stillresigned Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 It's really difficult to try and retain a sense of prortion when all around you tw8ts like Doncaster andrags like the Daily Ranger are regularly commiting crimes against common sense and fair play. Nonetheless, it is important that we retain a sense of reality amidst what is becoming daily an avalache of news speak. What we are seeing is the inevitable outcome of an overmighty subject i.e. Rangers being accussed of having no clothes. Further, it is a vindication of the late Desmond White views on television and football. I find it difficult to credit that a footballing body would be so lacking in legal acumen as to allow a broadcaster to have a virtual veto on its member clubs. Make no mistake thats what we have in Scotland, to add to al our other problems, football is now de facto the property of Skt/ESPN. We obviously have no need for concern then i've got to say that I have very little faith in the governance of Scottish football at all levels and a similar level of trust in any Murdoch front company. Anyone for tennis? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bunny Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 There's been the odd exception. I came across this (slightly dated) article today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan100 Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 There's been the odd exception. I came across this (slightly dated) article today. Good article. Weren't Blessed Wattie and Supersally employed at Castle Greyskull when all of these allegedly dodgy contracts were introduced? Unless they were walking around in a dream or talk to players, directors etc how could they have missed them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norgethistle Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 There's been the odd exception. I came across this (slightly dated) article today. Â The comments from the Rangers fans sums it all up, its still apparently a conspiracy, and they should print the truth. Untill the big pad lock goes on the gates in Edminston Drive and Spartans take RFC place in the leagues these guys will never beleive anything is wrong Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyconnor Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 rangers will be in the SPL next season with very little punishment. as someone else pointed out the TV companies pull the strings, and the fans/morality are way down the list of priorites unfortunately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stillresigned Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 Agaist mt better judgement I tried to watch the Motherwell game on ESPN, apart from being an un-shamed Hunfest the coverage left me in no doubt as to who the real victims in this sorry saga are. That of course is the poor innocent Rangers support duped by (Sir) David Murray into accepting all that horrid success. Every time that I consider myself too hard on them, up pops the Scottish establishment to remind me why I hate them and evryything they represent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Endell Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 "Member clubs are mindful of a sporting integrity aspect but the commercial benefits outweigh that." Â Michael Johnston. Â Why bother playing games? Just take bungs instead. Â The SPL is an absolute cesspit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norgethistle Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 "Member clubs are mindful of a sporting integrity aspect but the commercial benefits outweigh that."  Michael Johnston.  Why bother playing games? Just take bungs instead.  The SPL is an absolute cesspit.  His treatment of his own ST holders to make way for celtics party summed him up, Killie fans are going off their head at him  Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 Something I wonder about. The SPL chairmen vote to keep rangers in the league. They can't sign players, all their current players leave because the wages are not there and so end up at the bottom of the league next season with a youth team. Will the chairman of the second bottom club volunteer to get relegated? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrD Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 (edited) yeah, seems we are at a consensus that scottish football getting better is unthinkable, yet the attachment to the status quo, that is the problem, prevents people from seeing the reasonableness of ptfc joining english football. its not just the benificiaries that are the problem its the people that still turn up and play a part of scottish football that are just as much a part of the problem. if people are too stupid to participate even despite the manifest fckedness of scottish football they almost deserved getting pumped for it... Edited May 5, 2012 by mrD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Incognito Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 we have been for years!. we are just about to let rangers back into spl with no debt scot free. the games a bogey up here. we are all clyde!!! Â Too true. The fact that Rangers Newco looks likely to be accepted back in to the SPL is absolutely sickening. I totally understand where you are coming from; we are banging our heads against a glass ceiling here. The people who are running our game are doing it for the wrong reasons. Everything centres around the fecking TV deal. Â As a Scotland supporter and a Scottish nationalist the idea of a UK national team and a UK league is about as palatable to me as ... well, the UK itself. But the current English pyramid system shines like a beacon of corinthian scrupulousness in comparison to the clannish, I'll-scratch-your-back, closed shop cesspit that is Scottish football in 2012. Big business pulls the strings in England as well, particularly at the top of the tree, but at least under their system the wee clubs at the bottom have a fair shot at reaching that top branch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrD Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 (edited) Too true. The fact that Rangers Newco looks likely to be accepted back in to the SPL is absolutely sickening. I totally understand where you are coming from; we are banging our heads against a glass ceiling here. The people who are running our game are doing it for the wrong reasons. Everything centres around the fecking TV deal. Â As a Scotland supporter and a Scottish nationalist the idea of a UK national team and a UK league is about as palatable to me as ... well, the UK itself. But the current English pyramid system shines like a beacon of corinthian scrupulousness in comparison to the clannish, I'll-scratch-your-back, closed shop cesspit that is Scottish football in 2012. Big business pulls the strings in England as well, particularly at the top of the tree, but at least under their system the wee clubs at the bottom have a fair shot at reaching that top branch. Â ive always been pro independance not for any nationalist reasons but because i like the idea of power being localised as much as possible. i was going to vote for independance in this referendum coming up, but now im not so sure. whether its healthy or not, football is probably the most significant cultural force in scottish society, and for me whats going on is a litmus test as to how grown up a nation we are. Are we going to handle this huge situation like a mature democracy would do, where the rule of law stands forth strong, irrespective of what sectional interest group is trying to distort it, or are we going to cave in like a fiefdom of crony capitalism? Â For me this rangers case is the litmus test of how grown up we are as a potental nation state, and it looks like we are falling by the wayside. if we cant handle something as relativly meaningless as football, how can this society be expected to deal with more important matters. Alex thompsons stuff about scotland has been an exposure of how much of an inward redneck nation we are. as things are going i will not be voting for independance, and i will be urging others around me to take the same decision Edited May 5, 2012 by mrD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McKennan Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 On Your Call earlier, Jim Traynor was struggling to see the join between Rangers getting a free ride back to the SPL and fans of other teams not going to watch their clubs. Â Simple - the only way the SPL could do more for a Rangers newco would be to award it a 30-point start every season and demand that other clubs field nine players against it. Â What a message to send to football fans - spend your money with us but expect the footballing equivalent of Pickett's Charge every week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 ive always been pro independance not for any nationalist reasons but because i like the idea of power being localised as much as possible. i was going to vote for independance in this referendum coming up, but now im not so sure. whether its healthy or not, football is probably the most significant cultural force in scottish society, and for me whats going on is a litmus test as to how grown up a nation we are. Are we going to handle this huge situation like a mature democracy would do, where the rule of law stands forth strong, irrespective of what sectional interest group is trying to distort it, or are we going to cave in like a fiefdom of crony capitalism?  For me this rangers case is the litmus test of how grown up we are as a potental nation state, and it looks like we are falling by the wayside. if we cant handle something as relativly meaningless as football, how can this society be expected to deal with more important matters. Alex thompsons stuff about scotland has been an exposure of how much of an inward redneck nation we are. as things are going i will not be voting for independance, and i will be urging others around me to take the same decision  Oh c'mon, Mr. D. Every nation unfortunately has its corruptions and its governments' hands tied by capitalism. Just look at cash for questions at Westminster. Just look at how they claimed to the world that an "historic agreement" for a GB team had been made with the SFA: a monumental lie to the entire world. Is that how a "grown up" state behaves? The h u n s debacle and what the SPL do cannot be blamed on (or used as a reason to vote against) Scottish nationhood. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McKennan Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 Tonight we're a-talkin' high, high, high fi-nance down at Bill Miller's place. Â Drive careful now, y'all hear? Â Â Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winter of '63 Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 Great line by someone on Pie & Bovril - "Turkeys vote for a different recipe of stuffing mix" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stillresigned Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 Oh c'mon, Mr. D. Every nation unfortunately has its corruptions and its governments' hands tied by capitalism. Just look at cash for questions at Westminster. Just look at how they claimed to the world that an "historic agreement" for a GB team had been made with the SFA: a monumental lie to the entire world. Is that how a "grown up" state behaves? The h u n s debacle and what the SPL do cannot be blamed on (or used as a reason to vote against) Scottish nationhood. I'm afraid I disagree, the social prominence of football to a certain degree means that it does significantly reflect the prevailing mores of Scottish society. The inability of the Scottish footballing authorities to deal equtably with the conduct of Rangers does not in my view assist those of us who support independence. Instead, it raises questions about Scotlands political matuirity and whether Scotland can escape the shacles of the past. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 John Lambie Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 Something I wonder about. The SPL chairmen vote to keep rangers in the league. They can't sign players, all their current players leave because the wages are not there and so end up at the bottom of the league next season with a youth team. Will the chairman of the second bottom club volunteer to get relegated? Â The SPL will suddenly decide that a larger league is just what Scotland needs...hence no relegation. Guaranteed to happen, I doubt rangers will finish bottom, they'll get off virtually scot free after appeals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bunny Posted May 5, 2012 Report Share Posted May 5, 2012 (edited) I'm afraid I disagree, the social prominence of football to a certain degree means that it does significantly reflect the prevailing mores of Scottish society. The inability of the Scottish footballing authorities to deal equtably with the conduct of Rangers does not in my view assist those of us who support independence. Instead, it raises questions about Scotlands political matuirity and whether Scotland can escape the shacles of the past. Â Well all this developed under the union, and from what you're saying has continued and will continue under the union, so surely that makes it a bad advert for maintaining the union. Maybe we need independence as a kick up the arse to make people want to change things. Edited May 6, 2012 by Mr Bunny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sigesige00 Posted May 6, 2012 Report Share Posted May 6, 2012 The SPL will suddenly decide that a larger league is just what Scotland needs...hence no relegation. Guaranteed to happen, I doubt rangers will finish bottom, they'll get off virtually scot free after appeals. Â I think that that would be a good thing. A 16-team SPL would be more attractive, and we can win promotion and survive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted May 6, 2012 Report Share Posted May 6, 2012 The SPL will suddenly decide that a larger league is just what Scotland needs...hence no relegation. Guaranteed to happen, I doubt rangers will finish bottom, they'll get off virtually scot free after appeals. Listening to the radio yesterday and reading a few sporting clips here and there a lot of people seemed shocked to think that Johnston and other SPL chairmen will put finances ahead of sporting integrity. I find it hard to believe that so many football fans are just coming round to realise this. Is it not well over 80% of fans want league reconstruction? Yet most surely know that finances (again TV driven) trump sporting integrity. Â In a twisted sort of way the SPL, if you believe their very existence is to maximise turnover if necessary to the detriment of football in general, appear quite correct inviting a rangers newco into their fold. The SPL chairmen will weigh up the likely cost of dissatisfaction within their fanbase against the loss to income if the newco is sent packing. Clearly the loss of rangers is projected to be the greater. Stuff the fans, they'll come round eventually. Â My point is that Scottish football shouldn't be run and held to ransom by a handful of club bosses whose first concern will naturally always be to their own club finances. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junior Posted May 6, 2012 Report Share Posted May 6, 2012 You are potenitally looking at a death spiral for Scottish football with this decision (well the SPL anyway). Â No punishment then a lot of fans will not bother going back (prob fewer than are saying they will but there will be a decent %) , then you will have fans boycotting games involving any newco Rangers. You have the h*ns boycotting everyone and everything that isnt one of the peepul, then you will have the other arse cheek joining in as theydont want to be out done by the other side. Â Massive decision for the SPL , I think they will fudge it and put conditions about accepting the EBT case findings (which has the potential for them to be kicked out football all together) in return for no other SPL sanctions. Then up step the SFA to boot them in the sack while they are all jumping around celebrating by confirming the year long signing ban and fine (and maybe adding more on for good measure). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guy Incognito Posted May 6, 2012 Report Share Posted May 6, 2012 I'm afraid I disagree, the social prominence of football to a certain degree means that it does significantly reflect the prevailing mores of Scottish society. The inability of the Scottish footballing authorities to deal equtably with the conduct of Rangers does not in my view assist those of us who support independence. Instead, it raises questions about Scotlands political matuirity and whether Scotland can escape the shacles of the past. Â This is maybe going a wee bit off topic now but I think the football authorities in Scotland would be looking at the Rangers situation far more scrupulously if they weren't shit-scared by the possibility of losing out on TV revenue. Jaggernaut is right: the SFA's crass decision making has nothing to do with Scotland's constitutional position and everything to do capitalism calling the shots; and that's something all western democracies bow to in one way or another. For instance, look at the dodgy dealings that go on in Italian football and think how long have they been an independent nation. Â Mr Bunny has touched on it already but the bigotry and raw hatred that fuels the OF - which, in turn, fuels the derby that dictates the very structure of the Scottish game - manifested itself under the union. Maintaining the status quo won't resolve that particular issue, IMHO. What resolves the football issue I am not quite sure of though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stillresigned Posted May 6, 2012 Report Share Posted May 6, 2012 This is maybe going a wee bit off topic now but I think the football authorities in Scotland would be looking at the Rangers situation far more scrupulously if they weren't shit-scared by the possibility of losing out on TV revenue. Jaggernaut is right: the SFA's crass decision making has nothing to do with Scotland's constitutional position and everything to do capitalism calling the shots; and that's something all western democracies bow to in one way or another. For instance, look at the dodgy dealings that go on in Italian football and think how long have they been an independent nation. Â Mr Bunny has touched on it already but the bigotry and raw hatred that fuels the OF - which, in turn, fuels the derby that dictates the very structure of the Scottish game - manifested itself under the union. Maintaining the status quo won't resolve that particular issue, IMHO. What resolves the football issue I am not quite sure of though. I feel that any decision about proffesional sport will always be taken with financial concerns playing a prominent part. What however makes Michael Johnstones comment particularly cringeworthy, is that he effectively says that Rangers can do whatever they want and the other clubs have no alternative but to meekly accept their behaviour. Its one thing being financially realistic, in my view its another entirely to accept your sole role is to act as the supporting cast for a crowd of sectarian bigots whose so called history and identity seems to involve nothing more than thinking they have a right to express vile sectarian and other abuse to all and sundry. This is totally ignored by the media in this country, or treated as an acceptable part of life. My God what kind of society do we mant to bring our children up in. And tw*ts like Jonston are exactly the sort to bang on about traditional family values! Apologies for going a bit off topic myself, but I feel sport must retain at least a figleaf of integrity and honesty or otherwhise whats the point? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted May 6, 2012 Report Share Posted May 6, 2012 This might be of interest http://www.bbc.co.uk...tland/17975018? . Sittin' on a fence? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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