutes ago, lady-isobel-barnett said: We'll so much for everyone getting behind Kris Doolan. Clearly some folk appear to be thinking he's lost the plot. Squandering his first player budget evidently? Everybody is behind him but as it’s a forum you can have opinions on whether you agree with the contracts or not. As you know I personally don’t think Banzo should have got a second year or we needed 3 goalkeepers (though it may depend if we do loan one out) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laukat Posted June 22, 2023 Report Share Posted June 22, 2023 I think some of the concerns over our financial position and how its relates to our recruitment are a bit over stated. Whilst we overspent considerably last year that doesn't mean we are only able to have a squad of 14 players or that we fill the gaps with loans or kids. We had to get it confirmed from Holt, Docherty and Turner that they were leaving because even with reduced offers had they accepted they would still be consuming a sizeable chunk of the budget. Likewise we had to get confirmation of which players were willing to extend their contracts to understand what gaps there are in the squad and what budget remains to fill it. Now they have confirmed they are leaving that should release that budget to make offers to new players. The money offered to Holt, Docherty and Turner should be available to get at least 3 decent signings. We need about another 7 or 8 signings. We have 11 players who have left. That should mean we can reduce some cost but still make the signings we need. One of the other side effects of the overspending was it meant we were recruiting earlier that other teams in our league. So last season McCall had signed the bulk of his squad before the likes of Dundee and Queens Park before the season started. This season we can't do the same. We can't compete with Dundee United, Queens Park or Dunfermline and will be working in the same market as Raith, Ayr, Morton and ICT. We will need to wait until the clubs with the bigger budgets fill their squads before the players we are hoping to get will accept our terms which is normal, last season was not normal. The time to judge recruitment and if the squad is good enough to compete for top 4 is going to be after we make our new signings as opposed to extending existing contracts. Doolan already has already got 8 or 9 of a very decent starting 11 signed up. If he manages to find 2 or 3 good ones and another 2 or 3 reasonable ones we will be in decent shape. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Third Lanark Posted June 22, 2023 Report Share Posted June 22, 2023 1 minute ago, laukat said: I think some of the concerns over our financial position and how its relates to our recruitment are a bit over stated. Whilst we overspent considerably last year that doesn't mean we are only able to have a squad of 14 players or that we fill the gaps with loans or kids. We had to get it confirmed from Holt, Docherty and Turner that they were leaving because even with reduced offers had they accepted they would still be consuming a sizeable chunk of the budget. Likewise we had to get confirmation of which players were willing to extend their contracts to understand what gaps there are in the squad and what budget remains to fill it. Now they have confirmed they are leaving that should release that budget to make offers to new players. The money offered to Holt, Docherty and Turner should be available to get at least 3 decent signings. We need about another 7 or 8 signings. We have 11 players who have left. That should mean we can reduce some cost but still make the signings we need. One of the other side effects of the overspending was it meant we were recruiting earlier that other teams in our league. So last season McCall had signed the bulk of his squad before the likes of Dundee and Queens Park before the season started. This season we can't do the same. We can't compete with Dundee United, Queens Park or Dunfermline and will be working in the same market as Raith, Ayr, Morton and ICT. We will need to wait until the clubs with the bigger budgets fill their squads before the players we are hoping to get will accept our terms which is normal, last season was not normal. The time to judge recruitment and if the squad is good enough to compete for top 4 is going to be after we make our new signings as opposed to extending existing contracts. Doolan already has already got 8 or 9 of a very decent starting 11 signed up. If he manages to find 2 or 3 good ones and another 2 or 3 reasonable ones we will be in decent shape. I’m not convinced we can compete with Raith either Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laukat Posted June 22, 2023 Report Share Posted June 22, 2023 Just now, Third Lanark said: I’m not convinced we can compete with Raith either Raith have made a couple of decent signings such as Jack Hamilton and Josh Mullin. However they won't be cheap so will the be able to compete with us for the central defenders we both desperately need? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunnikierjag Posted June 22, 2023 Report Share Posted June 22, 2023 3 minutes ago, laukat said: I think some of the concerns over our financial position and how its relates to our recruitment are a bit over stated. Whilst we overspent considerably last year that doesn't mean we are only able to have a squad of 14 players or that we fill the gaps with loans or kids. We had to get it confirmed from Holt, Docherty and Turner that they were leaving because even with reduced offers had they accepted they would still be consuming a sizeable chunk of the budget. Likewise we had to get confirmation of which players were willing to extend their contracts to understand what gaps there are in the squad and what budget remains to fill it. Now they have confirmed they are leaving that should release that budget to make offers to new players. The money offered to Holt, Docherty and Turner should be available to get at least 3 decent signings. We need about another 7 or 8 signings. We have 11 players who have left. That should mean we can reduce some cost but still make the signings we need. One of the other side effects of the overspending was it meant we were recruiting earlier that other teams in our league. So last season McCall had signed the bulk of his squad before the likes of Dundee and Queens Park before the season started. This season we can't do the same. We can't compete with Dundee United, Queens Park or Dunfermline and will be working in the same market as Raith, Ayr, Morton and ICT. We will need to wait until the clubs with the bigger budgets fill their squads before the players we are hoping to get will accept our terms which is normal, last season was not normal. The time to judge recruitment and if the squad is good enough to compete for top 4 is going to be after we make our new signings as opposed to extending existing contracts. Doolan already has already got 8 or 9 of a very decent starting 11 signed up. If he manages to find 2 or 3 good ones and another 2 or 3 reasonable ones we will be in decent shape. I want to hear from the board the expectations for next season, the silence is deafening. I am firmly behind Doolan but we all know the crowds we had at the playoffs will not come to watch a relegation struggle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodstock Jag Posted June 22, 2023 Report Share Posted June 22, 2023 Some absolutely hysterical nonsense in here. I’m going to guess that not a single poster in this thread knows what amount of money was offered by Thistle and by other Clubs for players like Docherty, Holt and Turner, or how much it differs from what they were on last season. I’m going to guess that the same number of posters knows how different the deals signed by Bannigan, Muirhead and Sneddon are in money terms compared to their previous deals too. Its blatantly obvious that Thistle aren’t going to just sit there with three keepers in the first team squad, having one of them doing absolutely nothing all year. Away and have a lie down and by all means start expressing concerns about the strength and depth of the squad once we actually have even the faintest idea what it looks like. 7 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted June 22, 2023 Report Share Posted June 22, 2023 45 minutes ago, dunnikierjag said: Who said that, are we not allowed to question what is going on. Nobody that I'm aware of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeanieD Posted June 22, 2023 Report Share Posted June 22, 2023 I fear this has the potential to descend into the time honoured "happy clappy" v. "doom-mongers" bitch-fest. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laukat Posted June 22, 2023 Report Share Posted June 22, 2023 28 minutes ago, dunnikierjag said: I want to hear from the board the expectations for next season, the silence is deafening. I am firmly behind Doolan but we all know the crowds we had at the playoffs will not come to watch a relegation struggle. One of the problems of Jlow's boards was we got statements that were so full of overblown expectations that it would have put Comical Ali to shame. The statements from the board and TJF which were only issued 15 days ago have so been refreshing in their honesty. I bought a season ticket this year for the first time in over 30 years off the back of the honesty of those statements and to my mind they have allowed the club to rapidly re-baseline. The statement that followed the next day suggests the club saw increased uptake following those statements. The last statement form the current board was only 2 weeks ago so I'm not we can really accuse them of deafening silence. I don't know of too many Thistle fans who are expecting that we are going to challenge for the title this season. Most appear to believe the upcoming season is about consolidation with the hope of making the playoffs and the fear that we may get dragged into the playoff at the wrong end of the table. Personally I think we have the basis of a squad that should be in contention for top 4 but until we see what else we recruit and what other teams recruit I will reserve judgement. I also don't expect the Board to issue statements on their expectations for Kris Doolan to achieve as that would just place unnecessary pressure on a very inexperienced manager. If they are to release any statement it should be about what they have budgeted for which I expect to be more like pre-Jlow budgets were we assumed no cup runs and finishing no higher than 8th. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lenziejag Posted June 22, 2023 Report Share Posted June 22, 2023 2 hours ago, dunnikierjag said: Thanks GRE but not buying it surely getting rid of 4 high earners would have been enough to keep Holt, in fact Brownlies wages to Holt would have been enough. We can’t go into a new season with this mindset. Time to hear from the board, stop asking people to buy season tickets until they know what they are buying into. As far as the re signings are concerned, I think it is fairly logical that these have been done first. Now Doolan can get on with replacing the 6 or 7 he needs to bring the squad up to strength. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiThistle Posted June 22, 2023 Report Share Posted June 22, 2023 3 hours ago, JeanieD said: I fear this has the potential to descend into the time honoured "happy clappy" v. "doom-mongers" bitch-fest. As long as each can field a full side! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagfox Posted June 23, 2023 Report Share Posted June 23, 2023 13 hours ago, Third Lanark said: Queens Park have signed Ruaridh Paton. someone we should have been looking to sign. Maybe we were but would have preferred any money for Bannigans second year or money spent on signing a not really required third goalkeeper has went to that I'm no accountant but I'm sure the second year of Bannigan's contract will have zero impact on this year's playing budget 🤣 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted June 23, 2023 Report Share Posted June 23, 2023 12 hours ago, dunnikierjag said: I want to hear from the board the expectations for next season, the silence is deafening. I am firmly behind Doolan but we all know the crowds we had at the playoffs will not come to watch a relegation struggle. The one thing that is always consistent is that we never hear from our board on pretty much most things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dl1971 Posted June 23, 2023 Report Share Posted June 23, 2023 Nothing wrong with a bit of speculation. But to echo some of the comments above it was fairly obvious we deal with the players out of contract first.....then we move on to new signings. Patience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dl1971 Posted June 23, 2023 Report Share Posted June 23, 2023 25 minutes ago, javeajag said: The one thing that is always consistent is that we never hear from our board on pretty much most things. What is it you expect the board or manager to say? The expectation I would hazard to guess is that we aim to finish as high as possible. I doubt they will say " due to our budget issues we will be relegation fodder " For the record I think we will be fine. Pure speculation of course :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Third Lanark Posted June 23, 2023 Report Share Posted June 23, 2023 1 hour ago, jagfox said: I'm no accountant but I'm sure the second year of Bannigan's contract will have zero impact on this year's playing budget 🤣 When Ian McCall extended Grahams, Bannigan and DOchertys contracts by 2 years a couple of years ago he did say at the time if affected the immediate budget as well - i guessed it would be a similar situation with this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaggy Posted June 23, 2023 Report Share Posted June 23, 2023 22 minutes ago, Third Lanark said: When Ian McCall extended Grahams, Bannigan and DOchertys contracts by 2 years a couple of years ago he did say at the time if affected the immediate budget as well - i guessed it would be a similar situation with this Maybe they got wage rises at the time? None of us really know the situation with contacts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted June 23, 2023 Report Share Posted June 23, 2023 2 minutes ago, Third Lanark said: When Ian McCall extended Grahams, Bannigan and DOchertys contracts by 2 years a couple of years ago he did say at the time if affected the immediate budget as well - i guessed it would be a similar situation with this That depends if for instance there's a signing on (re-signing on) fee involved or some other one off payment (re-location etc). More realistically, but again completely speculative, but a two year contract may amount to less than twice a one year contract offered to an individual, especially if the player in question is heading towards the end of his career. Lower the transfer trigger clause amount for year two and both club & player are content. All I'm trying to do tho' is emphasise Woodstock's points in his recent post. Mainly the devil is in the detail re contracts etc. But I also agree with another poster that this is a forum and discussing the merits of signings etc is completely normal. Just in my mind it shouldn't be taken as an exact science. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlsarmy Posted June 23, 2023 Report Share Posted June 23, 2023 Kevin Holt signs for Dundee Utd Good Luck with that one being an ex Dundee player ! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted June 23, 2023 Report Share Posted June 23, 2023 3 hours ago, dl1971 said: What is it you expect the board or manager to say? The expectation I would hazard to guess is that we aim to finish as high as possible. I doubt they will say " due to our budget issues we will be relegation fodder " For the record I think we will be fine. Pure speculation of course 🙂 I have no expectation of them saying anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambies Lost Doo Posted June 23, 2023 Report Share Posted June 23, 2023 Holt could play in the top keague easy. That's Dundee Utd splashing the cash. I dislike them very much. 1 hour ago, jlsarmy said: Kevin Holt signs for Dundee Utd Good Luck with that one being an ex Dundee player ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAG1970 Posted June 23, 2023 Report Share Posted June 23, 2023 Graham extends until 2025…. maybe that’s linked to the management of the ladies team cos I can’t see him playing 90 mins every week for the remainder of 2023 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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